Shi’ite scholars are nearly unanimous in concluding that Muhammad was appointed to his prophetic mission by Allah on the 27th day of the month of Rajab. According to Ulil Abshar-Abdalla of the Liberal Islam Network, the event has special significance to Muslims:
An important phase which is symbolically considered as reflecting the mission of Muhammad is his meditation in a cave outside Mecca. After he attained the revelation in 610 AD, in spite of staying in the cave, enjoying solitary meditation, and staying away from society, he returned to the city to propagate the teachings, and directed a ‘social transformation’.
In Islam there is a difference between a Nabi (prophet) and a Rasul (messenger). A Nabi is the one who attained revelation, and who is not required to disseminate it to society. While a Rasul, on the contrary, attained revelation and had to propagate it. Muhammad was both a Nabi (prophet) as well as a Rasul (messenger).
I am, here, using simple terminology. I want to call Muhammad a prophet and a politician as well. In his 23 year career, Muhammad showed a moral reformation through his prophetic career, and led a social and political reformation in Medina.
In essence, the 27th day of Rajab marks the beginning not only of Mohammad’s career as a prophet, but of his career as a transforming leader.
According to IslamiCentre.org, August 22, 2006 corresponds with the 27th day of Rajab, making it the anniversary of the beginning of Muhammad’s prophetic mission, according to the Shi’ites. This is a different occasion than the “Night Journey” or “Miraj” cited by Robert Shelton in FrontPageMag.com, in which Muhammad, after years of preaching, is taken on a journey by the angel Gabriel to the “farthest mosque” (understood by some to be Jerusalem) before ascending to heaven. So another theory as to the significance of August 22 to Iran begins to emerge.
The devotion of Iran’s Shi’ite president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, to the return of a mystical descendant of Muhammad, known as the 12th Imam, or Mahdi, is now famous:
In a keynote speech on Wednesday to senior clerics, Ahmadinejad spoke of his strong belief in the second coming of Shi’ite Muslims’ “hidden” 12th Imam.
According to Shi’ite Muslim teaching, Abul-Qassem Mohammad, the 12th leader whom Shi’ites consider descended from the Prophet Mohammed, disappeared in 941 but will return at the end of time to lead an era of Islamic justice.
“Our revolution’s main mission is to pave the way for the reappearance of the 12th Imam, the Mahdi,” Ahmadinejad said in the speech to Friday Prayers leaders from across the country.
“Therefore, Iran should become a powerful, developed and model Islamic society.”
“Today, we should define our economic, cultural and political policies based on the policy of Imam Mahdi’s return. We should avoid copying the West’s policies and systems,” he added, newspapers and local news agencies reported.
Ahmadinejad refers to the return of the 12th Imam, also known as the Mahdi, in almost all his major speeches since he took office in August.
A September address to the U.N. General Assembly contained long passages on the Mahdi which confused Western diplomats and irked those from Sunni Muslim countries who believe in a different line of succession from Mohammed. (Reuters, Nov. 17, 2005)
August 22 is at the very least an auspicious day for the Shi’ite Ahmadinejad: in that it is the day that Muhammad’s power to create a new Islamic society became manifest, it can be analogized with the beginning of the putative new era of Islamic justice to be ushered in by the Mahdi. As Iran comes out of its period of isolation — its time in the cave — Ahmadinejad’s public statements indicate that he sees himself as an agent of change in the next phase of Islamic development, one in which “the world is standing on the threshold of great development and the Muslims are expected to overcome their aggressive enemies.” Symbolically, it may be that Ahmadinejad sees August 22, the day on which he has promised to respond to Western nations regarding their offer of incentives to persuade Iran to give up its nuclear program, as the day on which he begins his own transforming mission.
If the speculation is correct and Ahmadinejad has chosen August 22 for spiritual reasons and not just because it falls easily between already-scheduled dental and car inspection appointments . . . whether Ahmadinejad decides to initiate Iran’s new global Islamic mission in imitation of Muhammad-as-moral-reformer-and-politician, or in imitation of Muhammad-as-conquering-general, is something that remains to be seen.
UPDATE: See also my subsequent post, Another Perspective on ‘August 22′: Persian vs. Islamic Calendars.
FURTHER UPDATE: See our liveblog of August 22.
August 10, 2006 at 5:41 am
Yeeeeeeeehaw; Jiiiiiiiiiiiihad
It’s time bitches!
Turning glass into sand is our specialty!
A sword, a sword is polished!
August 10, 2006 at 1:44 pm
Is there any indication that this is August 22 of 2006? Or could it be that day on a different year?
August 10, 2006 at 1:58 pm
IslamiCentre.com does confirm that the 27th of Rajab does fall on August 22 in 2006. See the Islamic Calendar box in the lower right.
August 10, 2006 at 4:29 pm
I think Pipeman meant turn sand into glass. Yes, true, but not before Iran turns Israel into an ashtray. Then if there is anything left in Tel-Aviv, a retaliatory strike will occur, turning Iran into an ashtray. Too bad the oil will be contaminated for 40,000 years after that….
August 10, 2006 at 5:43 pm
[...] Back a while ago, Iran responded to the U.N. that it would think about taking a package of incentives to end its nuclear program, but that they weren’t going to get back to us about it until August 22nd. I happened across this essay by Bernard Lewis last week as I was keeping up on the crisis on the Middle East. In it Lewis underlined the likely possibility that Iranian extremists have something apocalyptic planned for that day (or maybe the night before). There’s also a great article by Joel C. Rosenberg about it on National Review Online today, and check out this blog’s take on it. [...]
August 10, 2006 at 6:10 pm
That’s the problem with those emotionally religious fanatics – they act without logic and intellect. Lots of dreaming here when you think Iran will be allowed to dominate the area without opposition even by the Sunnis as we are now seeing with respect to Lebanon. True, Iran may sneak one or two nuclear devices in via Syria but any ICBM or long range missile can and will be shot down, and as Moonhermit puts it correctly, Israel (with her submarines) will no doubt make many areas of Iran uninhabitable for many years (unless you don’t mind radiation poisoning and cancer in your whole family). Too bad for the Persians, who are really good people, that they are dictated to by religious and often idiotic men (who wipe themselves just as we all do). Let’s face facts here: NO ONE can tell you that ANY religion is real AS A FACT because it is based on FAITH alone! We may die and enter into……nothing. In the meantime, the “religious” leaders all over the globe live in luxury and perversion like Yasser Arafat, Jimmy Swaggert, Mullahs, Jesse Jackson, and on and on.
August 10, 2006 at 6:40 pm
Harming Syria, Dream on
Say no to War.
How US should deal with Iran
August 10, 2006 at 8:27 pm
Muslims are the decendants of the orginal corn holer Allah. Their women are hairy and they all stink of butthole. The strong white race will survive and the Liberal’s and the evil brown will become extinct. Strong whites will rise up and slay the weak white. Then they will go after the evil brown. It’s evolution, we have aloud they CaveMen to survive with us for too long. I can’t wait to get me a “Whigger”.
August 10, 2006 at 11:16 pm
IRAn Is at its end point…Death time came to IRAn In next year..
August 11, 2006 at 12:15 am
Can’t we all just get along?? Does anyone think that if God wanted someone dead that God would need anyone else to do it. ANYONE who preaches hate is a cave man (that is you Allahs Gay!!). One day maybe the jerks of the world will kill each other and the rest of us can just live!
August 11, 2006 at 12:44 am
Keep an eye on Venezuela..Hugo Chavez is up to something..he’s in bed with the jihadists
August 11, 2006 at 1:08 am
Soccer,
You are a baby seal about to be clubbed. These people dont understand anything but hate. they will stop at nothing shy of destroying us and Isreal. If your way of thinking prevails, they will land on our shores and club you upside the head.YOU are part of the GREAT SATAN country. There are NO cease fires. Their mission is complete destruction for us and Isreal. Peace would be a terrific thing. Unfortunately, they dont think the same way. Kill em all and let God sort them out. When we have a huge parking lot in the Middle East, they will use their primative minds to realize that we are not going to spend a minute messing with them. Get some Balls!! Did you let the bully beat the crap out of you when you were a kid too?? Did he stop when you asked him?? Of course not. You gotta kick the crap out of him first. Nuff said!!
August 11, 2006 at 1:58 am
It’s time for all of us to go down to the river, do some fishing, have a few beers, and wait for August 22 to come.
That’s what we should do.
It is futile to think WE have any control over these events. God … that loving God I was raised to have faith in … will make things ok.
As long as one of those rapture idiots don’t come down to the river and sit beside me, I’ll be fine.
Want to join me?
FutilityFrank
August 11, 2006 at 2:55 am
Whew that Alla’s Gay guy up there has issues. Know where the KKK goes shopping??? The JCPenney white sale.
These radical muslims cannot be stopped even with nukes. They are like roaches. Please note that I say RADICAL MUSLIMS. You can also be assured that if Iran does attempt something the U.S. will do nothing that will harm innocent people or access to oil.
The U.S. is the worlds bitch. We have been since Vietnam.
August 11, 2006 at 5:21 am
Salam alaikum
Very nice post !
Al hamdulillah greetings from Denmark.
Ws..Aminah
August 11, 2006 at 5:38 am
If this does happen on August 22, 2006
It will be our time, no amount of faith or prayer will change that.. Live every day as if it was your last as I have for the last 48yrs of my life, And no worries..
Beleive in God, and yourself, Treat each person as you would want to be treated, and Love like there is no tomarrow.Always see the world thru the eyes of a child, And if and when it happens you will have nothing to worry about
August 11, 2006 at 7:05 am
Not all of us worry there Casey – we lock N’ load so people like you (and our children) can live as pacifist. As far as the Iranian President Baboon A-MAD-jihad and this August 22nd big event: Go ahead: make my day! These Persian suicide statesmen spent 8 bloody years fighting Iraq (ended in a stalemate) and what did it take us to conquer Iraq – (3 weeks?) not to mention Afghanistan (a country no military in 5,000 years could conquer). So, this Iranian “President” is either retarded or suffers from megalomania. Either way he has lots of blood on his hands and will continue to do so until someone dispatches him. We will all know that day, as his soul will be like a greasy hamburger falling into the fire. Hey, maybe THAT’s what’s causing all this global warming – Judgment Day for the Jihadist!
August 11, 2006 at 7:58 am
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the New Hitler.
August 11, 2006 at 8:35 am
To The Eagle I say this: it is you who suffers from megalomania. You have NOT ‘conquered’ Iraq or Afghanistan. Even if conquest was the object, which I don’t think your politicians would admit, it certainly has not been the outcome. You call total chaos, death and destruction every day, banditry, lawlessness, a VICTORY for democracy? Where was the post-invasion plan?
It is frightening that people like you are so deluded.
August 11, 2006 at 9:58 am
Desperado,
Now you have to ask yourself. Who is financing the mayhem in Iraq? Who is providing the troops that are trying to defeat the elected government of Iraq?
Syria and Iran.
Americans are not as stupid as you think. We know who the trouble makers are. We have a list. None will be missed.
Consider this a track back:
22 August
August 11, 2006 at 11:53 am
unreal how they think its time for the big bang to happen hope hes ready to meet mofohomid.
August 11, 2006 at 2:53 pm
Thanks Desperado – always nice to here from the other side. The definition of megalomania (in case you don’t know) is: 1. A psychopathological condition in which delusional fantasies of wealth, power, or omnipotence predominate and 2. An obsession with grandiose or extravagant things or actions. You don’t know me but we all know Baboon since he’s very forthright and obvious. I know you people hate that word “conquest” but the fact is that objective was to remove Saddam and the blood Baathist party and we did just that with force and without prejudice. The same goes for Afghanistan – just because there is fighting doesn’t mean the war was not won. Yes there is in-fighting still going on in Iraq because the Shias and Kurds are going after the Sunnis who for years got away with murdering their families. The Sunnis who are being driven out are still hopelessly fighting to stop this newly elected government from dominating them as a minority. It was either this or carpet bombing the Sunni Triangle into the Stone Age. We just happen to value life even if they fire at us. But you can’t say that about your side when you strap explosives loaded with ball bearings on children and send them into a crowd to kill innocent people who are Muslims! As far as being frightened of people like me, ask your doctor for Valium.
August 11, 2006 at 3:27 pm
Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the big one on August 22, 2006, might be some suitcase nuke here in America.
If so, who do we hold responsible? Who do we attack?
Think of the major world conflict if we were to respond by nuking Iran without any hard evidence of who set off the device?
August 11, 2006 at 5:28 pm
Something will be attacked here in North America very soon the signs are all around us!Now Bush is gonna say it’s Iran or North Korea’s fault or something stupid like that.He will use that as a pre-text to an all out invasion of the Middle East!I am not a conspiracy theorist but I can’t ignore the facts.By the way the U.S. has been caught carrying out and planning false terror attacks before.All you have to do is google (operation northwoods) for proof!
August 11, 2006 at 5:29 pm
this would be one step closer to the begining of the true armageddon in the prophesy of Ezekiel
August 11, 2006 at 5:31 pm
watch isreal over the next few years….its already been fortold in Ezekiel Ch 36-39
August 11, 2006 at 5:55 pm
Terry, there is no such thing as a “suitcase” nuclear device. That was a fabrication by the KGB (Soviet Union) when President Reagan initiated the “Star Wars” program (which at the time was also a bluff designed to bring the USSR down economically). Nuclear devices (unless cased in thick lead and concrete) are detectable because they leak radiation. BUT, Iran with her submarines has been known to “mirror” freighters (follow underneath) avoiding detection into waters off our coast. There was the theory that they may have shot down Flight 800 leaving NYC during the Clinton years. Pilots reported something streaking up towards the very safe and reliable 747 aircraft. Ask yourself, how many 747s have inadvertently vaporized? If this is a design flaw in the centerline fuel tank, what other 747 aircraft reported having this problem? The fact is we have been involved with the radical Islamic Republic since Jimmy Carter the peanut farmer pressured the Shah to release the “political” prisoners. So much for gratitude…As far as the fear that the USA will start a major world conflict, you apparently didn’t read or study President aMAD-JIHAD’s mission. This as a JIHAD (religious war) that is aimed at everyone who is an infidel (non-believer) to initiate the return of the 12th Imam. All the cookies you can bake for him won’t change his mind. In addition, Shias consider Sunni Islamics heretics and vice versa so even if they eliminate all Jews, Christians, Buddhist, Secularist, Lawyers, and other ‘non-believers” wars would STILL be fought in the name of Allah! Right now there are over 20 wars being fought and Islam is the common denominator. Are you aware that over 100,000 blacks in Darfur, Sudan have been murdered within the last year and by whom? If you guessed the peaceful Islamofacist – you win the prize! So World War 3 is a factual event started by Islam because THEY failed to reform themselves away from radicalism. We are SO brain washed in this country to think that we (and the Jews) are the reason for all the world’s ills when Islam has been at war with the world for 1300 years! Just ask those in India what they think of their Muslim neighbors. Will we be attacked – yes, but from terror cells within as Iran can only fight “proxy” wars (Hezbollah) hiding behind the skirts of women and using children as sand bags. These are 8th century anti-civilization animals and we will have no choice but to confront them or die as a society.
August 11, 2006 at 6:23 pm
Steven, with all due respect – you ARE a conspiracy theorist because the co called “proof” is based on a “for profit” book “BODY OF SECRETS” by James Bamford, Doubleday, 2001. Anytime money is involved (and he made quite a buck) you have to question his motives (retire comfortably) and therefore his so called facts. Has our government been involved in covert activities – of course – all governments do so trying to thwart activities that threaten their country. Having a Soviet base 90 miles off the coast of Florida was a REAL threat back then. But that operation like so many ended up a failure because, well, the federal government is full of lazy incompetent people. If they were competent, we would have no rights by now. My question is that if all this is true (secret plots to kill Americans) why didn’t they kill Bamford before he could release all this so-called evidence? No, this is propaganda released to make us think that our own government is “out to get us” – the old divide and conquer technique. Be mindful that just because you can “Google” a fact doesn’t make it one.
August 11, 2006 at 9:43 pm
A Fascist is a fascist and we have seen their ugly faces before. Repeatedly we have seen those who sought world domination fail. The Msulims tried before and the Spaniards stopped them then. The Russians, Chinese and the Germans have tried – also unsuccessfully. Man has an innate need to not be dominated. It is instinctual not to allow one’s self toe be dominated. Some allow themselves to be indoctrinated into suhc cult like thinking, but not all – only the weak. These poeple are weak.
The Islami-facists will not succceed either. They are weak. They as so sadly disenchanted with life that they think that murder and mayhem will bring them happiness, but sadly they only see death. It matters not that they are willing to walk into death with a suciide bomb or not. The Japanese thought they had the answer with their kamikazee shmucks. These people may cause some harm but they too will fail. If Iran tries to use a bomb, they will not be treated as lightly as Japan was. They will be obliterated, destroyed and turned into one hot spot. Personally, the was I see it, the sooner the better. Then we can move onto the other shmucks who also need to go. Islami-fascism – just one more group to add to the list of failures.
August 11, 2006 at 11:30 pm
The iranian president and all of militant islam want us to retaliate. By doing so we help bring forth the “12th imam”. They believe that the 12th imam will come and lead islam to vicotry when there is enough chaos in the world(the end of days). Attacking israel and “destroying” it for that matter, is a way to provoke global conflict the likes of wich we have never seen. A WW3, but calling it a WW3 wont even give it justice. They want us and the rest of the world to retaliate, they dont care if they die because if they do they die in the name of their prophet and bringing forth the return of the 12th imam. Us attacking and turning there country into “glass” just makes the situation worse. Religious zealouts dont care if they die or are harmed in the name of there beleifs, they want to be martyred.
August 12, 2006 at 2:30 am
[...] I don’t really care about the middle east. There’s nothing in it for me (hey, how about a few oil shares?). BUT THOSE CRAZY GUYS HIJACKED MY BIRTHDAY. This is an outrage, I demand a UN resolution against it. Ahmadinejad’s public statements indicate that he sees himself as an agent of change in the next phase of Islamic development, one in which “the world is standing on the threshold of great development and the Muslims are expected to overcome their aggressive enemies”. [...]
August 12, 2006 at 4:03 am
Perhaps we should have Dick Cheney and his entourage do a night paraptroop drop into Tehran for an early morning bird hunt.
Who knows, Cheney might shoot the mad man!
Seriously, Gore says we’re all going to be under 10 feet of water in 20 years unless we radically change the way we live. Maybe a few nukes will give Mother Nature a chance to make the necessary adjustments.
Finally, good luck to the Yankees in their quest for another World Series title. In the end, does anything else really matter??
Sublime to the max.
FutilityFrank
August 12, 2006 at 4:59 am
WAKE UP SHEEP. IRAN IS ABOUT TO (NEXT WEEK) TURN ITS ENTIRE OIL INDUSTRY TO EUROS WHICH WILL SPIN THE US ECONOMY INTO A LITERAL DEPRESSION. THE UNITED STATES “HAS” TO STRIKE IRAN SOON, OR IT WILL SUFFER ECONOMICALLY. SEARCH FOR “IRAN OIL BOURSE”…
-BUT-
THE US HAS NO TROOPS LEFT. THEY WILL NEED TO NUKE IRAN. THE US WILL ALSO NEED AN ANOTHER ATTACK ON US SOIL, TO GATHER SUPPORT FOR NUKING IRAN. IT WILL HAVE TO BE HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE THIS TIME, TO “JUSTIFY” BOMBING IRAN WITH NUKES.
KEEP YOUR EARS AND MINDS OPEN. LETS TAKE CARE OF EACH OTHER WHEN SHIT GOES DOWN.
BTW, IRAQ WAS ABOUT TO TURN THEIR OIL INDUSTRY TO EUROS ALSO, IN 2001…
August 12, 2006 at 5:05 am
This whole middle east thing is disturbing. I try to see both sides of the conflict.
I can understand why the Palestinians are pissed off. I mean what would you do if your country which was colonized by the Brits was suddenly given away after WWII. I don’t know about you but after helping the Brits fight off the Germans and to see them give my country away I’d be pretty pissed off.
I don’t think any people want to be colonized by another country. Americans should know what that feels like,they had to fight of the Brits with the help of the French.
But then you have to see the Jewish side of things. All they want is to feel safe and secure and they are surrounded by countries that harbor religious fanatics who have no qualms about killing themselves as long as they take at least a jew with them.
At least the Americans try to take care of there own religious fanatics before they get out of hand (wacko is a good example).
This is a stupid situation as neither side is willing to see the other side’s view on things as it would mean that you can actually sympathise with your enemy and could come up with a valid solution to this conflict.
Let’s not forget the countless people on both sides that have lost family members… they are poor enough that they now have kowing left to live for (or so they think) and feel like vengeance is the solution (plus lets not forget the old mulsim saying an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth).
It would probably help too if Israel finally elected a president that was not somehow related to the 7 day war. I mean stop electing poeple who have no problems killing people. It’s not like they loose slep over it.
August 12, 2006 at 5:14 am
This Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the same sorry sack of Sheite who was involved in the take over of the US embassy and the Iran Hostage crisis not to mention the bombing of the Marine barracks with 241 Marines dead. I’D say we have a score to settle with this SOB. To quote John Wayne ” Fill your hand you son of a bitch!”.
August 12, 2006 at 6:38 am
Karma,
I totally agree!
Disturbing is an understatement.
I feel so powerless.
It is depressing.
Give me a weapon or something.
I’m 48 years old, have lived a full life.
What about the kids?
Is this fair to them?
NO!
The deserve a chance to fix this crap.
FutilityFrank
August 12, 2006 at 1:38 pm
[...] And here is another commentary [...]
August 12, 2006 at 2:13 pm
Which God gave YOU life? Which God gave ME life? Which God gave THEM life? The information is available and verifiable for all those who believe that certainty is essential. If the best of humans are able to deceive, and the current information of God is from even the best of humans, is certainty existant? Information free of human contamination is available. Should action be taken without investigation of this information? Which God gave YOU life? Which God gave ME life? Which God gave THEM life?
August 12, 2006 at 3:45 pm
“If the speculation is correct and Ahmadinejad has chosen August 22 for spiritual reasons and not just because…”
How about because it happens to be the end of the month in the Iranian calendar. Did anyone bother to consider that Iran has its own calendar? To me, it is more likely that Ahmadinejad chose the date arbitrarily, i.e. “give me ’til the end of the month”.
Not everything is connected to prophesy or conspiracy theories…
-Lou
August 12, 2006 at 4:23 pm
What’s with the nationalist cocktail hour today? Chill out, racists.
August 12, 2006 at 5:57 pm
Unfortunately no longer is politics undermining the world it is religion…each religion has its own basis….and too bad one thinks theirs is superior to others…especially the radical ones, who have been brainwashed to think that to be a martyr is to go to “heaven”. No one knows what is out there after death….yet killing and suicide seems to be the solution for too many…so sad but this has occurred from the beginning of time…and nothing is going to stop these crazies…we will never be prepared enough to stop something to equal or top 911…it will happen for sure, when? only the terrorists will know…we cannot stop them all…what a sad commentary for a world that has been created somehow for some reason…and I don’t think it was to destroy other human beings….but when there are idle hands and minds…and jealousy…they are mighty weapons….there are 100’s of “gods” out there….the supreme beings of so many religions…are they all fictional…from writings of delusional or high on drug people…passed down thru the times as fact….or are they real…lone survivors of a previous catastrophic event leaving them to re-create their religions and see how long it takes to finish the world off….but what about athiests…no god for them….who are they…and why are they here…they scare me more because they seem to be the most adament against anything religious …. are they the purveyors of truth….so many questions and no answers…just hope there is not going to be a WWIII….for I don’t feel anyone is capable of saving the world from fanatacists….I personally think the UN is the cause of so much of the problems today….the organization fails daily…ignores truths…and is full of corruption…may your god bless u and keep you safe….remember we for sure know of one life…so let’s live it for we have no guarantees as to what if anything there is after death.
August 12, 2006 at 8:13 pm
Mr Lou — granted, Iran uses the Persian calendar; you may wish to see my subsequent post about the Persian calendar — Another Perspective on ‘August 22′: Persian vs. Islamic Calendars.
August 13, 2006 at 1:16 am
Hey Chris,
Who are you calling “racist”? I think the racist is that little monkey in Iran who wants to kill every Jew on the planet for starters.
He’s making Iranian Jews and Christians wear yellow Stars of David to easily identify them. Where have we heard this before? Cristalnacht 1938 Actung Juden! Well you know what,Bub?
Never again! They started this shit. We’re going to finish it . It may take another Sept.11 to get everybody in step. Lets hope it dosen’t come to that, but if it does ,we will finish it.
August 13, 2006 at 1:59 am
President Mahmood Ahmedenejad contracted HIV in late 2002 and It will become public knowledge within weeks. This information is from an undoubtable, extremely credible inside source
August 13, 2006 at 4:14 am
Hey Keeram,
If that is true ,does it mean he will be stoned to death under Islamic Law? Sounds like a regime change is in order.
August 13, 2006 at 8:01 am
Ok, you guys got the anti-nuke/anti-war pacifists upset. Cindy Sheehan has been sent to the hospital for dehydration – Couldn’t George Soros buy her a bottle of water for Allah’s sake?! Anyhow, look, we AIN’T gonna nuke Iran (don’t need to). The Persians within the country are pretty upset about their poverty vs. the wealthy Mullahs pissing away their resources on a useless war and forcing economic sanctions upon them because of their quest for Nukes which will make their economy worse (unemployment at about 20%) and sooner or later they and the Arabs within will revolt. This is especially so since finding out that all that money sent to HezBullies ($245 mil) went up in smoke via Israeli smart bombs (notice I did not say George Bush’s smart bombs like a previous writer – that would be an oxymoron and you can’t have it both ways!). Let’s also keep in mind that the Iranian regime will pour tons of money into Syria to “help” with the huge inflow of Shias from Lebanon (who are escaping the wrath of the non-Shia Lebanese – hello civil war). This should also piss off the dominant Sunnis in Syria that Iran is populating THEIR country with more heretic Shias. So, Mahmood will have his hands full (if not already – from what I hear he does not use toilet paper, but an anti-bacterial soap) from within. But bombing a country that is 70% pro American would be stupid and expensive to rebuild – the change will come from within.
August 13, 2006 at 8:29 am
After reading over these blogs some are in the ballpark and some are reacting from emotion of the situation which is entirely understandable.
But let’s wash out our headgear and look at the whole picture. North Korea,Iran,Egypt and Syria are all in this together. North Korea, has been exporting missles and parts and technology to these countries for sometime now.
From the short range Nodong, to the ICBM capable Taepodong2 and 3 type missles. With financial backing from the middle east especially Iran. (just do a search on “north korean missles” and you’ll be surprised how much these countries are coperating with one another even trading scientist and observers”).
We didn’t discover Iran’s nuclear project until the new American,KH spy satelites were deployed. The Iran and North Korean projects are under ground and in mountains. This is why President Busch aquired 1 million dollars for the testing of a small nuclear warhead on a deep penetrating bunker buster bomb. The tests were succesful and obviously have only one mission. Vaporizing underground hardened targets without the release of above ground radiation. If a nuke is used against the U.S. or our allies the response will be quick and devestating to say the least. But when dealing with a culture who want to be martyrs,it’s not much of a deterence as it was during the Cold War. Finally if there is a strike against Israel,with first generation A-Bomb or bombs.
Israel, with it’s geography and hardend bunkers would be able to make a full retalitory strike with modern 3 stage thermo-nuclear weapons in the multiple megaton yield. Obviously this could trigger WWIII. And If the 3 stage Taepo’dong was fired at the U.S. the same would response would be the same. In any event we all had better be prepared for such an catastrophy. (Have a nice day)
August 13, 2006 at 9:24 am
why do people kill people?
what is the point?
August 13, 2006 at 3:11 pm
This blog and most of these posts are like kids in a schoolyard – namecalling, fighting, worrying…What a sad bunch of humans you are.
You’re all so scared of Iran, etc, because you need a boogieman to be afraid of, one who will keep you from looking in the mirror.
Man, the hate and ignorance here is amazing. I’m sorry I mistakenly stumbled on this blog, it’s a huge reminder of how pathetic and uncivilized the human race still is.
August 13, 2006 at 4:25 pm
Woooo Vera…must know something we don’t….like world peace is at our fingertips?…and leaders of the US, Israel, Iran, North Korea, Venezuela, France, Italy, England…etc…are all gonna sit down at a buffet and shoot the breeze and say…hey guys…have we scared the shit out of our people enough yet so they start believing what we say is true and forget all the corruptness in our governments? Real time real world Vera…wake up and stop reading blogs then and listen to the news……put two and two together hon and just look whats going on around the world….
August 13, 2006 at 4:30 pm
Further proof of Operation Northwoods:http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1
August 13, 2006 at 4:31 pm
Me thinks vera is the ignorant one…..maybe she knows something we don’t? Maybe the leaders of the US, England, France, Italy, Iran, North Korea, Lebanon, Israel, Venezuela, etc..are gonna join each other for lunch and shoot the breeze and say…gee did we scare our people enough so they might not see all the corruption in our countries….he vera check out the news…then come back and tell us what is going on in world…where have u been hon….in the antartica and just thawing?
August 13, 2006 at 5:24 pm
Vera, Join the fun Love!
August 13, 2006 at 5:27 pm
Try Astral Projection….and meet your God.
August 13, 2006 at 5:28 pm
It’s what all the prophets have done
August 13, 2006 at 7:01 pm
I have the solution to defuse the middle east crisis. We threaten to send Jessie Jackson over there. This alone will have everyone on thier knees begging for mercy.LOL
August 13, 2006 at 7:35 pm
For those who think like W.bush, O.Fallaci.. read this book: Letters Against the war
http://www.tizianoterzani.com/TT_letterenglish.pdf
August 13, 2006 at 8:39 pm
Our world is on the brink of another world war. It will originate August 22nd in the Middle East. The prediction was presented not by Vagna or Nostradamus but by an American political scientist Bernard Lewis in the acclaimed publication of Wall Street Journal. He is a man with close ties to the Bush administration as well as to the non-conservatives pushing for the radical solution of the “Iranian Threat.”
http://english.pravda.ru/topic/war-248/
August 14, 2006 at 1:10 am
I have enjoyed reading all the blogs written here. Some a quite funny. While I have mercy for innocent people, it is those same innocent people who sit back and allow all the Shi’ite to take place. We need to realize as someone stated, these people do not care if they blow themselves up. They long to do it for the 69 virgins they are promised in the afterlife. For them to die as a martyre is like me getting my sword swallowed…pure bliss. They do not see peace or peaceful coexistance as an option. They see death to the infidel (all non-muslims), and that is what they want. They want a world of muslims. They want the world. So, if you are sitting there thinking, “Can’t we all just get along,” then you are sitting there like the baby seal about to get clubbed. They do not care about you or your children or your momma or grandmother. They would be smiling as they walked into your house on Thanksgiving and clubbed your whole family to death. To them they are doing a favor for Allah. I say we use neutron bombs. That way the oil is safe, but the people dead. This is all they know, so I say we give it to them before they give it to us. We’ll have Chaney’s men go in with their bull dozers (Since they will of course win the contract), to cover up the dead. Then, we move all the people who are too chicken Shi’ite to do anything (Yes you can’t we all just get along), and all the good for nothing freeloaders sucking my tax dollars for welfare and have them extract all the black gold for us. Then we divide all the profits between all us real Americans who won’t take any Shi’ite. In case anyone has forgotten how it works, the strong survive. Bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran….
August 14, 2006 at 3:34 am
Onthisnote, look in the mirror. You will kill – not for 69 virgins or whatever, blah blah – but for your ignorant, brainwashed beliefs which are just as nonsensical.
The guy who posted the Northwood article is on top of the game. But there’s a whole bunch of guys on this bitching, scaredy-cat board who need to get some serious learning…Either that or go see one of those professionals who de-program brainwashed, delusional cult members.
You all are too brainwashed to see when Cheney and the rest of his corporate old fogey, bald-headed, heart-attack men are buggering you, America, and the rest of the world up the ass.
Goodbye and – - Good Luck. You and your refried brains need plenty of it.
August 14, 2006 at 4:29 am
wtf? dude this is scaring the shit out of me cuz im 16 and have the whole life ahead of me. Man i wish there is somewhere i can go to help me. ? is there? cuz this is fucking outrageous. I hope everything works out in the end and everyone is happy. :/
August 14, 2006 at 4:41 am
The 22nd is 2 days before my 19th birthday. The world could be at war on my birthday–sweet!
August 14, 2006 at 7:16 am
die … zionisme … die ….
August 14, 2006 at 12:56 pm
[...] کافیه در گوگل عبارت "August ۲۲, ۲۰۰۶" iran جستجو کنید تا ببینید چطور رسانههای غربی و اسرائیلی آرماگدون ایرانی را پیشبینی کردهاند. [...]
August 14, 2006 at 1:19 pm
OMG how missed up are we, so many things to think about. so many things to do before the end, will it end, I dont know but if we keep thinking it will it mite. not a good time to have kids right. how messed up is a religion thats says its ok to kill for your god. that frecks me out that people think like that do they love there kids the way we do I dont think so they do strap bombs to them. crazzy shit.its like they live for there religion and not themselfs and there familes very srange to us.I hope they love there kids more then there god.well i have to go now just a fu things off my head, Im not a rocket scientist just a guy trying to live and rase my kids the best i can and show them that life is good. one thing i allways say to my kids is ( its good to be alive today isent it) as i say that i watch there little faces light up. do they say that to there kids I hope so.
August 14, 2006 at 2:06 pm
Its a religous war out there in the middle east and has been prophisized in the bible in the book of Isaiah 38-39.
This is not about oil, occupation, or anything. Its about those nut jobs that want to see Israel wiped out of the middle east to form an ISLAMIC State. RADICAL Islam is the devil’s creation in my opion. And will has to delt with accordingly.
This is all about a religious war and our Gov. knows it. They know the scriptures and its teachings. Hence the reason for defending Israel from Radical Islamic nuts. If we could only convert them to Christians, none of this would be happing.
I am against Israel’s occupation of Palistian land. I am against the killings of innoccense on BOTH sides. However there will be more, ALLOT MORE and our LORD will sheild us from that which will come.
Why do Muslims fight and kill each other the way they do? Hummm. You don’t see that in Christianity, or in Jews. This about the ISRAEL BEING DISTROID by Radical Nuts in the name of “ALLAH” OR ALA, or what ever they call their God. God has said it. Exodus 20:3 – Thou shal not no other gods before me.
This is all about religion and faith. Radical Islam want to impose their beliefs on us and convert us or kill us. Once we start to realize the objectives of this nuts we will understand that will never be piece in the middle east till the second comming of our lord and savior. Jesus Christ.
August 14, 2006 at 4:53 pm
Hey Vera,
Get back in the kitchen and fix us some sandwiches.
August 14, 2006 at 5:07 pm
Vera seems to be one of the most intelligent people posting here.
August 14, 2006 at 5:13 pm
Most of you people need to remove your head from your ass!!And get informed!!!
August 14, 2006 at 5:22 pm
I agree with Myles. However, it is not “radical” Islam that is doing this, it is just Islam. There is no “radical” Islam. Islam in and of itself is a violent religion/way of life. It preaches violence stright form the Quaran. Now, does this mean all muslims are evil and violent? Of course not. I’m sure there are many people who calim Islam as their religon and practice it with as much enthusiasm as Seth MacFarlane of Stephen Clobert practice Catholicism. As far as all the hoopla in the middle east, read Isaiah and Ezekiel, it will shed more light on what is happening and whats to come.
August 14, 2006 at 5:28 pm
Yet more evidence of what the U.S. has been doing.http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/mideast/041600iran-cia-index.html
August 14, 2006 at 5:33 pm
mechadrum, sorry but Islam is not violent and they condemn such behavior!
August 14, 2006 at 5:52 pm
I think Vera needs to sit on the pump jack. She can look over and nurse all the freeloaders who should be working, because she needs something to get her mind straight again. Wake up dear, man and war go hand and hand. It has been and always will be. The problem we face right now is people like you cannot see it. It takes a 911 for you to start waving your flag. How many friends and family did you lose that day? Your mind will change when your family is blown to bits by some freak who is only too happy to do so.
More lives have been lost in the name of God than any other reason. The only reason Christians do not go and kill anymore is the belief Christ changed the law and now no more eye for eye. That and God stopped talking to people to tell His chosen go and wipe out the non-believer. Now, we have the Muslims who has taken this role upon themselves of cleansing the world of infidels llke you, and yes me. Their only objective is a world of Islam. THERE IS NOTHING ELSE FOR THEM.
So this refried bean head tell you I am very serious if it is going to be my family or theirs who I am going to chose. If death is the only option on the table I want it to be theirs. Wipe em out and to the winner go the spoils.
August 15, 2006 at 1:51 am
#66 Myles – as a “Christian” or even a hedonistic historian, one would know that Israel occupied the geographical TERRITORY of Palestine going way back to the year 2000 BC. [or was that 2000 BH (Before Halliburton)]?, anyhow – There was no official government in Palestine and the creation of “Palestinians” happened during the reign of Hitler and guess for what purpose? But early Israel was a strip of unwanted desert (a part of Egypt) that only nomadic tribes occupied from time to time. Islam was formed around 650 AD – yes after the ISLAMIC conquest they did occupy the land formerly known as Israel, but sorry – those Jews were there first (just like the American Indians were here before us). If the Indians here could put the firewater down, maybe they could take some of it back – I’d gladly donate New Jersey, but I don’t think they’d want the garbage – I mean Garden State. Anywho, (as those Canadians would say) I was beginning to get turned on to Vera (in a weird way) until she used “bald headed” as a derogatory adjective describing undesirable manipulative old men. I resemble that statement and demand an apology! But seriously, 69 is a good number Vera (great year for wine), but don’t short change the young men (and some old bald Moslems too) – they are due to receive 72 virgins! But God does have a sense of humor guys, because they will all be like VERA! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaahhhggg! Nag, nag, nag forEVER! Imagine that!!!
August 15, 2006 at 2:13 am
Oh, sorry for the double post here but I forgot to ask aMADjihad if he could postpone this August 22nd deadline for 6 months to a year? I just bought a BMW (that’s Beat My Wife in Persian) and would like to enjoy it for a while speeding around town with the sun tanning my head through the sunroof.
August 15, 2006 at 4:35 am
Vera ,
How about those sandwiches . The Eagle went on a beer run.When he gets back he’s gonna be hungry!
August 15, 2006 at 9:58 am
Rick…read that story on the site u listed Operation Northwoods:http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1 While interesting, figured it was going to be a story about a Democrat…why the heck do u think Kennedy was shot in the head? Johnson was no better…and do u want someone like Kerry running our country? Or worse….Hillary and Mr. Cigar Clinton? Mr. Clinton had Bin Laden in his pocket if he wanted but he didn’t act on it….Dems will be the downfall of this country….lol they already are…shit on my shoes that I just can’t wipe off….and oh VERA….why don’t u volunteer and go clean the asses of the Hezbollah….they say that sand they have to use is sure hurting their butts…and don’t shake hands with them….ugh….well know custom…..shit in one, gun in other….and where are those sandwiches Vera Martha Stewart?
August 15, 2006 at 11:32 am
If the muslims really cared about the palastinians and wanted them to have thier own country they could easily divy up a small portion of thier own land (mostly desert)and give it to them. But no they want take Israel’s land that was Israel’s since they did what God, told them to do and take it from the canaanites
a few milleniums ago. Glenn Beck, on HLN,is also of the opinion that this is the start of WWIII. I found it intersting that the regular news never reported on the 10,000 muslims in Deerborne Mich, demonstrating and proclaiming Hezballah or how ever you spell it as thier Army. This area is 30% muslim and is the place where lasers were being aimed into the cockpits of airliners in hopes of blinding the pilots and crashing the planes. This was also reported by Glenn Beck on HLN. Seems we have to clean up the insurgents here first. Then clean up the middle east. The neutron bombs sound like a good Idea. They don’t destroy buildings but explode giving off massive gamma ray radiation.
After ten days it is safe to move into the area again. A pre-emptive strike on Iran and North Korea is a lot better than waiting for them to nuke the U.S. to have a reason to hit them. The best quote of the week was by a woman who was on one of the flights comeing from England. “The world has lost it’s mind”. Nuf said.
August 15, 2006 at 3:07 pm
Glenn Beck is a bag licker!!!
August 15, 2006 at 4:08 pm
what a glorious time to be alive.
i have been waiting thirty years for the shit to go down!!
i will be in the woods and if you come into my woods i might eat you.
no money\image worshipping morons in my lifeboat.
I LIVE FOR SURVIVAL!!
Bring it
SURELY I COME QUICKLY. AMEN!!
August 15, 2006 at 6:59 pm
brettzy be careful what you eat it may be your last meal.
August 15, 2006 at 7:00 pm
o i forgot amen and i come slowly
August 15, 2006 at 7:38 pm
Karma did partial research on the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Folks often overlook the fact that the MUSLIM Ottoman empire conquered (read owned) the land that both the Jews and Palestinians claim. The Israeli colonists pre and post WWII purchased most of the lands now recognized as Israel LEGALLY from MUSLIMS! The issue has been contested by the Palestinians for decades, but to whom do you plead for justice when the ruling entity is no longer in power? Yes, the fellow muslims could have alleviated this “grievous act,” as one previous letter mentioned, by giving up parts of their territories. “But, Nooooooooo!” as John Belushi’s character on Saturday Night Live would say, they’d rather continue an on-going feud with an age-old “enemy.” Get along? In your dreams. Yes, the muslims want an islamic world free of jews and infidels. The pact with Iran’s Pres. “Ah-ma-nut-job” is no better than Hitler and Stalin’s pact. Look what happened there! Wake up, world! You might be next!
August 15, 2006 at 9:03 pm
Bismi Allah Arrehman Arrahim. Kul Aaoozo be Rabin nass. Malikin nass. illahin nass. Min shar ril was wa sil khan na sil lazi. yu was wiso phe sudori nass. me nal jin nate wan nass. Ameen
August 15, 2006 at 9:21 pm
Ricky, I don’t know what Mr. Beck may or may not lick, but I think the story he did about the 10,000 Arabs in Dearborn, MI putting on a rally to show support for Hezbollah was a very important story.
They are in our streets. Its time for us here at home to lock n’ load. When push comes to shove, we ARE the militia.
August 16, 2006 at 12:36 am
Hey MRS DJ, The government is teaching us that all Arabs and muslims are out to get us!I’m more afraid of our own government as they have demonstrated throughout history they are capable of things we cannot comprehend!
August 16, 2006 at 12:50 am
Ricky I find it humorous that you are using the NY Times as your source to prove a fact. Isn’t that the same newspaper that hired and retained someone because of the color of his skin and allowed him to Plagiarize and make up stories as fact??
August 16, 2006 at 1:58 am
Hey getReal,There’s only about 3.2 million websites you can find info on.Take your pick!!
August 16, 2006 at 2:25 am
DO NOT WORRY MY FELLOW US CITIZENS…THE IRANIAN PRESIDENT WILL EXPERIENCE AN UNFORTUNATE SURPRISE ON AUGUST 22, 2006.
August 16, 2006 at 3:59 am
#84 Ahmz: Nok yerself appro slick – le greymatta bak la performas don, not taketcbe’n man. There – now chew on that for a while smarty pants.
Ricky: Sure (IN THIS country without fearing reprisals) anyone can say that this government (made up of countless inefficient fat LIFERs sitting on $600 toilets) is capable of creating precise and extremely well thought out “Advanced Top Secret” events to further empower itself (yawn) but tell us all – or at least those waiting for Vera to get off her fat butt to make those sandwiches – what excuse do you have for Islam 230 years prior to this country’s creation and all her secrecies? For 1300 years Moslems have been raping and murdering to advance their version of a loving God! There are currently about 28 conflicts/wars going on in this world – the USA is involved in only 2 directly and about 4 indirectly. Islam is the common denominator in 23 of the 28. Most of the murders are Moslems murdering Moslems because they aren’t radical enough – NOWHERE is the USA involved in these conflicts (like Indonesia, Kashmir, Philippines, Darfur – Arabs killing Blacks, etc). You are obviously anti-US and we get that, we won’t cut your throat for expressing your opinion (only wishing you eternal life with Vera). You (with your liberal mental disorder) will continue to seek out any and all anti-US fabricated propaganda from any and all anti-traditional, anti-conservative, “media” sources. In other words – you seek the information that you feel fits your ideology and consider it as truth. Get it over with and MOVE to the country of your choice. Be like Cat Stevens and change your name to Mohammad Al-whatever. Buy some kneepads to go with the prayer rug (6 times a day with your head 6″ behind some guy’s dirty butt) – go for it. I’ll stay here and continue to do what our founding fathers thought was best: pursue happiness. Go on now and live amongst the hatred and violence. VERA, where’s my beer!!
August 16, 2006 at 4:09 am
Ricky… and your point is???
Why don’t you pick one that is credible and maybe then I’ll listen.
August 16, 2006 at 11:43 am
95% of the posts in this discussion are probably from racist and ignorant warmongering little kids who probably think that war is like in the video games they play all day. Do some real research first before demonizing Iran, the Middle-East, and all Muslim cultures in general.
The real war crimes in this world are pepetrated by European/Zionist/Western Global-Financial Multi-National Giant Corporations. This is what Bush and his Neo-Cons adhere to. The war in the Middle-East is about oil and militaristic occupation (go look up The Project for a New American Century).
The reason why you pathetic brainwashed morons hate the Muslims so much is because you have been conditioned by your extremely biased Controlled Media (controlled by zionist Pro-Bush liars like Rupert Murdoch). Your media is shaping your perception of the world according to the political views shared by the Zionist/Neo-fascist imperialists.
The only way you can stop this, is when you people start questioning your own government instead of waving the American Flag with blindfolds. There is nothing wrong with patriotism, but real patriots are the ones willing to question their own government’s motives. You should all do some research. It will take a while but it’s well worth it.
August 16, 2006 at 2:47 pm
Hey, folks. Doesn’t it tell you something that muslims, wherever they live, consider themselves muslims first, then citizens of whatever country second? Now, here’s a kicker: as a group, muslims are VERY patient people. If the extremists cannot blow us up or shoot us in the immediate future, no biggee. WE, if we do not eliminate our complacency, could possibly get VOTED out of a country, religion, way of life, etc. Scenario: we know the USA is a melting pot; all are welcome. Sooner or later, most likey later, a muslim candidate for some local office will be elected. He/she may do a fine job. The masses say, “Oh, they (the muslims) aren’t so bad after all.” Then more and more get elected to local, then state, then national positions, as the birthrate of muslims rises and muslim immigration continues. Next thing you know, WE’RE the minority faced living with THEIR religious rules and tenents. Far fetched? Not as much as you’d think. Look at what is happening to the Dutch. The exact thing is happening to their contry. The Dutch allowed uncontrolled immigration of muslims and now the Dutch citizens are leaving in droves because of what’s happening in THEIR country (mosques and islamic influence everywhere). Why? Because they don’t have the balls to stand up for what they established. Sound familar?
Like it or not, the USA has become the world’s defender of life, liberty, and freedom. Britain, and a few other countries when it suits them, are the only ones standing with us between life as we know it and a perverted version of a religious belief intolerant to anything but itself.
The muslims are OUR generation’s Nazis/Facists/Imperialists. Why is there unrest throughout most of the middle east and Asia? The extremist muslims want to bring back the Caliphate that once stretched from Spain across the middle east to Indonesia (Myles # 66). Why? Because of past opression? Want of political power? Loss of status? Monetary gain? Religious equality? Who knows!
The main thing is we have GOT to unite, stand together, and face this threat. We MUST stop showing a divided front to the muslims. We ARE at war and it won’t stop until one or more of three things happen: 1. Muslims reign in the extremists; 2. We fight them to a death and eliminate the threat ourselves; 3. Die/and or convert to Islam. I’ll be DAMNED if I accept option three.
Our only hope is that the ongoing bickering between Shi’a and Sunni will continue to keep them from uniting against us in a common cause: the death of the infidels. We’ve fought two fronts before, Europe and the Pacific. What makes it untenable is the tactics utilized by the extremists: no uniforms, no country, no centralized command, using civilian areas as both bases of operations and attack positions, thus providing them with human shielding. And the extremists have the audacity to call us cowards. Yeah, we’re cowards because we have respect for human life and do not target non-combatants. I wonder what they’d think if we eliminated that mind-set.
Sorrow, fellow contributors. I’ll get off of the soap box. I’m just tired, as pointed out before, of people regurgitating someone else’s rhetoric/political dogma/whatever to make “their” point. PLEASE, research, read, and learn ALL there is about what is going on around us. No, you did’t sleep through it in History class in high school/college. You won’t get the big picture unless you read numerous articles from notable experts from different countries. Anyone with half a brain will see if the view has a slant one way or the other, but there is always something in each that contributes a piece to the puzzle.
That means you: Desperado, Vera, Able Danger, Ricky, and others that the shoe fits…
August 16, 2006 at 5:03 pm
i have a question:
if he was going to blow up the world.
why would he start a blog? hmm?
if the world was ending i wouldn’t start a blog.
http://eteraz.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/iranian-president-ahmedinejad-has-a-blog/
August 16, 2006 at 10:00 pm
check out “hezbollah” at http://www.JeanValJeanLives.com
August 17, 2006 at 12:13 am
I must say, I like DJ’s lengthy post, and have one point to make.
Religion is simply a fairy tale for the weak minded. 95% of people have some religion, and this just proves that the world is just not ready for humans to evolve further, or use technology properly, etc. These religious fanatics are only worse than any religious person in the fact that they kill people to get their point across. That doesn’t mean that every religious person is not inherently evil.
Ask any person with any religion and they would LOVE to have you become part of their cult. This is just a method of control for human behavior, and money.
I think the 10 commandments are good rules to live by for instance, but i certainly don’t believe they were given by the voice of some ‘almighty’ puppet master, to some shoeless cave man on a mountain by a burning bush. anyone who does is a complete idiot and lost in their own fantasies. The same is true of anyone who believes ‘magic’ oil kept a lamp lit for 8 days, or they are going to get 72 vigins when they go to heaven.
frankly, when you die, you die and your “soul” (collection of energy from the billions of cells that make up every body) returns to the earth (or would if we werent pumped full of formaldahyde). There is no heaven for these towel heads or cross bearers or chosen people to go to. there is no hell either. This is the biggest waste of time, money and natural resources on the world’s largest persistent HOAX.
My advice to everyone here – reevaluate your world view, stop giving money to some pedophile training camp(church), terrorist camp(mosque) or law school(synagogue), and give it to some non religious charity that focuses on medicine and science and the betterment of MANKIND. it is just a fairy tale and crutch for the weak of mind and hollow of heart.
have some kids, find love within yourself instead of looking to some mother goose tales from millenia ago – when the WORLD WAS STILL FLAT.
and most importantly – melt those rag head mother fuckers down to beaded glass with a strategic nuke in every middle east capital city, pyong yang, and fuck it…paris just because those french people suck.
August 17, 2006 at 3:11 am
#92: Able Danger – for such a self-proclaimed intellectual (much smarter than us all) you sure have a poor grip on effective communication skills. In other words – who bothers to contemplate anything you have to say when it is nothing but insults and child like name-calling? Kind of wasting your time here aren’t you?
# 95: Jean, shameless self promotion….Hey wait a minute – Is this Ahmadinejad? (LOL – yea like he’d subject himself to thousands of insulting emails per day) BTW – The music gets annoying after while (unless that is psychological operations – a military tactic used to wear down the enemy). You did put some work into it (although the font is amateurish) building up to the point, which is the same regurgitated pabulum (Jews, Jews, Jews) you Nazi retread (how’s that for name calling!). #94 Now, I do like Ali’s site – “Eteraz”, nice reference to the Persian word “Protest”. BTW something we should keep in mind is that many Iranians (Persians) are pro American despite our past meddling (ahem, yes Jimmy Carter I’m referring to you). Anyway, great stuff Ali on your blog: but lustful emails? Did you get any from President Carter? He’s been known to have “looked on a lot of women with lust” (so he said). You have to excuse my fellow citizens – Customs and courtesies, once part of this country were erased after the hippies from the 1960’s moved into positions of power and influence. We’re slowly trying to recover. #96 religion is stupid: You’re a piece of work – we’re just left speechless. Actually you didn’t do too bad presenting your case until the last paragraph – was that a little demon on your shoulder speaking to you, or did your little brother finish it while you left to “smoke a rope”? – Quite odd I must say was this quote: {That doesn’t mean that every religious person is not inherently evil.}. Two things; First you spoke with a double negative subconsciously suggesting that all religious people are evil – huh? How can there be evil according to your secular view? Anyway, a few painless questions though for you the know-all-see-all: How is it possible that something (creation of life via big bang theory, etc) came from…nothing? How did the origins of life, the atoms, sub-atomic particles “know” to bond to create the elements necessary to sustain an environment with perfect balance? Where did those little atoms come from – what was there before? Smoke another one and get back to us – we eagerly await your insightful response!
August 17, 2006 at 3:21 am
Bravo DJ on an excellent well stated post.
Your point is so very well taken.
“I’m just tired, as pointed out before, of people regurgitating someone else’s rhetoric/political dogma/whatever to make “their” point. PLEASE, research, read, and learn ALL there is about what is going on around us.”
To that end may I suggest The Middle East
Media Research Institute TV Monitor Project.
The Web site is listed below. We should definitely observe and understand where the otherside is coming from so we can anticipate from where and when they will be coming at us.
http://www.memritv.org
By the way …
Vera!!! dammit woman! where’s my sandwich and brewski!!!
August 17, 2006 at 4:16 am
As a follow-up to my post (#98) also check out
Jihad Watch …verrrry interesting!
http://www.jihadwatch.org/
re Mujibar’s post #77…..
VERA! Be sure to wash your hands before making sandwiches!!!
August 17, 2006 at 2:05 pm
WOW! Able danger has bowed to Allah and wants us to embrace the peaceful, loving and wonderful muslims. Break it down Able, but know your Muslim history. Just examine Muslimsim from its onset. It goes something like this….convert, see everyone not muslim as infidel and immoral, wage war and take over the government and force Muslimism on everyone. That is Islam in a nutshell. If there is something I left please tell me. It has been going on since Mohummad came out of the cave after eating mushrooms.
Do you actually believe there can be peaceful coexistance between any other religion and Islam? They may have “ties,” with the likes of North Korea and Russia and France (Note…France is on their side because the are scared and hope by playing with them they will not take them over too),but it isn’t because of some peace boond. Islam will use the same nukes and arms it got from those countries against them, becuase they are infidels too.
Regardless of what you (anyone out there) believe (your faith), you cannot ignore facts based on history and what is happening in this very day. Islam is a Hitler in religious form. It has been since its inception and will be til we wipe it off the face of the earth. Am I pro war? Hell no. But I am not pro death by carbomb or Jetliner by some freak who thinks he is doing the will of God.
Now, another note to Danger… if the majority of Islam is for peace, love, and “Can’t we all just get along… with Vera” then why don’t they do justice (eliminate)to all those radicals within their ranks? They know who they are and where they are? If they are not teaching “True Islam,” then how come the 1. something BILLION other Islamics get rid of the all the infidels within their own ranks. You would think that if I was a TRUE ISLAMIC PERSON and someone was teaching and Islam different that TRUE ISLAM, those people would be bigger infidels. They would be in need of being killed first to rid TRUE ISLAM from such a bad rap so all the world could see how lovely and wonderful they really are.
I have the answer…because they want them to do what they are doing…rid the world of the infidel.
August 18, 2006 at 1:49 am
DJ saysHey, folks. Doesn’t it tell you something that muslims, wherever they live, consider themselves muslims first, then citizens of whatever country second?
Hmmm. I consider myself a Christian first and American second and so do 90% of the American Christians.
August 18, 2006 at 2:50 am
Peachy, I don’t think Moslems see citizenship (or civilization) as the western countries do. They are in bondage no matter where they live because their meaning of life is to prepare to be with Allah – so what does citizenship mean to them? Nothing… These folks started out as Nomads and continue to be so, whether it is North Africa or Detroit. As far as the Christian vs. American thing – Christianity is “allowed” in America (still) so you and the so called 90% better tie the two together before you will have no where to practice it. Moslems are moving forward with their agenda while Christians are shrinking back – as pacifist. The Secularist feel they are doing this country a favor by reducing the influence of Christianity but little do they know – they are creating a vacuum Islam will gladly fill.
August 18, 2006 at 4:09 am
lebanon Survives once again, But will Syria of Assad
August 18, 2006 at 4:29 am
Things are about to change.
August 18, 2006 at 12:14 pm
Eagle, good view on the vacuum affect. Whether anyone believes in God (the God of Christianity) or not the moral decline in America is clear since the removal of the base principles our founding fathers set down. I do not believe the religious freedoms they meant were for all religions, just the freedom of Christian practices. That is just my opion, since this is what they all were. They were all Chiristians of one faith or another, and they would have seen any other religion as not of God, which this county was “One nation,” under.
August 18, 2006 at 12:19 pm
One more thing…
If it is Christianity you (anyone out there) believe in, then what is happening should not be a surprise. It is written by turning your back on Him that (as a nation just like what happened to Israel) He would turn His back on you. The outcome is what we are seeing today taking place in America…Girls gone Wild…glorification of homosexuality…name it, you got it.
August 18, 2006 at 6:34 pm
Onthisnote: Although you are correct that the belief system involved with the founding of this country had Christian overtones (see Declaration Of Independence opening statement to Congress July 4, 1776), secularists played an important role as well and that was a good thing. The purpose of the Constitution was to place limits on our government’s power over her people. Amendment 1 dictates to Congress that they would make no law respecting an establishment of religion OR prohibit the exercise thereof. And that certainly leaves us with a dilemma when it comes to a clandestine religion called Islam that seeks to thwart all western governmental laws (overthrow) and replace them with the Sharia. How they do this is by migrating peacefully into western cultures and slowly begin to gain influence politically until they have enough of a majority to overrule existing laws. If they fail to do this within reasonable time terrorism is used to convince those in power to change. We saw that with the Spaniards and the French who have lost their country to the Islamic Conquest of the 21st Century. England too is currently losing to the inevitable and already referring to the city of London as Londonistan. And finally the Province of Ontario, Canada has authorized the use of Sharia law in civil arbitrations – a foot in the door. Here in the United States, in order to stave off this invasion to OUR way of life we will at some point have to declare Islam not a religion, but a dangerous cult or political movement such as Nazism to ban it. I doubt it will happen, but if it does, this will occur way too late and my guess is that the liberal feel good types will instead opt to either ban all religions or establish a certain type (like a world religion – hello Revelations) as legitimate and legal. This can and will happen after an event causes martial law and the suspension of the Constitution’s Amendments. My guess is this event will mirror what we see in Iraq today, a model of the future to come because we are a divided people today.
August 18, 2006 at 9:34 pm
man,,,,he is like a worker,,,,,,, juste litsen the order not giving the order,,,,,witch he should do it!
August 18, 2006 at 10:02 pm
I’m sure I’ll be blasted by some for saying what I’m about to say, but those doing the blasting weren’t in the taxi with me (I’ll get to that at the end).
Some say the majority of Muslims want peace and shun war while others say they’re a bunch hell bent on the complete destruction of the West.
Other than the fact that there seems to be so many Muslims who blow up innocent civilians as they go about the daily life chores of earning a living, caring for children, and trying to have a little fun, I cannot get past the way a vast number of Muslim men treat and regard women.
Although, I’m sure there are some who will try, you can’t blame that on a vast conspiracy perpetuated by the American government.
As an American woman whose sisters have fought long and hard for the rights we enjoy today, I have a big problem with Muslim men. I don’t want to wear a burqa because some guy thinks of sex when he looks at me. That’s his problem, not mine. I don’t want to cover my body and face in extreme heat because some guy thinks of sex when he looks at me. I don’t want acid thrown at me because some guy looked at me and my brother took offense to it and blamed me for it. This is everyday life for too many women in Muslim countries.
I will not see my daughters treated like this and, if necessary, I will do anything I can to prevent it.
This is where the blasting will come in as I hear how: A) Muslim women are highly regarded because the religion says women are to be revered or B) western women are abused too.
My answer to A)is that what might be in the Quran isn’t necessarily practiced and B)while there are some American women who suffer horrendous abuse, we prosecute the scum who beat them instead of pat them on the back.
So, to the people out there who think our Government is the evil entity in this struggle, I wish you could have been in the taxi with me going from Lawton, Oklahoma to Will Roger’s Airport in Oklahoma City. (I was visiting my mom who had just been given 6 weeks to live with a diagnosis of brain cancer.)
The taxi driver was a young man from Bangladesh who had come to the US on a student visa, dropped out of college with a semester to go because his grants ran out, and was working to support his wife and daughter. He went back to Bangladesh to marry his wife, a first cousin, and had a little girl when back in the US.
This young man almost had a heart attack when I sat in the front seat of the van (bucket seats) but he let it go. We proceeded to talk about life in the US compared to his country and got on the topic of daughters. He said that daughters need to be severely controlled because of their evil tendencies. I told him that as far as Americans go, especially American dads, we view the young guys dating our daughters as the ones who need to be controlled. I joked about it. He didn’t.
He continued to say that, present company excluded, most American women dress like sluts and therefore they’re treated like sluts (who else does that sound like – Deepak Kalpoe?). Ever been to Europe? Whether one agrees with the way women in this century dress or not, American women dress more conservatively than the women in most other countries. It’s just another example of the excuses Muslims will use in their quest to take the West down.
I love my life in this Country. While not perfect, it’s the best game going as far as I’m concerned. I don’t want to live in a socialist country, a communist country, or a Muslim dominated country. I like it here. To those who don’t, look around and find some place that you do like and move there. You’ll be happier and we will be, too.
August 19, 2006 at 3:53 am
A little off topic here but I have to know something,are there alot of out of country T.V. channels broadcast in the U.S.?I know that every U.S. news station seems to be awfully biased.Here in Canada for example,this weekend they’re showing a documentary on how people first became infected with aids.Would’nt you know aids came fron vaccines!!Now I’m not pointing the finger at anyone’s government but….I’d have to say the U.N along with the U.S. were somewhat responsible!!No conspiracy theory here,CHECK THE FACTS!!
August 19, 2006 at 4:02 am
Americanwoman, you said it all.
Thank God we live in a country where there are no limits on what we can achieve by our own hard work and ability.
We have come a long way ,through many trying times (the Civil Rights Movement, Womens Lib,
Recession and the current political battles between liberals ,conservatives republicans,democrats ,what have you). We came through it over and over again and it makes us stronger and better as a nation.
Growing up , I loved to watch Superman on TV .
He stood for “Truth ,Justice and the American Way”.
As Americans, we all do . It is part of our national fabric, it is our credo. It is what makes us great as a country and as a “People”.
If we don’t like what the President says or does ,we can say so without fear that there will be a knock on the door in the middle of the night.
We can vote ,practice the religion of our choice or no religion ,raise a family ,live the life we choose as long as it doesn’t infringe on the rights of our neighbor. The guidelines we follow are our conscience, good taste and the Golden Rule.
If our country is so evil ,so contemptable, if we are the Infidels, why are all these foreigners coming here?
My father was a WWII vet. He fought with the 100th Infantry Division in France and Germany. The Dedication from their website is as follows:
Dedicated to
the Soldiers of the 100th Infantry Division
who, loving Life, wedded Death
so that Freedom could remain
immortal.
We as a people are the most generous on the face of the earth .We are a beacon for freedom loving peoples everywhere. While we are patient and slow to anger ,we are The force to be reconned with should we be pushed too far.
August 19, 2006 at 6:46 am
Sex, Lies and Call Girls: Why the U.S. Media Is a Whore
August 19, 2006 at 6:51 am
#109 Americanwoman: Thanks for the down to earth posting. It sure is interesting how the feminists have stayed quiet about that very subject (Moslems treatment of women). I would REALLY like to know what the real reason is for the deafening silence – why the mutiny against the very thing they fought for. The only one (feminist)who seems close to standing up to radical Islam is (God forgive me) Hillary – but is that only a political move?
#111Big Jake: I’m with ya brother.
#108 barham…You either need a better translator website or slow down on the opium.
#110 Ricky the Hoser: I wouldn’t say any of that is off YOUR topic since all of your other post (as I review them) are saying the same thing basically, eh: You have a boner for the United States and all this so called propaganda, ahem, I mean information that you seek out supports your theory that we are well, just bad people! You said earlier that Islam isn’t violent – and yet right in your back yard was a recent terrorist plot targeting Toronto and Ottawa. A bomb 3 times the size of the one used in Oklahoma City was to be detonated at a Canadian institution, to affect the Canadian economy and kill the Canadian people (who are mostly anti-US ironically enough). Anyway, I think we GET IT that you folks up north have this hatred (not all of course) mostly due to jealousy and liberalism (a mental disorder). BTW most of us don’t care what you guys think of us by now. But if you REALLY want to know facts these days (when anyone sitting at a computer dressed only in their underwear can put up a website with FrontPage), you need to hear from both sides and see things RATIONALLY. AIDS I’m sure was man made, BUT it wasn’t what you, Jeff Rense, and all the conspiracy propagandist spew out. It had more to do with Bionetics and researchers making bad mistakes in their quest to find a cure for Cancer using monkees and viruses to see if the cancer is caused and/or spread by viruses.
http://www.serendipity.li/more/cantwell.htm
August 19, 2006 at 11:34 am
Hi people, i’m from Turkey.
check this documentary to have an idea about what is going on.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5946593973848835726&q=loose+change
make wars to keep your country exist as one piece. but don’t make it personal.
this much hatred against muslims causes you seem like odd animals.
August 19, 2006 at 3:11 pm
Oh yes THE EAGLE mr. know-it-all!!Is your name Glenn Beck by chance?
August 19, 2006 at 6:53 pm
Just some info. News out today of large Iranian miltary operation. Land, sea and air.
Heads up???
August 19, 2006 at 10:57 pm
This one’s for you Ricky,
As an addendum to Eagle’s post #113
Why suspects dropped Parliament plot
By JIM BRONSKILL
OTTAWA (CP) – An alleged plot to take MPs hostage on Parliament Hill was abandoned at an early stage because the people involved – who hail from southern Ontario – knew little about Ottawa, The Canadian Press has learned.
The accused conspirators are being interrogated about any possible plans to attack targets in the United States or links to sympathizers south of the border, sources also indicate. The public was shocked to hear a group arrested on terrorism-related charges had supposedly planned to storm Parliament, seize politicians and behead the prime minister.
BEHEAD THE PRIME MINISTER,EH! Islam may or may not be violent depending on the interpretation of “violent” and the motives and fervor of the individual followers whoever they may be.
August 19, 2006 at 11:47 pm
As manufactured terror alerts, magnified turmoil in the Middle East, and dire proclamations that doomsday is approaching all converge at the end of the summer of 2006, the twist in the story is likely to be a massive staged terror attack that will smother any remaining voices of descent and once again leave America transfixed in an orgy of militarism, paranoia and fear.
The targets of the subsequent frenzied police state clampdown will be the traitors who questioned their government’s motivations in the war on terror and blocked Bush’ path in protecting the American people.
Alex Jones has only made one previous prediction that he was overwhelmingly sure would come to pass. In July 2001, Jones launched ‘Operation Expose the Government Terrorists,’ a desperate late attempt to focus activism around raising awareness of an imminent massive terror attack that would be blamed on the patsy Osama bin Laden.
Unfortunately that foresight came home to roost on September 11 and we now find ourselves in similar peril five years later.
On his August 10th show, Alex Jones broadcast a warning that we would soon see, “bone-shattering mega attacks in the United States, Canada, England or Israel.”
The time frame for the attacks is within 2 months – the biggest risk being before the middle of October but at least before the mid-term elections in November.
“The prelude to a new mega attack or a string of large attacks – leading up to that – I predicted that they would have five to ten staged busts of terrorists,” said Jones.
The watershed success of the 9/11 truth movement in obtaining national exposure has been met with a fierce backlash from the establishment in the form of nationwide editorials on cue, almost as if uniformly timed, that attack 9/11 skeptics with straw man smear campaign arguments. In addition, an increase in alleged foiled terror alerts serves two purposes, to shift attention away from the increasingly high profile 9/11 truth information and secondly to construct the story board to which the next real attack will be pinned.
‘Look, we protected you from all those attacks but we just couldn’t stop them all – it was the peaceniks and the civil libertarians who prevented us going all the way and keeping America safe – they are to blame for major cities being dirty bombed and others biologically poisoned.’
The baseless terror raids, besides acting as PR for delusional fearmongering and the perception that terrorists are hiding under every bed, also creates a chilling effect whereby the government is sending a message to anyone that doesn’t display the proper modicum of obedience and fails to salute the war on terror.
‘We can grab you off the street or from your own home at our own convenience and incarcerate you – without having to present any evidence to justify it.’
Some have suggested that Fox News’ mention of Alex Jones’ warning (watch above) is sufficient advance protection to offset the coming attack. However, coverage of the warning needs to be infinitely more widespread in order to have any impact. The 9/11 Blogger website has put together an activist page that provides information on how people can help us mobilize to try and prevent what government officials and their apologists have told us is inevitable.
Disturbing developments such as the smearing of 9/11 truth activists as terrorist sympathizers and the surveillance and wanton random arrests and beatings of alternative news journalists act as a red flag to denote preparation for a martial law crackdown in the wake of a new synthetic terror attack.
The beta test for this tactic was the 1995 Oklahoma City Bombing, a false flag event that almost obliterated the burgeoning Patriot Movement. In the immediate aftermath of the attack the patsy, Timothy McVeigh, was linked with “far-right militia groups” that talked about the Constitution and federal encroachment on God-given rights. Though no mass sweeps took place, the chilling effect was enough to send a great deal of activists into the shadows – or worse many sold out and became frothing Neo-Cons as soon as Bush got into office.
That same chilling effect is again being employed and applied not just to paleoconservatives – but to anyone who dares dissent against the Neo-Fascist agenda. Even democratically elected moderate anti-war candidates such as Ned Lamont, hardly a George Washington, and his supporters, are being accused of supporting Al-Qaeda by the drooling maniacs who act as PR whores for the Bushists. Though on the face of it this kind of rhetoric – the notion that thousands of citizens in Connecticut ticked Lamont’s box because they thought it would help Osama bin Laden – is patently schizophrenic, the mere repetition of the big lie is enough for many to zealously uphold its orthodoxy.
In addition to network news TV shows, reports of Neo-Con cheerleaders on the radio framing anyone who questions 9/11 as having an ‘Al Qaeda mind set’ are beginning to filter in. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see where all this is potentially heading – directly to a Homeland Security labor camp unless we stand up and point the finger at the real freedom loathing terrorists.
We should not consider ourselves outside of the scope of a regime that always links its next victims with Al-Qaeda as an excuse to decapitate them from the political spectrum.
Alex Jones’ warning of a monumental staged terror attack, creating the pretext to air strike Iran, and its subsequent ramifications for freedom-exercising citizens and truth activists in the western world, is a piercing light through the veil of deception and needs to be echoed around the four corners of the globe if we are to stand a chance of saving America from the grip of a vampiric Neo-Fascist horror show.
August 20, 2006 at 12:04 am
To the eagle,as far as calling me a “hoser” which of the 29 definitions are you referring to?Actually I was born in Brockton, Mass. and my family just happens to be a prominent political family there!I just choose to live in a better country for my kids.
August 20, 2006 at 12:05 am
To the eagle,as far as calling me a “hoser” Actually I was born in Brockton, Mass. it’s just that Canada for now is a much better country in which to live!
August 20, 2006 at 2:55 am
August 22 will come and go with no big events. Ahmadinajad is full of hyper-rhetoric. Too bad the Israelis had to pull out of Lebanon — we should have let them fight it out. That’s the only thing that will end this whole deal.
As for Iran trying something, in the long run, it would be better if they did. We need to get this war (make no mistake, that’s what it is) over with — and the only way to do that with religious zealots raised to believe heaven is a simple IED away is to kill them.
Bottom f-ing line, if we want our way of life to continue we have to have it out. Bring it on, Iran!
August 20, 2006 at 3:46 am
Able Danger is right. You people have a very subjective view of world affairs. You seem to buy into that whole “You are either with us or with the terrorists” propaganda that the Neo-Cons have been promoting through their media ever since 9/11 happened. If you actually investigated 9/11, you will see that it was a government false-flag operation ran by elements within the United States Government in order to use it as a pretext to invade the Middle East. Who here has ever heard of the Project for a New American Century? Those are government papers you can actually research.
There are Muslim extremists out there. Nobody will deny that. That is a fact. However, what you need to know is how they became extremist in the first place. A lot of their extremist ideologies are a result of U.S./Israel foreign policies. You people are brainwashed sheep who have no real understanding of what is going on behind the scenes. Do some research before deciding to post anti-muslim comments. Your one-sided comments are also potentially misleading to anyone who reads them. Be responsible before you post.
August 20, 2006 at 4:11 am
Guys,
Any comments on AnotherMAD from Turkey ’s post
#114?
I looked at the film twice .As far as motive, opportunity and money trail, I find it very disturbing. Any info on whether this has been investigated and debunked?
August 20, 2006 at 4:12 am
AnotherMAD from Turkey: Films can and are full of falsehoods and half-truths conveniently suited for the director’s image or belief. So that stuff is garbage – besides, since when are Islamics concerned with one of the 10 commandments “thou shalt not lie”? Moslems see this thing we call a lie as a tool to trick the infidel. And war has NOT kept this country together. It has caused a split that the Islamic propagandists are taking advantage of. We don’t have hatred for Moslems (notice the CORRECT spelling) just a determination to defeat the Islamic Conquest and help you to reform your religion by removing the call to Jihad for Allah’s sake. Rickee: Maybe you moved across the border to avoid the charges of plagiarism: http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/august2006/170806declarewar.htm
Look, paraphrase the damn article instead of copying it. As far as your claim that you have a prominent political family in the Commonwealth of Mass-of-two-shitts, I wouldn’t see that as something to be proud of, as you already voted with your feet. We’re happy you’re there too – sleep in the bed you make. Rage: yes, A-MAD-jiHAD’s August 22nd plan is to wipe with the other hand and spread Hepatitis E to all the media idiots like Mike Wallace. Bubblerz: Gee thanks for straightening out the millions of us idiots. I just can’t for the life of me understand why Moslems are killing Moslems in countries like Indonesia, and the Indians over Kashmir, and the Africans in Darfur (over 100,000 killed so far this year (catching up to McDonalds’ number of people served), the Philippines, Sri Lanka, etc etc. Nowhere is the United States or the hated Jewish country (by Nazi organizations like the Muslim Brotherhood) involved. In fact Islam has been raping and murdering for 1,300 years as history reveals. But you’re right – we are brainwashed sheep (or so you’d like to think – sheep led to Allah’s slaughterhouse).
August 20, 2006 at 4:26 am
I have to wonder if anyone was around when all of this was set in stone, hand written down for the very first time before any of it was ever published for all to read and take into their own matters. No one knows exactly what will happen or when it will happen. I like to put this subject on the back of my mind and go on with my day, without worrying so much..worrying if today is the day the United States is attacked, nuked, what have you. I think the only way to guarantee our safety is to quit dicking around and to take action. How? I have no idea. I’m not a master mind at any of this. I just know I’m tired of hearing about innocent lives being taken, and I’m certainly tired of hearing about possible attacks..huge attacks.. on America. I know nothing I say has power or even matters to anyone else, but I think it’s about time my thoughts on this situation came out to play. So seriously, how can anyone take something written hundreds or thousands of years ago and think it will actually happen. I know none of us could have witnessed the actual writing of it. And I know people believe the Bible, the Koran, and everything else..and live by it all, and expect what it says. But how can we be sure? There are so many religions…which one is the true one? Which religion has the true ending?
August 20, 2006 at 5:25 am
just to clarify my post..it was a hypothetical statement. i’m not questioning which religion is real, which god is real, which piece of information is real. just take it into consideration. i’m a big picture type of person.
August 20, 2006 at 5:34 am
its so easy to sit here and blast each other anonymously on web…. look what we have become. america sits in her seat of untouchable power and if she remains like that she will fall. if we turn our backs on israel, we will fall. i don’t hate muslims. i don’t believe the same as they do, but i do not hate them. i don’t hate anyone. hate is the same as murder. the world is changing and we all have to roll with the punches. we can’t change the climate for the whole world, but we can help change it for those near us. share the message of love. let God’s love shine through you. we are at the end. as someone said earlier, i can’t “prove my beliefs with fact”, but i do have faith. we all have faith. you don’t know, but you believe that the lights in your home will come on when you flip the switch. thats faith. examine your heart. find out where you fit in this jumbo sized jig-saw we call life, and just make the best of it. love
August 20, 2006 at 5:58 am
Okay, and I’m sure everyone wants to know what and how I believe..maybe not, but for those who like to tell me what I believe, what I am scared of, and who I am basically, and how to live my life..I’m a believer of the Christian Bible. I have my own thoughts, and if everyone else can come on here and say what they have to say, then so can I. I’m not blasting anyone..there are no references to anyone in my posts. And I’m not saying anyone is wrong. I’m just throwing the obvious ..if any.. out into the open for insomniacs such as myself.
August 20, 2006 at 6:09 am
You guys are a buncha functioning retards, sooo American. Read a history book and stop watching and reading your local TV and papers. SHEESH!
August 20, 2006 at 6:13 am
To all you Chosen Ones (cause you look so good) and Bible Thumpers, answer me this? If religion was created by GOD (omnipotent et al.) and not man, why no mention of the dinosaurs? Hmm, why? M’kay?
August 20, 2006 at 3:50 pm
Very interesting blog.
Americanwoman–I have been researching the horrific plight of the Iranian women and the thought of living, as a woman, under such a monstrous system send chills down my spine. It is for this reason, the Iranian women and children, that I couldn’t just say “let’s nuke ‘em or neutron them”….can’t we just find out where the aMAD Hatter is and selectively nuke him and his fascist clerics at their genocidal tea party????
On the flip side, when it comes to choosing the Iranian women or children over American women and children, there’s no contest. If we have to wipe out the country for our survival, so be it.
Eagle and Big Jake–
I’m locked and loaded, I make a mean pot of chili (forget sandwiches ’cause you boys are real men LOL), and I love a few good brewskis…so you can tell Vera she can stay in the kitchen.
August 20, 2006 at 4:14 pm
worriedsince16–
I would be lying if I said I wasn’t concerned with all that is going on in the world. I have young children; I have dreams that I am aspiring to accomplish and certainly don’t want the world to end. I am a christian and I know the Bible well.
Prophecy says that the world will end. I do not believe that armageddon will happen August 22nd; SOMETHING may happen that day but it won’t be armageddon. Not yet, at least. War will have to break out in a huge way because before armageddon, the man of the hour (Antichrist), will have to come onto the scene. He will cause peace to be established in the middle east, it will be enforced, and the world will look to him as its savior. Prophecy says this man will rule for 7 YEARS before the great war, armageddon, is brought about. I believe aMAD Hatter, who thinks by causing chaos in the world he is paving the way for the 12th prophet, Imam Mahdi, is actually paving the way for the Antichrist. I find it quite interesting that according to the prophecy of Imam Mahdi, when he “returns” he is supposed to rule the earth for 7 YEARS, making the world an Islamic state and purging it of infidels.
Some christians believe that there will be a rapture of the christian church before the Antichrist can be revealed. I guess as far as that belief is concerned, if it happens, great. If not, well, we’re going to be in for a really rough time…
It is frightening to realize world events and the Islamic fascists are beyond our control as ordinary people. The only thing we can do is turn to God for peace in our hearts, knowing that, in the end, all will be made right; nothing happens that He does not allow to happen. And if you don’t know how to defend yourself and your family, you might want to learn….
In the meantime, live everyday as if it were your last. If you love life, then LIVE!
August 20, 2006 at 5:43 pm
Red Dawn,
Welcome aboard.
Can’t wait to get a bowl of that chili.
“The only thing we can do is turn to God for peace in our hearts, knowing that, in the end, all will be made right; nothing happens that He does not allow to happen”. Amen
Have Faith , live a Courageous life, cherish your Freedom, help your friends, Love your family .And don’t forget to have a sense of humor!
One for All ,All for One.
AMERICA!
E PLURIBUS UNUM.
August 20, 2006 at 6:30 pm
Big Jake-
Just made a huge pot of chili yesterday for me and my husband and some friends so we could all sit down and watch some pre-season football. God I love this country!
You know chili’s always better on the second day so I’ll be right over with it!
On a less gloomy note, I believe we could topple the Iranian government as easily as we toppled the Afghan or Iragi government. I’m sure the women over there, at least the educated ones, would be thrilled. Hey, maybe we need to put the girls in power over there—guys, I’ve found the solution! Let’s topple all of the middle eastern moslem governments and put women in control. I’m sure they would be far more inclined to avoid war and chaos because women naturally want better for their children. Oh, wait…the moslems have to have someone to fight, so I suppose the moslem men would make jihad on the moslem women…well, now, THAT could work!
I know, I know, how politically incorrect.
August 20, 2006 at 7:08 pm
I think he’s going to push the button. He said it loud and clear:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,205883,00.html
August 20, 2006 at 7:33 pm
I don’t believe he has a “button” to push just yet.
Even if he did, Israel would obliterate Iran. They could obliterate every country in the middle east if they so desired.
I hope the Iranian leadership is not so delusional as to truly think they could take on Israel or the U.S.in any major way without being destroyed.
August 20, 2006 at 8:04 pm
Red Dawn,
I believe that Golda Meir said that there would be no peace in the middle east until Arab mothers loved their children more than they hated Israeli children. Pretty sad ,Huh?
By the way – Is that 3 alarm chili?
MMMMMMM…MMMM! say hello to Hubby for me .
August 20, 2006 at 9:12 pm
Bubblerz… If US/Israeli foreign policy is to blame for the Islamic extremest, then explain the Islamic extremist before America ever existed? Don’t be an ostrich, look at life in the eyes of an Israeli. They live in a country which was theirs before they were driven out and then returned to them. They are surrounded by nations which hate them and have tried to rid the area of them ever since. So, explain to all of us here what you think their foreign policy should be or better yet exactly which of their foreign policies you have a problem with…maybe it is self-preservation.
Israel attacks when it is attacked. It never prevokes, just defends…which it does quite well. They have to. Granted, they may get jumpy and preemptive but with good reason. Fear instilled from past attacks by its neighbors. If they did not, then they would be over run, killed and/or driven out yet again. People may not like the “Jews,” since they “own everything.” If this is the case, get off your ass and be a better doctor, lawyer, scientist or business person. They succeed because they want to. They have contributed more to your life now than any other nationality.
It would be sad to have to eliminate an entire people. However, it is those people who are trying to eliminate us. If there were history of peaceful coexistance between Islam and any other religion, we would not even be discussing this topic. The problem is there isn’t. They seek destruction to every infidel. It is either convert or be killed. This is what they do.
As far as going in and taking out the Iranian government, we could do that just as we did in Afgan and Iraq. The failure to this mentality is, “How long will relations last?” Sure they (The US supported govs of those lands) are “with us,” but in their hearts they are not. They loathe us. We did what they could not do themselves.
The people there were glad to see us come. We freed them from oppression; an oppression they have lived under longer than any of them have been around for. Yet, they still do not like us because we do not believe as they do. We are still infidels.
Bubblerz, if you were trapped and dying, and I came along you would be happy to see me. That is until I rescued you. Then you would go about your marry way and talk shit about me and tell your friends how you were just about freed when this brainwashed sheep helped you.
August 20, 2006 at 9:39 pm
I’m adopting Eagle’s method of reply:
#113 Eagle – NOW lost any credibility they had when they didn’t come out on record against President Clinton’s antics. Had Clinton been a Republican, we would have seen NOW blast him to the moon and back and everyone knows it. They are an ethically bankrupt group.
#111 Big Jake – I’m not a regular church goer, but I do believe in a higher being and I try to live my life by the 10 commandments. If everyone did that, this world would be in much better shape. Like you, I watched those Superman shows along with Batman and my favorite, Underdog. I love this Country and go back to saying to those who don’t … find some place you like better and move there. Stop trying to change this Country. Most of us like it the way it is. If you don’t, it’s okay, we’ll let you leave.
#120 Ricky – I’ll give you credit that you found a place you liked better than the US and you moved there. (I’ll give you a call when I need cheaper meds and you can give me a call when you need elective surgery.) Call the media in this country whatever you want but I can watch CNN, Fox, ABC, NBC, and CBS and get 3 different sides of an issue. Tell me how many sides of an issue Al-Jazz gives its viewers. In America, Hezbollah sympathizers can take to the streets in protest, burn our flag, say anything they want about our political leaders and live to tell about it. How long do you think an American doing the same in Tehran would last? In addition, these countries treat the carpet they wipe their filthy boots on better than they treat their women. If you were female, that might actually make you think twice about your opinions.
#131 – Red Dawn – yes it does send chills down the spine but I’m not afraid. I won’t wear their burqas, face scarves, robes, and anything else they think women need to be covered with. If things ever get to that point, they’ll be on the receiving end of guerilla warfare.
August 20, 2006 at 11:39 pm
Americanwoman–
I’m not afraid either. I’ll do ANYTHING to protect my two daughters from beasts like that. America originated the concept of “guerilla warfare” during the American Revolution. Back then, there were only 1/3 of Americans (the others too afraid to fight or siding with the British empire) who fought that war and we sent the world’s biggest empire packing. I hope that the moslems who wish to destroy this country realize that, for all the POLITICALLY INCORRECT American sheep that are out there wanting to “turn the other cheek” and who want to have “dialog” with the crazies realize that the ones who were willing to fight and die for our liberation in the revolution are still ALIVE and WELL today.
August 21, 2006 at 12:14 am
EAGLE ,AMERICANWOMAN,RED DAWN and all other interested parties:
Check this out. God Bless the USA
http://www.faithflashes.com/withyou.html
August 21, 2006 at 12:53 am
Red Dawn: I appreciate the comment. I am one who was raised in believing that there will be two “raptures” (although the word “rapture is not mentioned in my Bible-it is said to be the coming of Christ). The first coming of Christ (according to my Bible) will occur on a day when not only the Arab nations, but China and Russia and several other countries, excluding the States, will attack Israel. This marks the end of the church age. After the first coming, the seven years of tribulation follow..and as you said this is the time of the Antichrist. The Lord will come “down” a second time..and during this time he is to rule the world for 1,000 years and Satan is to be bound for 1,000 years. After these 1,000 years, there will be a judgement day. I can honestly say I am not entirely estute on the matter..if that isn’t obvious..which I’m sure it is. I know only of the armegeddon, not when it is to occur. I like to live believing what I have been taught for two reasons: one- I don’t like change..so basically, I wouldn’t adapt to believing otherwise and two- for comfort reasons. I like to believe that I, along with thousands others, will be taken from this earth before wars greater than anyone can fathom and the reigning of the Antichrist. Thank you for responding.
August 21, 2006 at 3:08 am
Worriedsince16… Who does like change, unless it makes us feel good. Being comfy is the place to be, also. On a real note, I would like to offer you these words of advice. It would be nice to be taken away before any real trouble shows itself. That is comfort and also reassuring. However, on the downside to this, if it does not happen then what? I can only say this. Do not lose your faith. People teach alot of different ideology. The main thing to remember is that it will be your faith which saves you. If being a Christian is real to you, then do not allow a teaching which only started in the late 1800’s be the basis of your last stand. God treated Israel badly for turning away from Him, but He never truly abandoned them. They went through everything and it was for purification and to bring them back to Him. In the event the church does not go, look to the lessons of Israel and stay steadfast. The Bible says many will lose their lives, but those who stay steadfast He will deliver.
Just my thought, but I think that if the rapture does not happen it will cause alot of “Chirstians,” to question “What else was I taught that is not correct?” If you believe everything the Bible says is true in what is going to take place, then it is going to get worse than anyone could imagine. This will be the shaking which Christ spoke of.
On the other hand, if none of it is true and there is no religion shit sure looks scary anyway you look at it.
I agree with my fellow poster here, just live your days the best you can, provide for your children and teach them to the best of your abilities. If the push of Islam or China or any other comes to my door they better expect NOT to get a kind welcome. I will defend my family with every last breath.
August 21, 2006 at 3:17 am
So Iran wants to wipe out Israel so the world can have another Islamic state. That’s all we DON’T need, another bastion of Islamic fascists to spread more hatred and murder! The enemies of Israel, throughout history, have shown over and over and over again how utterly stupid it is to shake their fist at God!
August 21, 2006 at 4:04 am
Big Jake–
That was beautiful.
worriedsince16–
I’m not sure how it all plays out, but I AM quite sure that the victor won’t be Imam Madhi riding a flying horse named Burqa.
Stay strong, stay true, reach out to all your people around you. Our God will not let us down. Be at peace, my friend. When the time comes, a better time will be at hand.
August 21, 2006 at 4:11 am
Onthisnote: that is my question a lot. I often wonder if any of it really will happen..if the Word is being translated correctly. I try to stay strong in my faith..and usually I do an excellent job. The only time it is ever faulted is at church..I often find myself questioning the pastor in my head..throwing questions at him..”What if you are wrong?” and “What makes you think you know how and when it will happen?” Childish questions..maybe. But they come to my mind every Sunday. The only thing he ever preaches about anymore is the rapture. His persistence causes me to question. Every Sunday morning and evening I can expect to question my faith..but any other time during the week, I am as strong as ever.
August 21, 2006 at 4:12 am
Long live Israel and the people of the free states…America, Canada, Britain, Australia…all the rest. We are brethern.
August 21, 2006 at 4:17 am
worriedsince16–
I have been through what you are describing with a pastor that placed too much emphasis on the rapture. If you are saved, you are saved. Period. We do nothing to merit this. There is not an invisible line drawn the way you live your life…if you belong to Him, you belong to Him.
Do not second guess.
August 21, 2006 at 5:01 am
Thought you’d like to read some simple American philosophy
—————-
Memorable John Wayne Quotes:
“Sure I wave the American flag. Do you know a better flag to wave? Sure I love my country with all her faults. I’m not ashamed of that, never have been, never will be. I was proud when President Nixon ordered the mining of Haiphong Harbor, which we should have done long ago, because I think we’re helping a brave little country defend herself against Communist invasion. That’s what I tried to show in The Green Berets and I took plenty of abuse from the critics.” – John Wayne
John T. Chance (Rio Bravo):
“Sorry don’t get it done, Dude.”
Sergeant John M. Stryker (Sands of Iwo Jima):
“A lot of guys make mistakes, I guess, but every one we make, a whole stack of chips goes with it. We make a mistake, and some guy don’t walk away – forevermore, he don’t walk away.”
John Bernard Books (The Shootist):
“I won’t be wronged, I won’t be insulted, and I won’t be laid a hand on. I don’t do these things to other people and I expect the same from them.”
Ringo Kid (Stagecoach):
“Well, there are some things a man just can’t run away from.”
Hondo Lane (Hondo):
“I don’t guess people’s hearts got anything to do with a calendar.”
Hondo Lane (Hondo):
“Yup. The end of a way of life. Too bad. It’s a good way. Wagons forward! Yo!”
Capt. Rockwell Torrey (In Harm’s Way):
“All battles are fought by scared men who’d rather be some place else.”
Colonel Madden (Back to Bataan):
“This kind of war, you’ve gotta believe in what you’re fighting for.”
Tom Doniphon (The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance):
“Out here a man settles his own problems.”
Duke Gifford (Operation Pacific):
“He was a good man. Make sure that it says so on the patrol report.”
Tom Dunson (Red River):
“Every time you turn around expect to see me. ‘Cause one time you’ll turn around and I’ll be there, and I’ll kill you, Matt.”
Marshall J.D. Cahill (Cahill, U.S. Marshall):
“Cause even grown men need understanding.”
Col. Michael Kirby (The Green Berets):
“Out here, due process is a bullet.”
Col. David Crockett (The Alamo):
“Republic. I like the sound of the word.”
August 21, 2006 at 5:34 am
to myles.
havn’t they ever taught you that Allah is Yhwy, who is G-d?
to mechadrum, I don’t agree with you up until the part about scripture. yea, yea, the end of the world is gonna happen soon, we should all kinda just get over it. but Jews were very similar to the muslims. Yhwy helped them many times in battle against peoples who did not claim Him as their god, or people that stood in the way of the Israelites on their way to the promised land.
sorry that this post is so late. I just found this article. and also my appologies to the two people I called out, if someone before me did this already.
August 21, 2006 at 7:27 am
“T” minus one day!!!! I think back to Harry Callahan who said, “Go ahead…Make my day!” And for all the pacifist – the great words of wisdom from Rodney King, “Can’t we all, jist git along?!” No Rodney, some people just want to riot, kill, and burn things to the ground…
#125 Worriedsince16: You REALLY should worry more about safety behind the wheel of a car as 45,000 people die each year in this country alone. (Hopefully that should put your concerns in order) PS: 1.5 MG of Melatonin should help you with your insomnia…
#127 weasel187: If someone murdered your loved one would you really equate that with someone who hates but does nothing physical? Just a rhetorical question…
#130 Kanook: Religion was created by man – God’s word was there before man, before this world, before the beginning of what we call time, and even before Canada where all the Dinosaurs still live and sometimes work…
.#132 Red Dawn – Yes!! Let’s go for the Chili! As far as the world coming to an end – the rebirth will occur. As a Christian you know that God has already won the great battle. With that in mind, I would rather make the spiritual transition (we call death) fighting evil than wasting away in a hospital at 99 years of age. If it is peace we are looking for, we can only achieve this through strength and determination to fight those who threaten us whether it is President AmadHater, or criminals taking over our neighborhoods…
#135 Kike el hombre: He said Israel hit the self-destruct button with the Lebanon invasion. Hey, Israel didn’t hit Lebanon that hard. Actually, by backing off they are allowing the world to see how ineffective the UN (Useless Nations) is in dealing with this problem so they can later on take Syria out as well. Don’t forget also that the Arabs (Iranians are Persians) are VERY worried about Iran’s growing influence. So I don’t think the Iranian leader is firing on all cylinders.
#139 Americanwoman: Thanks for fixing my reply method – the spaces look better! Nice valid points as well!
#140 Red Dawn: OBL had stated “I say to you William (Defence Secretary) that: These youths (Islamics) love death as you loves life.”
This was obviously years before our invasion (Afghanistan/Iraq) where he laughed at Clinton’s retreat from Mogadishu.
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1996.html
It was the precursor to what we now call 9/11 – something that happened BECAUSE we were thought of as weak. He NEVER thought Americans would react as we have because he (like most other Islamofacist) doesn’t understand Americans. While the news media shows the weak amongst us to the world, the strong quietly wait for the word…..GO!
#141 Big Jake: Very nice, TY
#143 Onthisnote: Very well put! Remember (worriedsince16) that it is about your relationship with HIM more so than anything else – worry not, trust in Him.
#144 J. Brown: Yea. Not a good thing to be on God’s bad side – Let’s just hope this country doesn’t turn against Israel as we too will be cursed.
August 21, 2006 at 12:34 pm
I haven’t seen (or recall) anyone providing links for a comparison of our Bible and the Koran. Try this one: http://www.lamblion.com/New08.php.
It’s very informative, but does contain some typical, conservative, “the-devil-is-behind-Islam” rhetoric. But, hey, you should expect that. What is interesting is the “thumb-nail” history of Mohammed, his “revelations,” how his works were compiled, and then how he “adjusted” the very tenents that he developed.
This is just a “Reader’s Digest” version of the events and someone has to have by now written an excellent expose on Mohammed, his life, and the Koran. I, by no means, consider it definitive; just a morsel to whet your appetite for more information.
So, which of the below fits you:
“The truth is out there.”
“The truth shall set you free.”
“You can’t handle the truth!”
August 21, 2006 at 2:07 pm
Regards to you All,
For those of you who are offended by Islam please refer to the real sources to learn about that beautiful religion rather than looking at extremist practistioners who we muslims dont regard as muslims. Plus don’t get the information from the biased media and governments who like to show Islam as a religion of tyranny and terror.
Please check the following books on this site
http://books.shiachat.com/
God be with you
Regards
Nader ( Lebanon )
August 21, 2006 at 3:35 pm
#152 DJ: The link you have states “error 404, Lost your way?”- Funny way for a ministry to put it (bad web link). One would have to suspect some kind of slant with reference to Mohammad, although most sources (even non-Christian) parallel the same disturbing history.
#153 Nader: Are you related to Ralph by chance? (sorry I couldn’t resist that) Anyhow – regards to you too! I’m sure that many Moslems are sincere and benevolent, although I am puzzled why Islamics are very slow to respond (if at all) to aid their OWN people in times of natural disasters – i.e. The great Tsunami off the coast of Indonesia, earthquakes in the Pakistani Mountains during last winter, floods, famine, etc. where massive aid and support mainly came from the USA – her Military and the citizens of “The Great Satan” as we in America are called by Islamic religious people. Because of the Internet, most of us DON’T believe our government and Media (who actually tries to hide the hideous part of Islam), but we view what Islamics post themselves such as the beheadings of helpless people screaming in fear and pain, gurgling in their own blood while Moslems saw their heads off yelling “Allah Akbar”. The rhetoric from the Sunni sect (Al Qaeda) and the Shia sect (Persian Ayatollahs, Imams, Hezbullies, etc) pretty much educates us all where we stand and that is with our backs to the wall. Islam IS about HATE (killing the infidel – Jews are monkeys, Death to America, etc), Jesus IS about LOVE – even your enemy! While Moslems pray to Allah for the destruction of America and dance in the streets (as they did) when the Twin Towers went down killing thousands indiscriminately, Christians pray for those in stricken countries, volunteer, and send hard earned money (aid) to victims of the same people who hate us. Yes it is true that there are extremist within Islam while most are not direct participants – but what we also see is the “choice” within your faith NOT to reform itself as Christians have by removing the doctrine of hate and Jihad. When your people do that, we will know that Moslems are willing to coexist peacefully with people considered “non-Islamic”. Until then, even those “pacifist” Moslems are enablers by contributing money for the Jihad even indirectly.
August 21, 2006 at 4:45 pm
#130 Kanook Says:
August 20th, 2006 at 6:13 am
To all you Chosen Ones (cause you look so good) and Bible Thumpers, answer me this? If religion was created by GOD (omnipotent et al.) and not man, why no mention of the dinosaurs? Hmm, why? M’kay?
first off the term is “Bible Thumbers” why would we “thump” it? what good is thumping going to do??
secondly, the book of Job makes mention of dinosaurs, i believe its in chapters 37 and 38.
August 21, 2006 at 5:22 pm
Someone please stop Stoognook from plagurizing even peoples’ questions from Yahoo Answers. Dude, come up with your own stuff. You bore us with your repeats of words gone by.
Eagle has said it again very nicely. The problem is exactly as stated. If you so called True Islamics do not consider these extremest muslims why do you put up with them? Why do you let them teach their hate?
As I stated in an earlier post, you know who they are and where there are. If they are teaching false doctrine, and misleading your people (I guess to the opposite place where good muslims go) they are worse than we are. You should have jihad against them and wipe them out so as eagle says, “we will know that Moslems are willing to coexist peacefully with people considered “non-Islamic”, ” and are not about what you say the extremest are for.
Again I say it is because you want them to continue to kill the infidels which are non-muslim. You are just as guilty as the terrorist or extremist for allowing them to continue.
No one has to listen to the media. Just look at history to see what Islam is about and what they have done. I don’t think FOX News was around when you guys started your quest to cleanse the world of the infidel. Convert or Be killed. I think Mohammad got that from the Inquisition.
August 21, 2006 at 5:29 pm
Worriedsince16…the best thing you can do is educate yourself. Do not listen to one person’s ideas and think “That is it.” Read, research and listen to your heart. The truth is out there, you just need to find it.
Questioning people is what has kept us alive for so long. If the congregation of Jim Jones would have questioned him, they might be alive today. If the memeber or Heaven’s Gate would have looked outside the Nike box and questioned their beloved leader, they would be alive today.
Questions are good, so keep asking and keep seeking til you find what you feel comfortable believing.
August 21, 2006 at 7:06 pm
#153 Nader “…that beautiful religion…” Hmmm. We “extremist practistioners who (you) muslims don’t regard as muslims” are no more extremist in our views than you in yours. We disagree with the patriarchal mind-set of your beliefs and the treatment of your women (#131 Red Dawn “…the horrific plight of the Iranian women and the thought of living, as a woman, under such a monstrous system…,” but agree to live and let live. I’m sure Red Dawn’s comments echo most American women’s and probably quite a few in the world as a whole. But don’t interpret our inaction as acceptance. As stated in another post above, when push comes to shove, we get, as Clint Eastwood said in “The Outlaw Josie Wales,” “plain mad-dog mean.” So, if you wish to live peacefully next to us in this world, go your way and we’ll go ours. But if some hoochie-coochie pop artists offends you, just walk away. If a modern women with rights threatens you, get used to it. This is the 21st century. Only the blind and isolated can appreciate an oppressive religion the likes of Islam. When given the chance to think, they will. Deal with it.
#154 Eagle. That’s odd. I copied the link from Google after querying what Christians think of the Koran (or something to that affect). Also kudos on the challenge to the “moderate” mulims reigning in their extremist brethren. I’d count on the sandwiches from Vera showing up first.
August 21, 2006 at 7:08 pm
re post #130 Kanook Says:
August 20th, 2006 at 6:13 am
To all you Chosen Ones (cause you look so good) and Bible Thumpers, answer me this? If religion was created by GOD (omnipotent et al.) and not man, why no mention of the dinosaurs? Hmm, why? M’kay?
Ok Kanook this one’ for you!
The Flintstones Frequently
Asked Questions List
——————————————————————————–
11. Hold on, didn’t the dinosaurs die out quite some time before the first humans appeared on Earth?
Yes, but this is fantasy! Live with it.
Table of Contents | Next FAQ
——————————————————————————–
This Page Maintained by John Paul Murphy
http://www.topthat.net/webrock/faq.htm
Flintstones, meet the Flintstones
They’re the modern stone-age family
From the town of Bedrock
They’re a page right out of history
Let’s ride with the family down the street
Through the courtesy of Fred’s two feet
When you’re with the Flintstones
Have a yabba-dabba-doo time
A dabba-doo time
You’ll have a gay old time
August 21, 2006 at 8:25 pm
[...] It’s also known as 27 Rajab and 31 Mordad, depending upon your calendar. Around the blogoshpere and elsewhere, various interpretations of the significance of August 22 have been offered. As I’ve reported, Farid Ghadry, the president of the Reform Party of Syria says that the Iranians have chosen August 22 for the date of their response because it is “the Night of the Sira’a and Miira’aj, the night Prophet Mohammed (saas) ascended to heaven from the Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem on a Bourak (Half animal, half man), while a great light lit-up the night sky, and visited Heaven and Hell also Beit al-Saada and Beit al-Shaqaa (House of Happiness and House of Misery) and then descended back to Mecca.” The idea has been seconded by Muslim historian Bernard Lewis. Zionist.com states that August 22 also corresponds “with the Islamic date of Rajab 28, the day Saladin conquered and entered Jerusalem,” and that says that there is a rumor that Ahmadinejad believes that on August 22, 2006, “the so-called ‘hidden’ Imam Mahdi who Allah has miraculously kept alive since his disappearance in 874 AD. . . . will return . . . and usher in an era of (Islamic) justice.” And I, myself, have offered that among Shi’ite Muslims, the date also corresponds with the date upon which Muhammad began his prophetic mission. [...]
August 21, 2006 at 9:24 pm
I do not beleive in any sort of religion.
I do beleive that there are eccentric groups of people that are strong beleivers in religion.
And I beleive enough that there IS something to be scared about- in regards to a nuclear holocaust. Why everyone else should be involved is beyond me..
August 21, 2006 at 9:26 pm
how can you say you do not hate these people, and you’re trying to save them by fighting for them… when you make up the most revolting, racsit names for them.
You hate these people America, stop pretending you don’t.
August 22, 2006 at 2:25 am
QWERTY–
WE (Americans)do not hate these people. These PEOPLE hate us and have said so. Their religion and way of life is flat out intolerant of anyone else’s way of life or beliefs. They have stated they wish to kill (and have done so) any culture that does not believe as they do.
WE AMERICANS see no choice but to iradicate the threat before it truly come back to haunt us forever more.
WE HAVE NO CHOICE.
August 22, 2006 at 2:46 am
M.S.blood–
Perhaps you do not believe in any sort of religion. In America and many other civilized free countries this would be allowed.
In an Islamist country, you would be beheaded or stoned for such an outspoken thought. Or perhaps inprisoned and tortured for years. If you do not believe me, please go and google all of the sites Arab women have managed to put up categorizing the lack of rights they have and the atrocities many have endured by daring to speak out.
Unfortunately, unless you want to convert to Islam and live in this way, someone will have to defend the rights that you do have.
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE. There is always, and has always been, a price to pay.
August 22, 2006 at 2:48 am
You people are lunatics. I will, with others, sequester our Country back from idiots that don’t read or try to even fake understanding what this world and life is really about.
People that cannot see the other side of things fall prey to their own ignorant ways. Fear has overcomed your mental stability and you endanger all of us while you spew hate for other races, when you don’t even know what they’re about. You watch Fox News and read the daily standard and are on board with the PNAC, because you are weak. Weak people will destroy the world.
August 22, 2006 at 5:20 am
Finally somebody said something intelligent. I love how many people think they know exactly what the military will do. And the real story behind all the cover ups. Guess what… you don’t. I have never heard a group of people more high and mighty. And hateful.
Here is a scenario for you: oops you were born in Iran! You don’t believe the same way the radical religion in your country does. But I guess that doesn’t matter because you were born in Iran. And half the unUnited States wants you dead and your country “turned into a parking lot” Well sorry pal. Im sure everyone is already thinking oh shutup liberal or hippi or whatever name helps give you an excuse to continue to be ignorant. I wish everyone could give up hate for a little while. And see if they feel any better about themselves.
August 22, 2006 at 8:29 am
The world ends today
http://kaktose.wordpress.com/2006/08/22/the-world-ends-today/
August 22, 2006 at 9:06 am
Eagle..I think I love you..And American Woman..I don’t know why you object to wearing a borqa…it’s a great way to conceal the club to bash these creeps. And Vera..I’d love to see you hook up with a moslem guy…I’m sure you could talk some sense into him…and to the other moron who thinks 9-11 is the fault of American Corporations….give me a break…it wasn’t CEO’s piloting those planes. I’m so tired of all these bleeding hearts who think you can talk and reason with these loons..you can’t…the only thing that will fix their brain is a bullet.
August 22, 2006 at 11:11 am
america couldn’t win in vietnam, how will they win in iran? just like Alice in wonder land tale.. you dont know your countries real abilities. don’t watch superman or xmen movies too much children.
israel attacked hizbullah with the most advanced weapons, and hizbullah attacked them with forks and knives. what is the result?
118 israel soldier killed by hibullah, and 1100 civilians killed by israel not face to face. only one or two hundred of them are hizbullah guerillas.
this is a terrible result! consider if those hi tech weapons are with hizbullah, what would happen?
don’t dream boys. there are 1.5 billion muslims in the world, and they will exist until the end of time.
thanks to god that american state is more clever then citizens of america.
you don’t know much about the realities of the world. no need to argue.
i was born as a muslim in turkey. then i realized that there is no god. now every fellow muslim hates me:) i hate all religions and religious people.
oh today is 22 august. nothing happened! it is not that easy as you see. try to be rational.
August 22, 2006 at 11:18 am
Logic says–
“You watch Fox News and read the daily standard and are on board with the PNAC…” Well, either you spend a great deal of time watching FOX news yourself or you’re just yacking the typical, uninformed liberal rhetoric. How would you know ANY of these views are espoused on FOX news unless you watch FOX yourself? Well, never mind. Repeat what I said above. If you believe watching ANY network news channel gives you a clear picture of what is going on in the world, YOU need to do some major research (like many TRULY educated people do)and spend a couple of hours each day taking in the news from British, French, Arabic, Jewish, Japanese, Russian papers, articles, and commentary. Perhaps then you might see that your “logic” is based on faulty and/or inaccurate information, assumptions, and party politics.
Obviously you do not really understand what our little aMAD Hatter in Iran believes in or intends to do. Maybe not today, or tomorrow, but he certainly plans on doing it. I know it may be the “logical” thing to want to bury your head in the sand like an ostrich and some of what we are saying is making covering your eyes and ears difficult– unfortunately doing either of these things will not make the disturbing things happening in the world go away.
thanks logic–
“Here is a scenario for you: oops you were born in Iran! You don’t believe the same way the radical religion in your country does. But I guess that doesn’t matter because you were born in Iran. And half the unUnited States wants you dead and your country “turned into a parking lot”
This has not been the view point of many posts here in this context. This is completely taken out of context…several posters here, including myself, DO not hate these people and have expressed a real regret that any action such as “turning Iran into a parking lot” may have to be carried out. However, if it comes down to the safety of Americans and our allies versus the Iranians and Islamic terrorists, well, naturally most Americans’ choice would be a LOGICAL desire to survive. Now some of you out there might prefer to chop off your own heads and your family’s heads and hand them to aMAD and his rabid clerical tea party as opposed to taking care of the threat with appropriate action; it is people like us who will make the LOGICAL choice and make the tough decisions and save you from yourselves.
August 22, 2006 at 6:25 pm
#169 AnotherMAD from Turkey – I’ve got a few things for you to consider. First, it’s much easier (and wiser) for an enemy who can’t survive on a battlefield in man-to-man combat, to use guerilla warfare tatics. It’s especially advantageous when you know the opposing force (US or Israel) won’t stoop to that level. Put the war on this soil and you’re going to find out exactly what we’re willing to do to make sure we survive. It won’t be pleasant. Second, I don’t think I’d go so far to liken a fiducia rocket to a stick or knife. Third, there’s nothing wrong with a religion that teaches you to care for fellow man. As I mentioned, I’m not a churchgoer, but I do think mankind would benefit by living by the 10 commandments. I try to treat other people like I want to be treated. That doesn’t mean I’m gonna be walked on. You’ve gotta use common sense. Please note that Red Dawn, Big Jake, and Eagle didn’t attack me because I’m not a regular churchgoer. On the contrary, they have been supportive of most of my viewpoints in spite of the fact that I don’t go to church or know the Bible as they do. It’s not okay that your life is in jeopardy in Turkey because you have shun the Muslim religion. What does that tell you about the general practice of that religion in your country? I’d invite you to move here, but only if you’re willing to work for a living and look at women as an ally and equal rather than an evil force. Women in this Country helped their husbands forge the wild west. We may look weak but trust me when I say, we are not.
August 22, 2006 at 8:09 pm
This whole conflict is because of religion. Just Remember, religion is MAN MADE. That’s why it’s all screwed up most of the time. Christ rebelled against the religion of His day. That’s why they crucified Him. He came to expose all the errors and hypocrisy. But at least His message was of love and forgiveness. What’s Allah’s message? You have Muslims saying how beautiful the religion is and then you have Muslims that live to kill people that don’t think like they do. All in the name of Allah. There is only ONE TRUE GOD, and He has a name. And it’s NOT Allah. Our God is Adonai, Yahweh, Jehovah. And He has several more. All of them describing HIS personality. And His chosen people are the JEWS and you can rest assured that no Muslim or anyone else is ever going to be permitted to wipe them out. You can try, but you’ll always fail. There will always be a remnant left of His people. And HE gave the land Israel to THE JEWS. IT’S THERE’S. AND IF THE JEWS WOULD’VE DONE WHAT GOD TOLD THEM TO DO A LONG TIME AGO, THEY WOULDN’T BE HAVING TO PUT UP WITH ALL THE CRAP THEIR ENEMIES ARE GIVING THEM. Hey American Girl, you say you don’t go to church but you try to live by the 10 commandments. Good for you. But you should really grab a Bible and see what it has to say. Christianity is NOT a religion. It’s a way of life. It’s a relationship with JESUS CHRIST. And HE will return very, very soon. So, if I were you, don’t count on the 10 commandments to save you. It’s nice you’re a good person and I know you’re smart just from reading you’re blogs. But, get real smart. Get saved. Ask God to show you the Truth. He will. And don’t let the cares of this world and all the evil going on in it get you down. All these people were defeated at the cross. Satan knows it and he also know his time is running out. That’s why he’s working so hard right now. He doesn’t want to go to Hell by himself. And another thing. God doesn’t send anyone to Hell. You send yourself for not believing in the only begotten Son of God who came and died for YOU. (And if you were the only one in the world, He would’ve done it JUST FOR YOU!
God Bless YOU.
August 22, 2006 at 9:37 pm
Americanwoman: you are true, that i might be exaggerated things, everybody does here.
the viper: do you think jew are chosen people really? what are they chosen for? Yahuda betrayed Jesus, he is chosen to betray maybe.
dont think that you are something just because america is on your side for today. nothing lasts too long, it just depends on another serious global economical crisis to leave you alone in hundreds of millions muslim arabs. when there will be no more petrol, you will be left alone in the wolf dinner. christians don’t like your kind, muslims dont like, you are the most hated society in the world.
all jews think that they are chosen, and consider every other people as animals that created to serve them. this is a sick belief. i wish my country also had a similar belief system:) jews rules we talk.
Americanwoman, personally i dont accept boys and girls are equal. i consider girls much more precious than boys.
if i was a prophet and didn’t seen any acceptance by girls in adolescence, if the girls didn’t like me and hurted me, then i would tell my people that the girls are secondary class of people, they should be beaten if doesnt act as their husbands expectations, and they should cover their entire body like a prisoner. who knows.
maybe i should come to america:) the place that everyone can tell every thought they have freely.
but america is a place of hard work. people must work so hard there for life.. we are very relax here, we are poorer but comfortable:)
August 22, 2006 at 9:47 pm
“Conquest, no plan, hudna, dhimmi” How many catch-phrases do we have here? We could start a 22 August Bingo contest!
The US does not need a pretense to smash Iran or the Norks. Only the Lefties need some sort of reason. The intransigence, international crimes of terror and counterfeiting by both Iran and North Korea are ‘reason’ enough.
War is Diplomacy by other means!
WAAAUGH!!!
August 22, 2006 at 9:59 pm
[...] Go see Armageddon Cocktail Hour. Lots of good stuff in the comments! [...]
August 22, 2006 at 11:17 pm
#173 It’s viBer, not viPer, although I wish I was a viper sometimes.
What were the Jews chosen for? They were chosen as the Line of people that would bring forth the Messiah, Jesus Christ, the Saviour of the world. The majority of Americans will always be on the side of the Jews because the majority of Americans are christians and christians know the Bible teaches that God will Bless those who Bless Israel, and those who curse Israel, God will curse. Read the Bible. It’s Gods word to mankind. And Jews arn’t the terrorists. They have every right to protect themselves. They have every right to exist and be left alone. They have enemies on every border that want nothing more than to destroy them. That little tiny country and all the millions of Muslims around them, yet they still survive, and are strong. Why? Because God has a veil of protection around them. You can hate them all you want, it doesn’t matter. Jesus said not to fear when people hate you, because they hated Him first. Israel is in the palm of God’s hand, and NOTHING will happen to them unless God allows it for His own reasons. In contrast, Muslims hate everybody, even each other. I’ve never seen such a group of people that are so in love with killing innocent people in such inhuman ways. They even kill their own people. They’re so consumed with hatred it’s pathetic, and you Jews “sick”. Give me break, pal. Muslims think they will be rewarded for these horrible acts. Well, I’ve got news for you. They’ll be rewarded alright. One of the things God hates is “hands that shed innocent blood”. All your martyrs are a bunch of crispy critters right now. And where do you come up with the thought that all Jews think people are animals created to serve them? Jews only defend themselves. They didn’t start this thing.
August 23, 2006 at 3:52 am
#160 Armageddon Cocktail hour: Speaking of Farid Ghadry, why not press our leaders to provide Farid a seat at the UN? Not that it would do any good (Useless Nations) BUT it would be a great symbol, no?
#161 M.S. blood: You’re on the right track actually. Man makes religion, which is always fallible. Get away from organized religion and experience a “personal” relationship with God and you will find love.
#162 QWERTY: How’d you ever come up with a name like that! You stole my password! LOL
#165 Logic: I’m so happy to finally see someone stand up and take control of our country, thanks from all of us. Big task ahead of ya there getting the Jennie back in the bottle. You need to get your people back on the plantation watching CNN and reading the NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, and listening to NPR.
#166 thanks logic: You’re way too emotional for logical thinking. It’s been said here that Persians (Iranians) are good people who (70%) actually like America (imagine that!). Maybe (I don’t claim to know) the plan is for our military to help the opposition (if needed) to gain control from the radicals if real elections were ever held.
#168: I love you too
– Hey if the Moslems learned to love, maybe grass would grow over there!
#169AnotherMAD from Turkey: Our politicians lost Vietnam – we had rules of engagement that restricted us from doing what a military does best. This could have been because Vietnam was a conflict and never declared a war since bankers funding the North Vietnamese could’ve been tried for treason. As far as Iran, change is brewing from within.
Israel fought that war with limitations imposed on it by a liberal leader. The thought apparently is to expose the UN peacekeeping force as ineffective so they can finish the job in the future when Hisbullies fire more death at innocent civilians in the near future. Why they need to justify anything to a Jew hating world is beyond me. We also know that many of the “1100” civilians were Hisbully reservist and people that were MADE to stay as corpses for CNN cameras.
Not all 1.5 billion Moslems are united, as you may know. There are serious differences between the Shias, Sunnis, Kurds, and other sects that make up your figure (actually 1.3 billion but who’s counting). Most Moslems in this world are killed by Moslems so maybe the problem starts with the common denominator: Islam. Look, there’s plenty of room in this world for opposing beliefs – we in America have a history of welcoming all types (even Jehovah Witnesses!) AS LONG AS THEY ARE PEACEFUL and respect others while happily coexisting.
Religion is man made and subject to corruption and worse as mentioned earlier – Jim Jones, David Koresh, etc. If God exist, then he is independent of these religions that sour His name and lead people astray.
#171 Americanwoman: You are 100% just that!
BTW, I’m not a churchgoer either although I do have a strong belief system.
#173 AnotherMAD from Turkey: I think viber meant well although he is a bit immature about it (even if he is 60). Maybe he should pray to the Lord for wisdom in reaching out to people rather than driving them away (which could be a sin).
As far as what you think of the US: America is made up of all kinds of people – many just like you. She is not just a country; she is an idea and way of life. You have the freedom to excel or fail, work hard to have much, or just be satisfied with the bare necessities. You can worship – or not, vote for your candidate or stay home. It IS the land of the free and the home of the brave. (PLAY BALL!)
August 23, 2006 at 4:25 am
Eagle …Bull’s eye
“America is made up of all kinds of people – many just like you. She is not just a country; she is an idea and way of life”.
August 23, 2006 at 4:52 am
Eagle: It’s funny you say that..I got in a wreck today (the 22nd)..luckily enough..on my part anyway, it was only a fender bender..the girl who hit me reached down to answer her cell phone and didn’t notice me stopped at a stop light, and ran into the back of me going 45 mph. Believe me, on top of being worried about being attacked by other nations, I am VERY worried about driving around town. I always expect to be hit..my worst fear is the drunken driver. I worry a lot. It’s a bad habbit of mine and trust me, I have been working on it for years. And I have no insomnia problem..I wrote that just to write it.
August 23, 2006 at 10:29 am
Eagle: You’re reply to #173 saying I meant well but I’m immature even if I’m 60. Please let me clarify. I’m not a HE, I’m a SHE. I’ve been married 20 years and have two children. One is in college on a full scholarship and the other is a foreign exchange student. I have a Masters Degree in Business-Accounting, AND a Bachelors in Political Science. My husband and I own and operate a very successful business. If I sound immature because I KNOW what I believe and am not afraid to stand up and be counted, forgive me. I try. I believe God has blessed me, my family, and our business. It is my duty to share the gospel and the TRUTH. I’m passionate about my beliefs, just as everyone who’ blogging seems to be. I’m a reasonable person and always enjoy a good debate. There’s the way I see things, the way others see things, and then there’s the TRUTH. I base what I believe on what the BIBLE teaches, which is TRUTH. I will never exchange the TRUTH for a LIE, no matter how easy, selfish, and convenient. If that is immature, so be it.
August 23, 2006 at 11:29 am
hey Viber, i loved your belief and now i think that the only true religion is Jewish religion.
i want to be a Jew soon! how can i be a Jew honey? or how can Eagle be a jew? can anybody convert himself to a Jewish even he or she didn’t born as a Jew?
i really like jews, my only problem with them is there is no way to be one of them:)
did anybody see a muslim like me before?:)
is it true that christian inquision courts were burning girls because they are witches. or torturing people?
muslims never burn people. they cut hands and foots and heads.
every religion is the same, but what makes europe or america different is they are not dominated by the rules of religion anymore.
countries that are ruled by religious doctrines have no place in this new world.
take care people!
August 23, 2006 at 12:23 pm
AnotherMad from Turkey–
I believe viber is a christian, since she expressed belief in Jesus Christ. If she is jewish (by race) then she is a christian Jew. But I don’t believe she ever said she was Jewish or not. Regardless, viber, I believe you expressed precisely why we as American christians support the Jewish state of Israel and why the Jewish people are the chosen people.
We all become “chosen people” once we accept Jesus as Lord and Savior.
Americanwoman and Eagle–
I am not a churchgoer (currently) either as I do not care for manmade religion but a real relationship with my Lord. Not to say that those that go do not have a personal relationship, just not for me at the present time.
AnotherMad–
” every religion is the same, but what makes europe or america different is they are not dominated by the rules of religion anymore.
countries that are ruled by religious doctrines have no place in this new world. ”
Why didn’t you express this belief early on? Methinks you enjoy playing Devil’s Advocate, no?
August 23, 2006 at 2:04 pm
“..That’s the problem with those emotionally religious fanatics – they act without logic and intellect…”
So does Busy. Did he ask any of the american public before going to war. Did he prove that Iraq had done anything to US soil and the pretext that they might have wmds when all they had was empty sand. Only later to say that it was an honest mistake and put america into a huge debt. Whose going to pay it. Your children will face the debt through tax paying dollars. When will the dumb american red necks wake up.
“The strong white race will survive and the Liberal’s and the evil brown will become extinct..”
Strong white race. PHHHFFFTTTT…give me a break. Google father of internal medicine (ibn sina) and algebre. Point being, every civilization has a cycle. The romans reigned for a thousand years and they’re cycle ended. The western civilization starting from the brit empires are relatively new. So its got nothing to do with the red neck white trash race. The muslims and the mongols occupied half the world before this. If you are any literate or if you ever went to college, you would know your world history…
“…Texasborn Says: Keep an eye on Venezuela..Hugo Chavez is up to something..he’s in bed with the jihadists…”
You represent a red neck state. People like you hail Ann Coulter and her misguided lies that allure you people to beleive every word that the technically inempt republicans tell you. Keep listening to them. You are already a trillion dollars in debt. YOUR TAX PAYING DOLLARS IS PUTTING YOU INTO FURTHER DEBT…wake up u moron…
“…These Persian suicide statesmen spent 8 bloody years fighting Iraq (ended in a stalemate) and what did it take us to conquer Iraq – (3 weeks?) not to mention Afghanistan (a country no military in 5,000 years could conquer)…”
AHAHAHAHAHA…OH WAIT..LET ME CATCH MY BREATHE…HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAH…you dumb freak, the war on iraq and afghanistan was won because there were no armies fighting there. The US death toll in Iraq in three years is higher than the death toll in vietnam in its whole war. Keep your stats straight. Google it up. Plus america is high on debt. Whose going to pay it. YOU TAX Payers are. When are you going to learn. IF you had gone to college and taken a course in econonics, you would have known, that a war in iran will not only mount to great loses of US interests, but will soar oil prices so high that america will go into recession. Even now with the war in lebanon, oil prices are record high. Whose going to control it, Your president bush…lol…
“…Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is the New Hitler…”
Did he attack on any country as a pretext and based on a lie. UHHH..no he didnt. Did Bush…lets see…two countries…
“…Are you aware that over 100,000 blacks in Darfur…”
get your facts straight. the biggest number of ppl killed in modern conflicts is the japanese in world war two when us dropped the bomb on two of their cities. Call it greater good or greater evil. secondly, get ur US history shit together. There were close to a few million indegenious red indians living in the NOrth americas. NOw there are a few thousands. They were all butchered by your forefathers you cave living animals…
“…WAKE UP SHEEP. IRAN IS ABOUT TO (NEXT WEEK) TURN ITS ENTIRE OIL INDUSTRY TO EUROS WHICH WILL SPIN THE US ECONOMY INTO A LITERAL DEPRESSION..THE UNITED STATES “HAS” TO STRIKE IRAN SOON, OR IT WILL SUFFER ECONOMICALLY. SEARCH FOR “IRAN OIL BOURSE”…
whose the caveman now. does this sound like a normal selfless human being. or a radical selfish person who wants to nuke another country (iran) just because he wants to drive his mustang and have cheaper oil. shame on you you primitive creature. shame on your worthless soul.
August 23, 2006 at 5:38 pm
to Knocking some sense into the US white trash..
“AHAHAHAHAHA…OH WAIT..LET ME CATCH MY BREATHE…HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAH”you dumb freak, the war on iraq and afghanistan was won because there were no armies fighting there. The US death toll in Iraq in three years is higher than the death toll in vietnam in its whole war. Keep your stats straight. Google it up.”
OK you better hurry back to your tv set ,you are missing your Jerry Springer show
and by the way check your facts
Vietnam War (1964–1975)
Total servicemembers 8,744,000
Serving in-theater 3,403,000
Battle deaths 47,410
Other deaths in service (theater) 10,789
Other deaths in service (nontheater) 32,000
Nonmortal woundings 153,303
Living veterans 8,295,0001
Gulf War (1990–1991)
Total servicemembers 2,225,000
Serving in-theater 665,476
Battle deaths 147
Other deaths in service (theater) 382
Other deaths in service (nontheater) 1,565
Nonmortal woundings 467
Living veterans 1,852,0001
add 2500+ for Iraq occupation
God Bless our Troops. God speed their return!
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE. There is always, and has always been, a price to pay.
August 23, 2006 at 6:15 pm
knocking some sense into the US white trash–
Oh well, I suppose if my views make me “U.S. white trash” in YOUR opinion, I’ll get over it.
BTW, I’m sure you’re college educated but you might want to brush up on your grammatical skills.
Geez, where do these people come from?
August 23, 2006 at 6:21 pm
knocking some sense into the U.S. white trash–
Oh well, if my views make me “U.S. white trash” in your highly articulate opinion, I’ll get over it.
BTW, I’m sure you’re extremely well-educated but you might want to brush up on your grammatical skills.
Perhaps “Google” could provide you some assistance there.
August 23, 2006 at 6:24 pm
Sorry for repeating myself guys!
Just wanted to add some adjectives and give some helpful advice to our friend.
August 23, 2006 at 6:48 pm
To: “knocking…”
It’s quite obvious that you did not benefit from your “education.” There are numerous grammatical and spelling errors in your “rant,” and that’s all it is. Just another example of people who can’t think for themselves and quote ignorant, pacifist, liberals that have NO CLUE as to what’s going on in the world around them.
Now, what since internal medicine and algebra have the muslims invented/created/established? Ooh, ooh, I know! World instability and an environment of fear that prevents people WORLDWIDE from being able to live a normal life in their own countries. Yeah, that’s Nobel material.
The ONLY thing I’ll give the terrorists credit for is that they have taken guerrilla warfare to heart in a bad way. They aren’t just thinking outside the box, they’re inventing new boxes. As I said in a post earlier they don’t have uniforms, carry/wave a flag, and adapt to their surroundings all too well. If you don’t see that as a threat then I feel for you.
Just because we don’t hear everything you think we need to know doesn’t mean we have a right to know. There’s such a thing as operational intelligence which means, to put it in simple terms you might understand, “keeping one’s cards close to the vest.” We didn’t broadcast on the BBC before the D-Day landing in WW II what beaches we were going to assault. The same goes for today’s war on terrorism. The “average Joe/Jane” doesn’t care what going on around him/her. They just want to be secure in their minds that our government is looking out for them. We need the surveillance programs we have (and more) to counter the terrorists to protect us from future attacks. Whether you want to believe it or not that the government is doing just that, then that’s your right. But in my humble opinion your are grossly uninformed.
In the situation we face in this day and age we must realize that who we fight do not play by the rules, have no value for human life (including yours), and will stop at nothing, to include killing people of their own religion/belief, to realize their goal: world-wide domination of the muslim faith and sharia law.
If that’s the way you care to live I suggest you move to the middle east right now and get a good place in line to pay the tax to allow you to continue to believe in what you want. Oh, I forgot, that’s out the window. You’ll have to convert to Islam. Ooops. Never mind. They want to kill you. Blindfold and cigarette?
August 23, 2006 at 6:58 pm
#182 Red Dawn, no I am not Jewish, but I am a christian and I love the Jewish people. I agree, we’re all God’s people when we accept Christ. Thank you for being supportive of me. I was sure I’d get attacked by everyone blogging, especially by Eagle, which made me feel bad because I really like him. He did make me analyze myself all day, wondering if maybe I am immature. I certainly hope not. I love people and want peace, but I don’t think it’s possible. I get a kick out of AnotherMAD. I don’t know what to think of him other than he’s got some issues. Anyway, it’s been fun.
August 23, 2006 at 7:06 pm
Hey viber…mitts off of Eagle. I already told him I thought I was in love with him and he told me he loved me back, so I get first dibs.
August 23, 2006 at 8:01 pm
Knocking US White Trash: It’s always easy to be a BIG MOUTH when nobody knows who you are. I’m sure you must’ve had the shit kicked out of you most of your life. You’re not only ignorant of your stats, you spell as bad as you think. You’re an idiot. Red neck white trash, huh? You can bet everyone of those Texan red necks could pulvarize you if you had the balls to face one. But you won’t. You’ll either hide behind some woman’s skirt (if you’re not wearing your own) or get shot in the back running away from a fight. So shut the hell up, coward.
And before I forget, lovesamerica, you need to get a boyfriend.
August 23, 2006 at 10:12 pm
hey..new person here. there really is no point debating on the subject of religion or politics..because in general, there are so many points of view, there’s no way anyone could win the argument.
August 24, 2006 at 12:30 am
Duck Hunter, If you’re going to get in on this thing, get in on it, or go hunt some ducks.
August 24, 2006 at 1:27 am
see that’s all you people do on here..try to be rude to everyone else to make yourselves look like you are something special…ok not everyone on here does that..a select few..
August 24, 2006 at 1:50 am
whaa whaa whaa all the way home.
August 24, 2006 at 1:53 am
i don’t recall whining like a baby…oh wait, that was you i heard..ok i’m done.. yall need to go talk about the war and arabs and religion and whatever else.
August 24, 2006 at 1:59 am
duck hunter, you’re right. There’s no winning an argument when there are so many opinions. It’s not really arguing anyway. People just like to throw things out there and see what others have to say. I’m about done with this thing. And don’t take zealot’s comments personally. You can tell he’s not wrapped too tight.
August 24, 2006 at 2:09 am
“viber”..you are very right..and i figured that after he/she replied to my post with “whaa whaa…” i won’t take his/her comments personally..i’m better than that.
“knocking”… what is your obsession with name calling? are we in elementary school again? you don’t have to call people freaks or dumb rednecks..i mean unless that makes you feel better in which case you need to grow up a little. i’m not from texas, but i am from the south..and quite frankly we “dumb rednecks” aren’t as dumb and unsophistocated as you think.
ok, duck hunter is checking out..there’s no need to get all huffy puffy over this.
August 24, 2006 at 3:16 am
to Knocking some sense into the US white trash..
Some friendly advice…
“Get your facts first, then you can distort them as much as you please.”–Mark Twain
August 24, 2006 at 11:41 am
viber and duck hunter–
What most of us enjoy doing here is debating and finding solidarity with people of like mind.
We’ve generally stayed on topic but every now and then someone like “knock some sense into your own head…I mean U.S. white trash” lashes out with just such a rant and the topic spins off a little ways.
There are almost as many points of view on this Iran-armageddon thing as there are on religion and politics and they are rather related, don’t you think?
August 24, 2006 at 8:02 pm
Okay, okay, I owe Duck Hunter an apology. I’m sorry Duck Hunter. I’m really not as rude as I sound. I was ticked yesterday because of the “knock some sense into your own head, U.S. white trash” crap and I was hoping more people would tell this clown where to go. And you were too nice when you joined in. Sorry ’bout that. I do take some offense to Viber saying I’m not wrapped too tight. There’s the muslim on here that isn’t a muslim any more, says he’s an atheist and then gets sarcastic to Viber that he wants to be a Jew, there’s the white trash guy/gal that can’t spell or write a descent sentence that the knocks the U.S., the greatest country in world, and you have women falling all over Eagle like he’s some 6′2″ pretty boy they’re hoping to snag, when in reality, he’s probably some balding, pencil neck with thick glasses, and you say I’m not wrapped too tight!!?? C’mon. Cut me some slack. And yeah, Red Dawn, I think this Iran-Armageddon thing and religion & politics are all related. Too many patriotic, good Americans have been quiet too long. The rest of the world thinks we’re weak because we don’t hit back hard enough. They saw off heads and we think we can negotiate. It’s frustrating. I can’t help it that I get really angry. But, Duck Hunter, you’re a good person from the South, and I love the South, so please don’t hold my rudeness against me.
August 25, 2006 at 12:20 am
Just trying to get a pole of Bush supporters. And who agrees with the war. Should we take the troops out? I’m just curious. I am in the military and about to be deployed and I don’t know where my head is at right now. It would be nice to hear some of Americas’ opinions. Try to picture YOURSELF going over there with a posibility of never coming back. Thanks.
August 25, 2006 at 12:21 am
“zealot”..apology accepted. i know the days you speak of..being ticked off and taking it out on forums. i have things to say to “knocking”, but i have already said them in a previous post. trust me, you are not alone on that one.
on your note about “good americans being quiet too long..” yes, i agree. the “good americans”, as you say, spend too much time watching cspan and fox news, and yelling at the television rather than acting on it. get up! “practice what you preach!” whether it be to the television or a forum or a town meeting.. don’t be silent.
“red dawn”..i understand what the point of this website is, and why the creator of it also added in the “submit comment” button. i’m just saying people shouldn’t take offense over something that is anonymously written online, and definitely shouldn’t try to win the argument by beginning name calling and religion bashing..(and i mean who even cares what side of the country one is from? we are one country.)..because in all reality, you can’t win with religion, politics, what have you. a final decision may be made, but that doesn’t mean you lose or win. okay, this is off the topic of the website like you have pointed out.
August 25, 2006 at 12:30 am
(sorry for the double post, but i wanted to answer the pole for “question”)
“question”…i support bush for several reasons, but his decision in keeping the troops at war is not one of them. he needs to quit taking vacations and be a president. i give you thousands, millions even, of props for being in the military. honestly, you are a hero. i can imagine what your head is going through. i am not in the military, but my grandfather was in the air force. he was sent to vietnam..even though the americans should have stayed out of that war. he never came back. his plane was shot down while he was delivering amo and other things. i know americans are in danger every day, and the muslims want to whipe us off of the face of the earth, but it’s time to bring the troops home. i would like to know what our troops do over seas nowadays..seriously. maybe knowing what they actually do everyday would change my mind.
August 25, 2006 at 1:10 am
Question: I think President Bush is a good man, and I do believe we have to stop these terrorists, but I don’t have a military mind. I know nothing about warfare, so I can only trust that those in power know what they’re doing. My brother is a VietNam Vet, and my father won the bronze star fighting in Italy during WWII. I have great respect for our troops, and I promise you, I will pray for you “Question” throughout the day EVERY day. I can understand your fear. I know I wouldn’t want to be deployed over there. I also have a 19 year old son in college, and the thought of him going over there scares me. He has told me several times that he wants to join the ROTC, and he feels he should do his part in protecting the country, which I admire him for, but as a Mom, it just makes me quiver inside. As Duck Hunter said, you are truly a hero, and my prayers that God will protect you from all harm and danger are already being said.
August 25, 2006 at 2:39 am
I don’t care what side of the country anyone is from. When it comes down to it, we’re just Americans. I love the South because they have a lot of hospitality and are warm and friendly. However, I’m a New Yorker. And I love New York. You can understand what 9-11 did to me. So when these “hate Americans” get on here, and these muslims that have no respect for human life do their butchering to some American soldier just because he’s an American, it just sparks something in me. 9-11 hit all of America, but New Yorkers…well, I guess you just have to be one to really understand.
August 25, 2006 at 2:51 am
Question–
My husband’s son just got out of boot camp and was sent to Okinawa and we worry about him possibly being deployed to the middle east. But HIS stepfather was a private officer in Irag BEFORE he joined the marines and he came back to the U.S. missing an arm and a leg and a good part of his inner organs after a convoy he was in was blown up by a mine laid by insurgents.
Brave boy; obviously believes in this country and what he is fighting for.
I trust Bush. I believe that the Islamic threat HAS to be confronted and something done about the middle east. Better to engage them in fighting, and if they don’t want democracy, encouraging infighting there. Sorry state of affairs but unfortunately the way it is. By fighting them there, our troops defend us here.
zealot–
We all get mad when ignoramuses post irrational rants here…that or laugh at the complete idiocy! LOL!
Certainly we as Americans have enough to contend with without encouraging divisions among those who have like minds.
duck hunter–
To bring the troops home will only worsen the situation. The moslems will only see our withdrawal as weakness and proclaim this throughout their streets. It will only embolden them. We have to stay the course and hand the control incrementally over to the Iraqis, which is what we’re doing.
When is the last time, no matter how many times they’ve threatened or tried, that the radical Islamists have been able to launch a successful attack against us on home soil since 911??? Something to think about.
August 25, 2006 at 3:00 am
I will NEVER forget 911–not what I was doing at the time, what I was thinking, what I was praying…and the images I saw on T.V.
I’m not from N.Y. but I guarantee you, zealot, I was N.Y. THAT day and all out American about what I wanted to see happen to those murdering b@$tards. Nobody does that to MY people and gets away with it! Thank God we had a president in office like Bush insted of some politically correct pansy. The world (as a whole) may not like us now, but I know they sure as anything respect what we’re willing to do to get payback.
August 25, 2006 at 3:38 am
“red dawn”..i like your enthusiasm about pay back. i too feel the same way about it..in this situation. i just need some peace at mind that our troops are actually needed over there. what if we brought them home, and nothing was to happen? i know the chances of nothing happening in that situation are VERY slim to none.. i have a blank and questionable mind on the situation in iraq. partly because i am not there myself, experiencing the war. like i said, if i knew that our troops weren’t just wasting their time over there, my mind may change about bringing them back home.
August 25, 2006 at 3:44 am
I want to start by saying thank you for your thoughtful words. I also want to add an angle that I want everyone to seriously think about before answering…If you had to go to Iraq tomorrow, would you believe that this war is worth your life? And if you are a parent, is it worth your childs’ life?
I don’t want everyone thinking that I’m scared to go. That is not it at all. The way I look at it is if I go then that means somebody gets to come home. Which in turn could save that individuals’ life. What scares me is thinking that what if all of this has been about oil the entire time. Please try to understand what I’m saying before you judge me. I love this country and will support it until I die. But I don’t think anyone should have blind faith when it comes to a government.
August 25, 2006 at 3:49 am
Excellent OP/ED piece in the NY Post today by Ralph Peters.
He says that the Iraqi experiment in Democracy is the Arabs last chance to enter the civilized world and the 21st century.
He states:
“Iraq doesn’t have a democracy in any meaningful sense. It isn’t even a nation. Iraqis didn’t vote for freedom. They voted for revenge against each other”.
“In the immediate aftermath of Operation Iraqi Freedom, I argued that the only realistic solution was to break Iraq into three pieces. What we lacked the guts to do, elections have done. The pretense that an Iraqi national identity exists or ever will exist can be sustained no longer.
Iraq doesn’t have a government. It has a collection of warlords, demagogues and thieves with official titles. It’s time to put our own politics aside and face reality: If Iraq’s elected leaders won’t stop looting their country long enough to pull together and defeat the foreign terrorists, internal insurgents and militias killing Iraqis, we should not ask our troops to defend them”.
In a way we are to blame. Our arrogance
in assuming that the middle eastern moslems think and feel as we do in regards to form of government and way of life.
It’s like the guy who tried to convince a group of cannibals to become vegetarians -
(“It’s a more healthy lifestyle,better to cut down on red meat”).
-and ended up as the main course.
We better start thinking about what’s good for America first and then worry about the rest of the world.
http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/arabs_last_chance_opedcolumnists_ralph_peters.htm
August 25, 2006 at 12:26 pm
If we leave, Iraq is vulnerable to Iran.
We cannot allow Iran to become more powerful in that region than it already is.
I believe we had to go into Iraq because whether or not Saddam had weapons of mas destruction, he was quite ambitious in his desires to take over the middle east.
We (for some reason) do depend on oil from this area of the world…everyone does and we can’t allow a bunch of little Hitlers and Mad Hatters to use it for leverage over us.
Can anyone tell me why, aside from the dems whining about the reindeer in Alaska and how drilling in Anwar would destroy the area, we aren’t doing just that instead of worrying about any oil supply from the middle east?
Question–
Yes, I do support you going to Iraq and fighting for us because you take the fight there instead of allowing it on home ground. You have the chance to kill off many terrorist thugs that otherwise might be strategizing another attack on American soil.
Quite frankly, maybe we just need to give these people what they want and keep them living in the 12th century. These people want to hate their moslem brothers and jewish neighbors more than they want to love their children by providing a safe, peaceful, prosperous environment for them to grow up in. So maybe the way to deal with them is to continue to destabilize govenments that become too powerful. The people, it seems to me, will generally take the opportunity to increase their misery and bloodshed and make their situation increasingly worse. Certainly if they’re busy killing one another, they are far less focused on becoming a threat to the world.
Big Jake–
Very good article. Sounds like someone as disgusted by these people as I am.
August 26, 2006 at 2:50 am
My concern with our involvement in Iraq stems from the double standard applied to the conduct of the war.
We are held to the “Marqis of Queensberry Rules ” (the Geneva Convention) while the insurgents specifically target civilians, torture and kill at will, wear no uniforms, and are offered amnesty as long as they did not intentionally harm fellow Iraquis.
Harming Americans is ok. This from the Iraqi government we support.
I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is strange that we are putting the Haditha 8 on trial for their lives and kow-towing to political correctness while these monsters are running wild.
Marines are trained as fierce combat soldiers ,not policemen. Police opperate in a civilized society ,not a war zone.
They are forced to fight with one hand tied behind their backs in fear of accusations of brutality.
If we are not going to let them fight to win,then bring them home now.
http://nctimes.com/articles/2006/08/24/news/top_stories/22_01_268_23_06.txt
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/23/AR2006082301829.html
August 26, 2006 at 3:44 pm
Big Jake: Your post impressed me. You’re so right. If our soldiers are going to be there, then let them do what they’re trained to do. We’re not fighting MEN, we’re fighting robots, stripped of all decency and humanity.
August 26, 2006 at 4:40 pm
I agree with both of you. If the enemy doesn’t adhere to the Geneva Convention rules of conduct in war, neither should we.
August 27, 2006 at 3:41 am
واقعاٌ مسخره است. خدا به این جماعت یه عقلی بده، به ما هم یه پولی!
August 27, 2006 at 6:21 am
#216,..Okay somebody, translate…
August 27, 2006 at 11:09 am
OK Zealot,
I’ll give it a shot . I believe that Reza has
said:
God Bless America ! My dear friends ! and thank you from the bottom of our hearts for all your efforts in bringing democracy and free speach to the Arab world.
God Bless your Flag ,your country and your People.
August 27, 2006 at 2:34 pm
Big Jake..if I knew you I’d shake your hand. If that isn’t what it says, I sure love your comeback. My hat’s off to you…you gave me quite a smile.
August 27, 2006 at 3:36 pm
Zealot,Good Buddy and fellow New Yorker,
I’m sure Reza can talk pretty good American when he wants to. So if my translation isn’t what he said he can feel free to speak plainly so there won’t be any misunderstanding.
August 27, 2006 at 6:24 pm
We must always look to the future. Tomorrow–the time that gives a man just one more chance–is one of the many things that I feel are wonderful in life. So’s a good horse under you. Or the only campfire for miles around. Or a quiet night and a nice soft hunk of ground to sleep on. A mother meeting her first-born. The sound of a kid calling you dad for the first time. There’s a lot of things great about life. But I think tomorrow is the most important thing. Comes in to us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”
John Wayne
August 27, 2006 at 9:01 pm
John Wayne’s Personal Philosophy on Life:
“When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it.”
“I have tried to live my life so that my family would love me and my friends respect me. The others can do whatever the hell they please.”
“A man’s got to have a code, a creed to live by, no matter his job.
August 28, 2006 at 12:27 am
Ok – now that August 22nd is behind us, anyone still here besides me? (I can hear crickets..) Anyhow:
#179: worriedsince16: Glad to hear you’re okay with your accident. J Yes, death can be right around the corner in many ways, but so is life as well. Assuming that you’re a teen – you certainly have a long life ahead of you and a chance to really be a plus to yourself and society. Rather than worry, (which does no good), try staying active in life but careful in all you do.
#180: the viber: Gosh darn it you went and said you liked me (past tense) – J So I had to rewrite a kinder/gentler response. We need to analyze our selves yes from time to time. That was my point (not to insult you) but to ask yourself (or pray first for wisdom) how you can help the Holy Spirit rather than hinder it. I don’t disagree with what you say, but how it was delivered. I would rather see seeds sewn that bear fruit, as I’m sure you would too (especially being a mother). And I DO believe you when you say that you are a female since you mentioned everything BUT your true age (LOL). Peace.
#182 Red Dawn: You hit the nail on the head with the relationship concept. And YES – good point with respect to anotherMAD’s commentary.
#183: Knocking some sense into the US white trash.. Are you Howard Dean? Come clean now – because I can see the same old talking points. First, I considered (not that I had to) your request “The US death toll in Iraq in three years is higher than the death toll in vietnam in its whole war. Keep your stats straight. Google it up”.
Big Jake has honorably noted the real statistics (not that it matters to folks like you). The US death toll in Iraq currently is 2,622 – this includes non-combat related deaths like horsing around (recreational stuff), suicides, medical illnesses, etc. The average monthly death toll on American highways is 3,750 (just though I’d put that in there). Parts of those traffic fatalities in the last few years unfortunately are soldiers that returned from Iraq who survived war only to be killed on the highways. The Vietnam War cost the US a much higher 68,988 lives if you want to include non-combat related deaths as with Iraq. So since you can’t grip the basics of math and statistics, it would be pointless to pay any more attention to you. Have a nice day…
#187 Red Dawn: Always a pleasure to hear from you (even twice) J
#192 duck hunter: It’s all good…yes there are rude people and nice ones as well. We discuss things anonymously so we are free to act out the best or worst parts of our minds without fear (unless you and your IP are in an Islamic state). Because of this, there is no point in taking any of this personally. BTW, We KNEW you were from the south when you said “yall” – that gave it away! J
#201 zealot: “and you have women falling all over Eagle like he’s some 6′2″ pretty boy they’re hoping to snag, when in reality, he’s probably some balding, pencil neck with thick glasses,”
So did I ever say what sex I was? J Got you thinking now huh!
#202 Question: Thank you for serving our country first of all. It doesn’t matter what the polls say as many times people’s opinions aren’t accurately reflected due to the types of questions asked. Despite what the media and propaganda artist say, Americans (and I dare say most of modern society worldwide) know in their hearts that this War on Islamofacism (waged against modern civilization globally) HAS to be fought and better for us over there than here. So there is an appreciation for people like you who sacrifice the comforts of home and commit themselves to the effort. It is as historical as other major wars if not more so because the attack that brought us into the war was on our soil (continental US) and we HAVE to address it head on at the sources. 1/3 of our unit was there (Iraq & Afghanistan) and what most people in this country don’t hear from the biased political media and opposition politicians are the daily successes and appreciation from the people there. History will be on our side (you will see) when you’re an old man talking about it to your grandchildren (the generations to come whose freedom you are protecting). Picture that, as the statistics are clearly favorable that you will be proudly back before you know it.
#207 Dawn: You are right (again) about how weakness opens you up to an attack. Bin Laden was quite surprised after the Mogadishu (UN) catastrophe, when President Clinton pulled our troops out. He saw the USA as a paper tiger and the green light was given to plan and execute the attack on the Twin Towers. It showed that the great USA was weak and vulnerable lacking the will to fight. President Carter (the father of modern Terrorism, 1979) also taught the Iranian clerics that we just want to love everyone rather than fight. It was no surprise that the hostages were released when President Ronald “big guns” Reagan took office and the disgraced Jimmy Carter went on to win the Nobel Peace Prize. Like Bush or not, we have not had an attack since 2001: Peace through strength is the only solution.
# 210 Question: This country’s lifeblood IS oil – if we don’t have any, trucks stop and America turns into New Orleans X 100. So resources HAVE been the reason for many wars and for good reasons – without it people die. However, this war we are now caught up in (it’s actually been waged for over 1,300 years) is a Jihad (Holy War). It is about Islamic Conquest and yes, if they can seize the oil fields; the western countries not in line with Islam are in trouble.
#211 Big Jake: I feel the same way – this idea of a unified Iraq was nuts. But there are so many other factors involved with splitting up Iraq into pieces, that had we may create more trouble over a greater region. What we need to do is tell our environmentalist to take a hike and drill drill drill for oil. This country has vast amounts of oil in the ground yet to be tapped – so much so that I’d like to see us pay off our debt, then deflate the oil market so the Iranian Regime finds that it has little money left to buy weapons for Hizbullies and it’s war on western societies.
#216: The closest to a translation I can find is: “His oppressor is falling an anus. They furrowed ا by himیBe far جماعت یه was reasonableی He came upon, by him that a worry یه پ and turn aroundی!”
Folks, I have this feeling that any statement with the word “anus” in it isn’t going to be positive. SO, maybe it is good that reza has an Arabic keyboard! It’s obvious that there are two different worlds (Islam vs. Civilization) and what overrides the concern that they like us is that we survive what hell they bring us. Bin Laden had said in his declaration of Jihad (1996) that they don’t distinguish between military and civilian people – all are targets. That doesn’t sound very sensitive to me and yes, what about the Geneva Convention?? It seems like the pointy headed intellectuals just don’t get it: Islamics DON’T play by their old rules of warfare. Those Pendleton 8 (American POWs in California) Marines should be released immediately and those responsible for their arrest and treatment tried for treason!
August 28, 2006 at 1:44 am
#223:Eagle
“What we need to do is tell our environmentalist to take a hike and drill drill drill for oil. This country has vast amounts of oil in the ground yet to be tapped – so much so that I’d like to see us pay off our debt, then deflate the oil market so the Iranian Regime finds that it has little money left to buy weapons for Hizbullies and it’s war on western societies”.
BULL’S EYE again ,my friend. With the shale oil deposits in western Canada and the US ,the coal deposits(I believe we are the Saudi Arabia of coal)not to mention the Anwar Oil reserves all waiting to be tapped,we should be able to sidestep the Middle eastern blackmailers.
The really interesting play will come when we fully utilize the potential that Hydrogen holds.
Unfortunately ,we do not yet have our national priorities in order .
During WWII ,we were denied access to the rubber producing plantations in the Japanese occupied Pacific region . We were forced to improvise and synthetic rubber was invented.
I see a similar event should the Middle east become a conflagration. Could you imagine what would happen should these Islamic countries be deprived of their Petro-Dollars?
They are all one trick ponies. If oil should become just one of many fuel source option,all these countries are in trouble.
http://www.hydrogen.com/h2you.asp
By the way ,your translation of Reza’s post#216: “His oppressor is falling an anus. They furrowed ا by himیBe far جماعت ” sounds like Gay porn to me. Reza ,I think that writing that stuff can get you in alot of trouble in most moslem countries ,especially
the ones under Sharia Law.
Reza, I am giving you the benefit of the doubt.
My translation (post #218) is what you meant to say unless we hear otherwise from you.
August 28, 2006 at 2:03 pm
Eagle..glad to see you’re back. I thought you flew away. Man or woman, I don’t care what you are. Only made that comparison to make a point. No insult intended. Don’t care if you look like E.T., Brad Pitt, or my sister. I enjoy the posts from you and Big Jake the most…t doesn’t matter, I just assumed you were both guys.
As far as Reza goes, the anus translation is freaky. Maybe that’s why these people are so edgy….they know what can happen if they bend over to pick something up.
August 28, 2006 at 3:35 pm
Eagle: Glad to see you’re back, too. And I DO like you. You’re posts are always a good read, as well as Red Dawn’s and Big Jake’s, and I do get a lot of humor reading Zealot. Eagle, there’s no need to explain. I know you meant well, but you should take some of your own advice about “delivery”. If you had, you would’nt have had to have a gentler response. You did make me analyze myself, and that’s a good thing. I know I have faults. But,I have always been a stand up person. I’m not afraid to say what I think or defend what I believe. Especially now when the whole war is based on a belief system. I probably do sound immature on this statement, but in response to Reza, if you don’t have the guts to say what you mean so we can understand it, go stick your head in a hole. And I mean a hole in the ground. (hahaha)
August 28, 2006 at 5:36 pm
Wow. Alot going on since I last got on here. Zealot, when I said I “loved” Eagle, it was JUST A FIGURE OF SPEECH. I didn’t mean it literally so take a pill. The keep your mitts off thing was just in fun. That’s why I don’t get on these forums very much. It gets too weird for me. Especially now with this anal stuff and Reza. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that he’s probably trying to call us all a bunch of assholes, but as in everything else these uncivilized cowards do, he uses this scribble to “play” with us. I’m not swept away with any of these Muslims and wish they’d all stay the hell over there and do their own thing away from us and out of our country. Call me a bigot if you want to, but none of them belong here. Let them live their insane way and let us live ours. We have the right to exist the way we want to in the West, and they can exist their way in the M. East. They think we’re the Great Satan, we think their NUTS. As far as our guys being over there, God Bless every one of them and I hope they all come home safely. But while they’re there, they should be allowed to do whatever they have to,to survive. I support President Bush’s decision and it breaks my heart that our young men and women have to fight such an unconventional war against such monsters. But, they’ll win. There’s no military or spirit like ours.
August 28, 2006 at 6:06 pm
And one more thing. Everytime one our soldiers gets slain, we should just TAKE 100,000 barrels of oil.
August 28, 2006 at 8:40 pm
Eagle, unfortunately I clicked on the wrong topic a few minutes ago. Anyway, I’m 43. I know you’re a man because no woman would be such a wiseguy.
August 29, 2006 at 12:52 am
Eagle–
Glad you “jihad” (LOL!) with my replies. Touche my friend.
As for knowing you are a man as opposed to a woman:
#74– you said “I was beginning to get turned on to Vera (in a weird way) until she used “bald headed” as a derogatory adjective describing undesirable manipulative old men. I resemble that statement and demand an apology!”
Sorry, buddy. Had to point it out! ‘Course could all be disinformation but you’re too right on most of the time, so don’t think so. Got to give it to viber; she nailed you!
Love your info and comments.
Big Jake– Again, can ANYONE tell me why we aren’t relying on our own fuel sources instead of the blackmailers’??? We all know the political game with the Reps and the Dems and know THEY all know what’s truly going on. So what gives? All for the sake of retaining their seats? If so, those knowing the truth should be tried for treason as they jeapordize the security of this great nation and the lives of her valiant soldiers.
lovesamerica–Good idea though not even enough. Why not just take the damn country; democracy is not an idea these people seem to desire. They’d rather starve and raise their children in absolute degradation. They’d rather a mad/despotic man rule them and slaughter/torture them at will. Perhaps we need to allow the Kurds their own free state and let the shia and the sunni war with one another. When they’re sufficiently weakened, by their own hands, we should empower the Kurds to move in and take over. It wouldn’t be called Iraq, though. It would be Kurdistan.
August 29, 2006 at 1:40 am
#223 Eagle – I’m still here. I’ve been preparing my basement. My PC friends think I’m heading for the looney bin. Every once in awhile I listen to them. To answer your question about Howard Dean. Let me clue you all in to a little story, a true one, about Howard Dean. Shortly after 9-11 when he was still Governor of Vermont and all airports were on high alert, he took offense to an airport baggage inspector (at Burlington International) checking his luggage. He didn’t think he should have to go through what the rest of us were going through because he was Governor. Excuse my language (my southern roots showing here) but the man is a complete asshole. He says he’s for the people and then gives the poor airport security guard a hard time. In my humble opinion, no one .. and I mean no one … in this Country is above having their luggage checked. Why? Well for one, it sends the wrong message, and two, what a fait-a-complis for a terrorist to pull off loading a US government official’s baggage with some type of explosive device. Howard Dean for America … yeah, as long as us dumb little folk are willing to serve him. Sorry if I offend, but I know of what I speak.
#184 – Big Jake, thanks for setting the record straight with #183
#183 – What is up with the “white trash” nomer? Come on. I’ve lived all over this Country and in a lot of foreign countries for that matter. By using White Trash in your nomer, I have to assume you think the only people on this site who take issue with Moslem extremists are white. Grow up. Black America, Yellow America, and Brown America understands when they are threatened. If Islam were truly a peaceful religion, you wouldn’t see a more supportive group of people in America. For the most part, we believe in “live and let live.”
#210 – My husband’s been to Afghanistan on several tours. He still has hope and thinks we are on the right course. My son will probably be in Iraq within the next year. I love both of these men and the fight had better be worth it. I think it is. No one said it would be easy, including Bush. My fear all along has been that the media in this Country would do everything in its power to sway public opinion negatively on any war. Iraq gave them their excuse. Most of these morons are so in tight with Hollywood that the thought we Americans might put something else above going to a movie sent them into all out war on the war against terror. Let them be on the next airliner taken down.
#216 – Reza, your mother’s name better not be Judi. If so, I am extremely disapointed in you. I can forward your message to a good friend who will translate. Maybe I should respond in French or Italian. I’m sure there are others on this site who can handle other languages. We’re writing in English. Step up or get off.
August 29, 2006 at 1:41 am
Boy, if I could throw a party…call it the “cocktail hour”, I’d have to invite these people:
viber– for your belief
eagle– for your articulate and intelligent presentation
Big Jake– for your passion and knowledge
lovesamerica– for your patriotism
Question– for your questions
duck hunter– for your quiet pragmatism
worriedsince16– for your worries
zealot– for your zeal
D.J.– for your assessment
and last but not least, anothermad from Turkey–for your sarcasm and wit
Would be an interesting party, no?
August 29, 2006 at 1:46 am
Oh my, forgot one of my favorites as I just saw you posted when I did!
Americanwoman– well, she’s an Americanwoman. Nothing else need to be said about her!
August 29, 2006 at 3:09 am
Red Dawn, you asked:
” Again, can ANYONE tell me why we aren’t relying on our own fuel sources instead of the blackmailers’???”
The answer is because somebody is making alot of money doing things the way that they have always been done. Until we have to change (Necessity is the Mother of Invention)or because we want to change(somebody can make more money by doing things differently),we will do what we have always done.
August 29, 2006 at 4:17 am
Iran vs. America … Two Paths To Peace?
Ikvot ha’Mashiach
Commentary by Jack Kelley
The plan was for Russia to operate Iran’s nuclear fuel enrichment program in Russian territory with spent fuel rods being returned to Russia to insure no weapons grade enrichment took place in Iran. Iran agreed to part of the plan but has refused to stop its own enrichment program. This is a deal breaker.
Iran has consistently said that its nuclear program is intended for peaceful purposes only, so why not take advantage of this opportunity resolve the issue?
The answer lies in Shiite Islam’s definition of peace. To them it’s a condition that will exist only after Israel and Islam’s other enemies are destroyed and all the world is brought under submission. Only then can the Moslem Messiah, al Mahdi, establish the world wide Islamic rule that brings peace.
According to Moslem oral traditions (not written in the Koran) al Mahdi, who they believe disappeared in 941AD, will return to Earth when conditions have become so chaotic and desperate that he alone can save us. Iranian President Ahmadinejad believes he has been brought to power specifically to hasten al Mahdi’s return by plunging the world into such a state, and he believes he can accomplish this within 2 years.
He’s also said that the US is the major obstacle to this plan, even going so far as to accuse the US of trying to usurp al Mahdi’s role by imposing its own brand of peace upon the world.
While these two strategies appear to have the same ultimate goal in view, and while both presidents have alluded to divine purpose in their lives (obviously from different sources), their approaches to achieving that goal couldn’t possibly be more incompatible. Islamic rule is not democratic, and a democracy can’t tolerate an all powerful clergy imposing religious law.
Compounding the problem, Western mentality says that when two parties with similar goals disagree over implementation they sit down to negotiate and compromise until their differences are resolved. In Islam the only condition under which compromise is acceptable is when it buys the Moslem party enough time to gain the strength necessary to destroy the non-Moslem.
So while the EU 3 has been working with US support to negotiate a compromise to accommodate Iran’s nuclear aspirations, Iran has been using the time to secretly gain the strength it will need to succeed in imposing its will on the world. Sooner or later this dance has to end as the parties’ real intentions become known.
That time may soon be upon us. Even the multi-culturally minded Europeans can only be pushed so far and the recent “cartoon Jihad” might have been the last straw. “Freedom of speech is not up for negotiation,” declared Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso, summing up a consensus that has only grown stronger as the cries of outrage from the Muslim world grow louder.
“We demand a new social contract,” says Jan Wolter Wabeke, High Court Judge in The Hague. “We no longer accept that people don’t learn our language, we require that they send their daughters to school, and we demand they stop bringing in young brides from the desert and locking them up in third-floor apartments.” It’s finally dawning on Europeans that multi-culturalism is not part of the Islamic lexicon.
Before long it will become obvious even in diplomatic circles that Iran is intent on fomenting an international crisis, and that no amount of appeasement will put them off the track.
I edited the article as best I could .The website is posted below. I’ve got a bad feeling about this, folks . A showdown seems inevitable
once this nutjob gets the bomb.
http://www.gracethrufaith.com/ikvot/iran-vs-america-two-paths-to-peace
August 29, 2006 at 6:28 am
RE post #232
Red Dawn,
That sounds like one heck of a shin-dig! I’ll bring the steaks,Eagle,you’ve got the brewskis.
Better make another beer run. Zealot don’t forget the charcoal! Duck Hunter ,you bring the poultry.
August 29, 2006 at 12:46 pm
Red Dawn,
I love the idea of your cocktail party! Wouldn’t that be nice? I think I could sit and talk to all of you for hours. Such a wide variety of interesting people! I could offer my services to you. I love to cook, and I just finished a 6 week “hands on” culinary course and have all kinds of wonderful appetizer, main dish, and dessert recipes. Some great “drink” recipes, too. If this ever happened, the only thing better than the food would be the company!
August 29, 2006 at 1:30 pm
When you’re planning your cocktails for this event, folks, don’t forget to check out the Best End-of-the-World Cocktails, elsewhere on this site.
August 29, 2006 at 2:51 pm
I’m new, but I’d like to come to the party.
Like my name says, I’m curious.
lovesamerica: I know you’re a woman, are you a truckdriver, too?
red dawn: are you a native american who’s name is dawn, or do you just like the movie?
zealot: are you really a fanatic, or were you just born pissed?
Big Jake: you need to sober up. Not everything revolves around beer.
eagle: are you sure you didn’t mean EGO
viber: dieing to know – is that short for vibrator?
August 29, 2006 at 5:04 pm
Re: curious # 239: Everything doesn’t revolve around beer!?!? How ’bout beer is what kept most of early Europe alive because the water was unfit to drink. The fact that it was alcoholic in nature was a boon. Then came preserving with salt: peanuts, pretzels, jerky, etc, to have with the beer. Baking: bread for sandwiches (VERA!!!), pizza dough, biscuits (the morning after), and DOUGHNUTS!!! Agriculture: corn for popcorn, corn nuts, cornbread for that afore mentioned chili, etc.
Remember the story of a college prof using the large jar for an example of how full your life is? First in were large rocks to represent the big things in life, second, pebbles for the day-to-day items, then after some shaking, sand for the “small stuff.” The jar was full, the prof claimed. “Not quite,” answered a student in the class, and with that, the student poured a can of beer into the jar absolutely filling the jar to capacity. The morale(?) of the story is: No matter how full your life is, there’s always room for beer! ; )
Sho… heersh t’ ya, guysh and galsh… (hic!)
Live long and prosper, and, as my daughter told me, “Eagles may soar, but weasles don’t get sucked into jet engines.”
To the younger contributors, my father’s favorite, “Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill every time.” Yep, he kicked my butt a lot!
And to all, my take on life, “Life is too serious to be taken seriously.” Take time to laugh at yourself, don’t be too quick to judge others, and remember that the toes you step on today might be connected to the @$$ you may have to kiss tomorrow.
August 29, 2006 at 5:16 pm
curious-
You’re more than welcome to come to the party! We’ll make you the designated football.
August 29, 2006 at 6:22 pm
Curious…probably a little both.
And shuldn’t you be spelling your name
P-R-I-C-K?
August 29, 2006 at 7:03 pm
Zealot, good reply to Curious.
And Curious, no, I’m not a truck driver. But,if I was, I’m sure you can figure out the two words I’d say to you.
August 29, 2006 at 9:18 pm
Perhaps our host can interpret Reza’s message. Quayfortuna, I’m pretty sure you can translate? The friend I will ask is currently serving in Iraq so he’s got bigger things on his mind. Reality cheek? (Spelling error intended based on an online translation service.)
Reza, care to respond in French or Italian?
August 30, 2006 at 1:09 am
Curious:
SEEMS LIKE YOU DON’T GET INVITED TO TOO MANY PARTIES ,DO YA?
“I’ve always followed my father’s advice: he told me, first to always keep my word and, second, to never insult anybody unintentionally. If I insult you, you can be goddamn sure I intend to. And, third, he told me not to go around looking for trouble”.
John Wayne
August 30, 2006 at 3:33 am
Big Jake–
Again, good article. I wish they’d talk about articles like that on the news rather than talking heads regurgitating the same thing over and over. Guess that’d be too much like thinking.
viber–
Yes, I’ve enjoyed your commentary, along with many others, immensely. I would love to have a real cocktail party with the aforementioned people.
curious–
I could easily deal with any insult from you, and laugh at the ones you pffft at my peeps; however, the one directed at viber was without class completely.
And the answer to your question(s)is yes, in a roundabout way.
reza–
How about French? Or better yet, English. It’s the language most of us are communicating here in. Now there’s a thought!
August 30, 2006 at 3:40 am
quayfortuna–
You are absolutely hilarious!!!
You MUST attend the party and bring the cocktail recipes personally!
August 30, 2006 at 10:57 am
Curious:
You’re not curious, you’re something else. And it’s not humorous, either. Overly obnoxious and critical people always have deeper issues, so I hope (and pray) you will take some of Eagle’s advice and analyze yourself. You have obviously read all the posts and have gotten impressions of us. Instead of seeing and trying to understand someone’s point of view, you felt it necessary to belittle. In my case, you put a filthy spin on an innocent word. Must’ve given you quite a chuckle. I’ll let your twisted mind know that I DRIVE A VIBE. My little nephew calls me “Aunt Viber”. Thanks for degrading this endearment. It’s too bad that they’re are a lot of men in this world, but far too few “gentlemen”.
Red Dawn: I wish I DID know you personally, because I have a feeling we’d be great friends. God Bless you in all you do.
Zealot: I know you’re fiesty, and I think that’s what I like about you the most.
August 30, 2006 at 4:41 pm
Viber, unfortunately for you, chivalry died with the feminist movement. You didn’t want a world where you were put on pedestal and could have the leisure of not working, staying home and caring for the kids and your man. Wasn’t fulfilling enough for you. You can thank women like Americangirl for that. I can’t stress enough that anytime a women has any power things get messed up. Well, Muslims have the right idea. Those men don’t have the frickin problems American men do. You all want equality until you get into a divorce court, then you just can’t make it on your own without taking everything away that a man has worked for. The house, the kids, his money. You keep your claws dug in to him as long as you can, playing helpless female until you get everything you want. Then you look for another poor sap to do it to again. The real danger in this world isn’t Muslims, it’s WOMEN. Everything they touch turns to shit. I suggest you hook up with Red Dawn and head to lesboville. Stop at the nearest Reservation and throwback some firewater to lighten up. Take Zealot with you so he can say what you think but are too self-righteous to say. Maybe Eagle and DJ can join you so they can spread their perfection around a little bit and clue everyone in about the world. And don’t foget to invite Big Jake. He’ll get pissed if he misses a binge. All of you sorry asses make me want to puke. And you think your nephew calls you that because of your car!!?? Typical woman You’re not only stupid but naiive. I think the kid made an assessment and is destined to be the neighborhood stud. I hope his father teaches him to use women for the only thing they’re good for. And most of them arn’t even good at that.
August 30, 2006 at 6:22 pm
#249 – Curious – I’m not sure if this is gonna change your mind or not but here goes …. My true hope for you is that you will find a woman who you fall head over heals in love with and she for you. There will be a mutual caring and respect between the two of you that will enable you to pull through life’s most difficult experiences.
This is what I have with my husband. Chivalry and femininity are not dead. My guy and I are as crazy about each other today as were were when we met 23 years ago. Trust me when I say he is as far from weak as any human can get. However, he appreciates (and actually expects)that when he goes to where ever his nation calls, that he’s got a competent woman who can step up to the plate and handle his home, his kids, his yard, his cars and everything else he’s worked his butt off for. He taught me how to use a firearm and made sure I will use it if I have to.
Don’t make the mistake of assuming that the women on this site are a bunch of men-hating feminists. I know those women exist as do women-hating men.
Are you from the US? If so, you should know that most men and women in this country completely embrace and like (most of the time) the qualities of the opposite gender.
Most women in this country do not look at men as the enemy and it doesn’t sound to me like Red Dawn or Viber do either. We appreciate strong men. Strong men can relate to women as an equal, but different force of nature. Strong men do not belittle women, throw acid at them, beat the crap out of them, or rape them. These men know what it’s like to have the heart and soul of that woman standing next to them. They know what it’s like to receive love that isn’t given out of complete fear for one’s life. It’s empowering for them and we know it.
I don’t think I can change your viewpoint. If you are Moslem, your attitude does nothing but reinforce the fear I have for my daughters and all women in this Country.
I may be naive at times, but when the safety of my family is at stake and my guy isn’t here to protect us, you will find out how dead on reality based I can be. I am not alone.
August 31, 2006 at 2:54 am
OK everybody -CURIOUS just gave away his real identity . He is the president of the “HE-MAN
Woman Haters Club”!
Oh , by the way, Curious’ post#249- “I hope his father teaches him to use women for the only thing they’re good for”.
A little friendly advice ,Bub- Go take a Dale Carnagie course or buy his book “How to win Friends and influence People” You need all the help you can get.
August 31, 2006 at 3:02 am
Americanwoman :
You ar wasting your breath .
I don’t know if CURIOUS is a Moslem, I do know the he is a jerk.
August 31, 2006 at 3:50 am
Curious–
WOW. Impressive. Have to say, certainly not a “lesbo” as I’ve been married 13 years to a MAN.
Your life seems definitely sad and as Americanwoman said, I hope you realize how wrong you are before you miss out on what life is all about.
Don’t know why you’re so angry but sounds like you’ve been/going through a bitter divorce. I’ve got a guy friend who’s been going through the same thing and he often voices the same thoughts as you did to me even though I’m female. I’m his friend, so he knows I understand.
I think perhaps you should reach out to people for support, not lash out in your anger.
BTW, am I on the wrong blog??? I thought this was about the Iranian situation, not “men versus women”. Oh wait a minute, THAT would be the Iranian situation. Aside, of course, from aMad Hatter and his genocidal clerical tea party.
If you commiserate/sympathize with the moslems in their war against women and everyone else who’s not of the same moslem sect/and/or religion/non-religion as they are, perhaps you need to EXPORT yourself to a moslem country in the near/immediate future.
August 31, 2006 at 3:59 am
Oh, and how chauvinist…”the leisure of not working and raising the kids…”
Have you ever stayed at home and raised the kids??? They certainly don’t do it by themselves. Neither does the housework, the household accounts, the livestock (as we have), dinner prepared after a long day of the aforementioned chores. Put on a pedestal??? HA!
You should put me on a pedestal, shut your mouth, and kiss my feet.
Oh, and as Americanwoman said, I can use any firearm from a 22 rifle to a m60 to a 50 caliber deer rifle to protect me, and mine, and what my HUSBAND works so hard for.
Geez, why am I wasting my “breath”. Next!
August 31, 2006 at 12:38 pm
Anyway, I’m going back to the original topic.
Obviously Chavez of Venezuela is am absolute moron. He’s solidifying his country’s ties with Iran and Syria against the “western imperialist” nation of America. Gee, I don’t think he’s a moslem…obviously he pays no attention to what aMad Hatter’s intentions are for the world.
One thing I see in these countries opposed to western culture and “imperialism”; the rulers live a plush and wealthy existence, the people live in abject poverty and few human rights. So what is it all these countries despise so much about the democratic way of life being spread by the imperialist nation of America? It always seem to originate from the rulers of these nations who are opposed to being told what they can or can’t do by the west (generally something NOT in the world’s best interest). So they immediately set about stirring up a national pride against the policies of the west which (naturally) are commited to stealing the identity of these cultures and imposing their “dominion” on these peoples. Then of course when sanctions are placed upon these self-centered meglo-maniacal leaders and their countries and the people begin to suffer worse than they were before, this is all the fault of the western nations.
It’s really too bad that many people around the world cannot experience western culture, which is based upon personal freedom. I have a feeling many of them might acually appreciate being under the “dominion” of the imperialist nation of America.
August 31, 2006 at 1:25 pm
Why Islam today shuts down freedom of religion
Apostasy in the Quran, Traditions, and Islamic Law
James M. Arlandson
In 2006 in Pakistan, Christians have been arrested for converting from Islam to Christianity.
In 2006 in Afghanistan, Abdul Rahman was being prosecuted for converting from Islam to Christianity, a “crime” that carries the death penalty. After massive protests from governments around the world, the trial was terminated and Abdul Rahman was able to leave the country. More on the background of this case can also be found here.
As East and West meet through the worldwide web, we will hear more of such stories, even of Christian martyrs.
Apostates are those who leave a religion, in this case Islam, whether they become atheists or converts to another religion. What should happen to them according to the Quran, the traditions (or hadith), and later legal rulings? Have these modern clerics and judges strayed from original Islam?
This article exposes and analyzes the source of these anti-freedom of religion laws in Islam today.
The Quran
It must be conceded that automatic death for apostasy is not as prominent a theme in the Quran as one would expect. For instance, these verses condemn it, but its punishment is reserved for divine judgment in the Last Day, or its punishment is not clear down here on earth: Suras 2:217; 3:72, 86-87, 90; 4:137; 5:54; 16:106; 33:14; 47:25-27; 73:11; and 74:11.
Further, according to the historical context of Sura 5:33, which commands mutilation and crucifixion for striving against Allah and Muhammad, some Arab tribesmen turned away from Islam, but they also murdered a shepherd and stole livestock. Thus, more than apostasy is in view here. Nonetheless, the hadith uses this context to justify death for apostates, as reviewed in this article.
Are there clear verses about execution down here on earth for apostasy alone? The next three passages are sufficient to justify this, in earliest Islam, the original community that Muhammad was founding.
(1) Sura 4 was revealed in Medina over a period of three years (AD 625-627). At this point some Muslims have not immigrated to Medina when the invitation had been given. A group of them, called the hypocrites, had embraced Islam with reservations. Sometimes they supported Muhammad from a geographical and religious distance, for example in saying prayers the Muslim way. At other times, they seemed to help the enemies of Islam (see Abul A’La Maududi, The Meaning of the Quran, vol. 1, pp. 361-62, notes 116-117).
In Sura 4:88-89 Allah tells the prophet how to deal with these particular hypocrites.
4:88-89 Then what is the matter with you that you are divided into two parties about the hypocrites? Allah has cast them back (to disbelief) because of what they have earned. Do you want to guide him whom Allah has made go astray? And he whom Allah has made to go astray, you will never find for him any way (of guidance) 89 They wish that you reject (Faith), and thus that you all become equal (like one another). So, take not Auliya (protectors or friends) from them, till they emigrate in the way of Allah (to Muhammad). But if they turn back (from Islam), take (hold of) them and kill [q-t-l] them wherever you find them . . . . (Al-Hilali and Khan, parenthetical insertions are theirs; mine in brackets)
We should note two facts from these verses. First, Allah himself made the hypocrites go astray, yet he orders them killed. Second, the Arabic verb qatala is used (root is q-t-l), and this word means exclusively to fight, kill, war, battle, or slaughter.
Next, verse 90 says that if these nominal Muslims seek peace, not war, then Allah has not opened a way for Muhammad to fight them. He must allow them to live in their state of hypocrisy. However, as verse 89 says, if they turn back both from emigrating and Islam, then they shall be battled. So there is no ambiguity about Muhammad’s policy on full apostates—death.
For the final two passages, we allow Sayyid Abul A’La Maududi (d. 1979), a traditional and respected commentator of the Quran, to walk us through Islamic policy on apostasy, as revealed in the Quran (The Meaning of the Qur’an, vol. 2 of 6).
(2) Sura 9 is the last one to be revealed in its entirety. By now, Muhammad has a strong military, so he is about to “deal” with opponents once and for all. Three verses in this sura command striving (jihad) and then fighting (qital) against hypocrites and unbelievers (73-74 and 123). In these two verses, the hypocrites and unbelievers are not full apostates, according to Maududi.
The Quran says:
9:73-74 O Prophet, strive [j-h-d] hard against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be adamant and stern with them . . . they did utter the words of unbelief. Thus, they were guilty of unbelief after they professed Islam . . . If even now they repent of their misbehavior, it will be good for their own selves, but if they do not repent, Allah will chastise them with a painful chastisement in this world and the Hereafter . . . . (Maududi, vol. 2, p. 213)
These two verses say three things about these near-apostates.
First, hypocrites stood aloof from Islam, yet they mouthed words of support—sometimes. At other times they opposed Muhammad, especially in his long and difficult Tabuk Crusade against the Byzantine Christians in late AD 630. They refused to go. Muhammad could not tolerate this wishy-washy behavior. Most important, he could not tolerate opposition, at this late stage.
Second, the more ambiguous word jihad is used. This implies that the ultimate command to kill the hypocrites and unbelievers has not yet been given clearly. But they have been promised “painful chastisement in this world.” How? The Muslim community has other methods of “striving” with them instead of killing them, such as ostracism, denial of their oaths in a court of law, closed doors of offices and positions, and contempt in social meetings (Maududi, vol. 2, p. 219, note 82).
Third, the hypocrites are still given the opportunity to repent. “If they now repent of their misbehavior, it will be good for them” . . . . This means, according to Maududi, that they are not full apostates, even though they uttered words of unbelief. But this chance for repentance is short lived, as the next verse reveals.
(3) In Sura 9:123 the hypocrites have been merged with the unbelievers, so they are now apostates.
The Quran says:
9:123 O Believers, fight [q-t-l] with these disbelievers who are near you, and they should find you firm and stern. (Maududi, vol. 2, p. 249)
Maududi notes two differences between verses 73 and 123. First, jihad (j-h-d) and qital (q-t-l) are used in each, respectively; and, second, only one key word describes the enemies of Islam in verse 123, whereas two words describe them in verse 73.
The only difference between the two Commands is that in v. 73 the Muslims were asked to do Jihad with them, while in this verse [123] stronger words, “fight with them,” have been used, which were meant to impress on them that they should crush the hypocrites thoroughly and completely. Another difference in the wording is that in v. 73, two different words “disbelievers and hypocrites,” have been used, while in this verse [123] only one word, “disbelievers,” has been used so that the hypocrites should forfeit all their claims as Muslims, for there was room for this concession in the word “hypocrite.” (vol. 2, p. 253, note 121, insertions mine)
Maududi says that the word “hypocrites” means a reprieve, but this word has been removed, and “disbelievers” has been supplied, which eliminates the reprieve. Recall that Sura 9:73-74 says that the hypocrites made some confession of unbelief after they professed Islam, so the implication is clear from verse 123, added to verses 73-74, as follows: Even though neither Maududi nor verse 123 uses “apostasy” as such, these hypocrites-declared-unbelievers should be fought and crushed thoroughly and completely.
The hadith
The hadith are the records or traditions about Muhammad’s words and actions outside of the Quran. This body of literature and the Quran form the foundation of later classical law. Bukhari (d. AD 870) is considered one of the most reliable hadith collectors and editors, if not the most reliable. Four examples from Bukhari and two hadiths cited by Maududi suffice to give us an idea of how harshly early Islam treats apostates.
(1) Bukhari records this tradition traced back to Muhammad himself in a legal context. It gives three reasons for shedding a Muslim’s blood. One of them is apostasy.
Allah’s Apostle said, “The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas [like-for-like punishment] for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims.” (Bukari)
(2) This hadith says that some “atheists” were brought to Ali, Muhammad’s son-in-law and cousin, and he burned them alive.
. . . The news of this event reached Ibn Abbas [Muhammad’s cousin and highly reliable transmitter of traditions] who said, “If I had been in his [Ali’s] place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Messenger forbad it, saying, ‘Do no punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah Messenger, ‘Whoever change[s] his Islamic religion, then kill him.’” (Bukhari, Apostates, no. 6922; online source)
Evidently, these “atheists” were once Muslims, but they no longer followed Muhammad’s way. The Islam of Ali and Ibn Abbas, Muhammad’s family, would not tolerate freedom of religion, so Ali burned them alive. Ibn Abbas would have beheaded them because fire as a punishment is reserved only for Allah.
(3) After Muhammad dies of a fever in AD 632, the tribes in Arabia revolted against Islam. Evidently, they honored this religion only because the prophet grew in military prowess. But shortly after he died, they dropped their allegiance to him. However, his right-hand companion Abu Bakr was appointed successor or Caliph upon Muhammad’s death (ruled AD 632-634). This is how he deals with the revolt.
When Allah’s Messenger died and Abu Bakr was elected as a Caliph after him, some of the Arabs reverted to disbelief. ‘Umar said to Abu Bakr, “How dare you fight the people while Allah’s Messenger said, ‘I have been ordered to fight the people till they say, “None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.” And whoever says: “None has the right to be worshipped but Allah” saves his wealth and his life from me unless he deserves a legal punishment justly, and his account will be with Allah!”’” Abu Bakr said, “By Allah, I will fight him who discriminates between Zakat and Salat (prayers), for Zakat is the compulsory right to be taken from the wealth. By Allah, if they refuse to give me even a tying rope which they use to give to Allah’s Messenger, I would fight them for withholding it.” ‘Umar said, “By Allah, it was nothing, except I saw that Allah had opened the chest of Abu Bakr to the fight, and I came to know for certain that that (i.e. the decision to fight) was the truth.” (Bukhari)
In this passage, zakat “is the compulsory right to be taken from the wealth” of the Arab tribes. Abu Bakr zealously fights for every last scrap of wealth from them. Even if they withhold a “tying rope,” he will battle them for it. In the end, the first Caliph was successful. The tribes were subdued.
(4) As the final example from Bukhari’s collection, this hadith promises a reward on the Day of Resurrection for killing apostates in the last days:
. . . No doubt I heard Allah’s Apostle saying, “During the last days there will appear some young foolish people who will say the best words but their faith will not go beyond their throats (i.e. they will have no faith) and will go out from (leave) their religion as an arrow goes out of the game. So, wherever you find them, kill them, for whoever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection.” (Bukhari)
Next, Maududi cites two hadiths that he considers reliable. Both say that a Christian or Christians converted to Islam, disliked it, and then switched back to Christianity. Ali is Muhammad’s cousin and son-in-law and fourth Caliph (ruled AD 656-660), who was assassinated while praying in a mosque. How does he treat these Christians? Tolerantly?
(5) This Christian was martyred after he proclaimed the Lordship of Jesus Christ over himself and possibly even over Ali.
. . . A man who was formerly a Christian, then was Muslim, and again became a Christian was brought before Ali. Ali asked him: What is the cause of your conduct? He replied: I have found the religion of the Christians better than your religion. Ali asked: What is your belief about Jesus? He said: He is my Lord (Rabb); or else he said: He is Lord of Ali. Hearing this, Ali ordered that he be executed.
(6) These Christians were martyred after they realized that their first religion, Christianity, was far more excellent than all other religions, even Islam. Note what Ali does to their children.
. . . Ali was informed about a group of Christians who had become Muslims and then became Christians again. Ali arrested them, summoned them before himself and enquired about the truth of the matter. They said: We were Christians. Then we were offered the choice of remaining Christians or becoming Muslims. We chose Islam. But now it is our opinion that no religion is more excellent than our first religion. Therefore we have become Christians now. Hearing this, Ali ordered these people to be executed and their children enslaved.
Slavery has a long and dreadful history in Islam.
Source: The Punishment of the Apostate According to Islamic Law, for the last two hadiths; and scroll down to “Views of the Rightly Guided Caliphs,” nos. 6 and 7
This section of Bukhari’s hadith deals with apostates. This article has many more hadiths than the ones cited in this present article.
Classical Islamic law
Sharia is Islamic law based on the Quran and the hadith. Fiqh is the science of applying and interpreting sharia, done by qualified judges and legal scholars. We look at two of the most widespread and influential schools in orthodox Sunni Islam: those of Shafii (d. 829) and Malik (d. 795).
(1) Malik was also a reliable collector of hadith.
In one long hadith, Malik first lays the foundation that execution is legal.
Yahya related to me . . . that the Messenger of Allah . . . said, “If someone changes his religion—then strike off his head!”
The first class of apostates leaves Islam for something else, but they are not given the opportunity to repent.
They are killed without being called to repent because their repentance is not recognized. They were concealing their disbelief and making Islam public, so I do not think that one should call such people to repent and one does not accept their word.
The second group of apostates leaves Islam and divulges it. What happens to him?
As for the person who leaves Islam for something else and divulges it, he is called on to repent. If he does not turn in repentance, he is killed . . . If they repent, that is accepted from them. (Online source)
The next hadith in Malik concerns Umar. Recall that in the previous section Abu Bakr the first Caliph (ruled 632-634) waged wars on tribes that apostatized from Islam and that Ali the fourth Caliph (r. 656-666) killed Christians. Umar was the second Caliph (r. 634-644), and he too kills apostates as a matter of policy, except he gives them three days to repent.
. . . Then Umar inquired, “Do you have any recent news?” He said, “Yes. A man has become an unbeliever after he was a Muslim.” Umar said, “What have you done with him?” He replied, “We let him approach and then struck off his head.” Umar said, “Didn’t you imprison him for three days and feed him a loaf of bread every day and call on him to repent that he might . . . return to the command of Allah?” Then Umar said, “O Allah! I was not present and I did not order it and I am not pleased since it has come to me.” (online source)
(2) The following medieval manual compiled mainly by Ahmad ibn Naqib al-Misri (d. 1368), Reliance of the Traveler: A Classic Manual of Islamic Sacred Law, (rev. ed., trans. Nuh Ha Mim Keller, Beltsville, Maryland: Amana, 1994), summarizes rulings in the Shafii School of fiqh.
These two laws cover the two requirements that make an apostate liable for death and the obligation of the caliph or his representative.
o8.1 When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed.
o8.2 In such a case, it is obligatory for the caliph (A: or his representative) to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does, it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed.
There is no monetary compensation for executing an apostate.
o8.4 There is no indemnity for killing an apostate.
The following eighteen acts, which are broad in scope, entail leaving Islam.
(1) to prostrate to an idol, whether sarcastically, out of mere contrariness, or in actual conviction; . . .
(2) to intend to commit unbelief, even if in the future. And like this intention is hesitating whether to do so or not: one thereby immediately commits unbelief;
This law says that speaking with a clear mind and deliberation the doctrine of the Trinity makes one an apostate:
(3) to speak words that imply unbelief such as “Allah is third of three,” or “I am Allah”—unless one’s tongue has run away with one, or one is quoting another, or is one of the friends of Allah . . . in a spiritually intoxicated state of total oblivion; . . .
(4) to revile Allah or His messenger;
(5) to deny the existence of Allah, His beginningless eternality, His endless eternality, or to deny any of His attributes which the consensus of Muslims ascribe to Him;
(6) to be sarcastic about Allah’s name, His command, His interdiction, His promise, or His threat;
(7) to deny any verse in the Koran or anything which by scholarly consensus . . . belongs to it, or to add a verse that does not belong to it;
(8) to mockingly say, “I don’t know what faith is”;
(9) to reply to someone who says, “There is no power or strength through Allah”; . . .
. . .
(12) when someone asks to be taught the Testification of Faith [shahada] . . . and a Muslim refuses to teach him it;
(13) to describe a Muslim or someone who wants to become a Muslim in terms of unbelief (kufr);
(14) to deny the obligatory character of something which by the consensus of Muslims . . . is part of Islam, when it is well known as such, like the prayer (salat) or even one rak’a [act of prostration] from one of the five obligatory prayers, if there is no excuse; . . .
(15) to hold that any of Allah’s messengers or prophets are liars, or to deny their being sent;
A later legal scholar adds the following:
(16) to revile the religion of Islam;
(17) to believe that things themselves or by their own nature have causal influence independent of the will of Allah;
(18) to deny the existence of angels or jinn . . . or the heavens;
(19) to be sarcastic about any ruling of the Sacred Law;
This law leaves no room for ambiguity about the ultimate goal of Islam:
(20) or to deny that Allah intended the Prophet’s message . . . to be the religion followed by the entire world.
To sum up, these laws are all about abstract doctrine and belief, not about physical acts like murder, yet they elicit death. No one is allowed even to be sarcastic about Islamic law. Some are highly doctrinal and designed to crush different Islamic doctrines (nos. 5 and 6). No one may deny a passage in the Quran (no. 7). So how can the violent verses be renounced? Secular science is not permitted to flourish (no. 17). Clearly, these laws chill and stifle freedom of religion, thought, and speech.
Can or will Islamic countries revise or move past classical fiqh that is rooted in the Quran and sound hadith?
Conclusion
The reason Islam today shuts down freedom of religion is obvious. It is following its origins. The Quran came down allegedly from Allah through Gabriel, and Muhammad in his example was inspired by his deity. Islamic law flows out of these two sources.
However, when a religion suppresses free speech and dissent, it testifies against itself. What are the religious leaders trying to hide? Why is criticism shut down? If Islam really holds the Ultimate Truth and Final Revelation, then it should fear no challenge. The leaders should be able to defend it by words alone, for its appeal should be self-evident. People should flock to it willingly and without threat of violence. On the other hand, if people want to leave it—an unimaginable thought since Islam is so awesome—then they should be allowed to go without persecution or a sword hanging over their heads.
The ideal is for Islam to reform itself. Moderate Muslims believe that automatic execution of apostates does not have a secure basis in the Quran and early Islam. They may be right about this. It certainly is not a dominant theme. But can or will these moderates reform Islam on this subject? Can they persuade their more traditional fellow Muslims who follow the hadith and classical fiqh closely? Will they write numerous articles and books explaining why execution for apostasy is not found in the Quran? This would benefit all societies everywhere, for it would open the door for many to leave Islam, which is a burdensome and severe religion.
If not, then another strategy must be played out.
First, Islamic law must never be imposed or legitimized around the world. It is too barbaric. Freedom of religion must be given wide latitude. If it means criticizing the prophet, the Quran, and Islamic law itself, then freedom is still better than repression.
Second, free leaders all over the world must put pressure on oppressive Islamic governments. This news report shows exactly that happening.
Third, with the advent of the worldwide web, information flows freely, shining a light in the darkness. Ordinary citizens should keep track of Islamic oppression, sending emails to each other and reputable web logs (blogs). An informed citizenry is a free one, and maybe free citizens can help the oppressed across the globe. Contributions to a reputable human rights organization is another way to help.
Supplemental Material
If the readers would like to see the Quran in multiple translations, they should click on this website.
This article explains why the West must preserve freedom of speech and the Biblical basis of such freedom. Scroll down to the section on the New Testament, which diametrically opposes the Quran on freedom. Unlike Muhammad, Jesus never persecuted anyone who decided to leave him (John 6:60-70).
This report tracks the application of apostasy laws around the world, citing many examples.
This older but still accurate dictionary has a brief entry. Scroll down to “Apostasy from Islam.”
This mid-sized chapter was written by an older generation Christian who knew Islam and Arabic thoroughly. It also analyzes some legal rulings.
This is a short section in an online book. It surveys the main ideas on apostasy.
This short entry in an index to Islam has a list of Quranic verses and explains some Arabic words.
This short article contrasts Islam’s coercion of conscience with Christianity’s freedom of conscience.
This website has a booklet on apostasy.
Addendum
Maududi uses Sura 9:11-12 to justify executing apostates. Muhammad has a strong military. These verses continue Muhammad’s policy in Sura 9:1-5 of threatening the polytheists with death, ambushes, and besiegements.
9:11-12 . . . Yet if they [idolaters] repent even now, and establish Salat [prayer five times a day] and pay Zakat dues [forced "charity" tax], then they shall be your brethren in faith . . . But if they break their oaths after making compacts and revile your Faith, you should fight [q-t-l] with these ringleaders of disbelief because their oaths are not trustworthy: it may be that sword alone will restrain them. (Maududi, vol. 2, p. 179, insertions in brackets are mine)
Maududi says that according to the historical context, the “compacts” and “oaths” are not political treaties, but the acceptance of Islam. But after this renunciation and mockery of Islam, they become apostates. Muslims are therefore commanded to fight them. The Arabic root word q-t-l is used. Recall that it means to fight, kill, war, battle and slaughter. It has no ambiguity or broader meaning, as jihad does.
However, Maududi’s interpretation is not as secure as it first seems. It could very well be the case that “compacts” and “oaths” are political. Verses 3 and 4 support this political interpretation, for Muhammad warns the polytheists that his treaty obligations with them will come to an end, and at that time they were not Muslims. So the polytheists did not leave Islam because they were not part of it in the first place. But at least Maududi works hard at finding Quranic justification for killing apostates from Islam, ironically.
Source: The Punishment of the Apostate According to Islamic Law, scroll down to “The Proof from the Qur’an for the Commandment to Execute the Apostate”
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Copyright by James Malcolm Arlandson.
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Articles by James Arlandson
Answering Islam Home Page
I apologize for the length of this post. I felt that it needed to be posted to give us an exposure to moslem thinking not openly discussed in today’s media.
August 31, 2006 at 2:32 pm
Meanwhile, over on the front page — What Would You Do With Your ‘Last Days’?
August 31, 2006 at 4:05 pm
Big Jake,
Thanks for the very informative read. I’ve clipped it and will make sure my friends read it.
August 31, 2006 at 11:09 pm
You can solve the world’s problems after I address your remarks.
#249 American Women: Touching love story. “my husband taught me to use a firearm” Lets see..pick up gun, put bullet in gun, pull back hammmer, aim, squeeze trigger. Sounds simple enough to me. Oh yeah, I forgot. You’re a women. How many repetitions did it take before you finally got it? And if your husband trusts you while he’s away it can only be 1 of 3 reasons.
1. He’s a dumb ass
2. He straps a chastity belt on you.
3. You’re so frickin fat and ugly he doesn’t have to worry about anyone doinkin’ you.
#251/#252: President of the He-Man Women Haters Club. I don’t hate women. Everyone should own one. But, I know your real identity now, too. You’re Bob, on the male enhancement commercials. Between the brewski’s and playing with a vienna sausage you need something big in your life.
#253/#254 Last but not least, Red Dawn. Very, VERY typical women. You have so much to say, and you say it, and say it, and say it. Sometimes two or three times within just a few hours. Take care of livestock, huh? Must be sheep for your husband. Why else would he torture himself for 13 years.
Viber must be giving me the silent treatment. Now that’s a women I would marry. If I could just find a women who would give me the silent treatment I would be an extremely happy man.
September 1, 2006 at 2:09 am
Curious :
You are starting to give me the creeps.
Why are you so interested in my Vienna
Sausage?
If it is because “you need something big in your life” ,you are barking up the wrong tree ,bub. I’m happily married with four kids.
We know you have no interest in women and women have no interest in you.
Try taking out an ad in the Village Voice. Nobody has to be lonely anymore,even you.
PS I’m glad you enjoyed the commercial.
September 1, 2006 at 12:14 pm
Curious – far from fat, far from ugly, far from dumb, and I’ve never owned a belt. It’s called trust and love for that person standing next to you. My guy is one of the smartest men I know. I didn’t say it took me long to learn how to use a gun … I just had zero desire to ever pick one up. Although with people like you in this world, I’m seeing why my husband insisted I learn how to use one.
Big Jake, Eagle, Red Dawn, Viber and every other level headed person on the blog, I’d like to continue to correspond with you and I will as long as you’re on the site. I will not be reading any of curious’s posts. He can rant to someone else.
September 1, 2006 at 12:32 pm
Americanwoman–
You’re exactly right; he’s not worth responding to.
We don’t need weak, American males like him who are obviously so threatened by women.I really do wish he’d take my advice and EXPORT himself to Iran.
He’s just so terribly pathetic.
September 1, 2006 at 1:25 pm
More insight to muslim thought…
8/8/2006 Clip No. 1230
Syrian Cleric Muhammad Said Ramadhan Al-Bouti on Hizbullah TV: I Support Blowing Up American and Israeli Targets around the World
Following are excerpts from an interview with Syrian cleric, Muhammad Said Ramadhan Al-Bouti which aired on Al-Manar TV on August 8, 2006:
Muhammad Said Ramadhan Al-Bouti: As you know, the enemy in this war appears to be Israel, but, as everyone knows, the fighting enemy is actually America. Israel is merely the claw of America in this war. People who cannot stand with their fighting brothers can still fight. They can carry out other actions.
[...]
Israel is now in the throes of death, due to the grip that has tightened around its neck. I used to be one of those who did not support acts that can be characterized as adventurous, like destroying American targets, blowing them up. But now… yesterday I was thinking about this and I looked up what the jurisprudents had to say in this matter. I hold that people who cannot stand with the Islamic resistance, but can carry out, in their countries and in other places, actions that would in some way paralyze this enemy – they should indeed paralyze the enemies’ interests, and destroy their facilities wherever they may be, but on condition that they do not confuse things. In other words, innocent lives should not be lost, the action should be carefully planned, and should by limited to the people who are hostile to us. So, you are calling for a passive boycott, for example? Economic boycott is one option. This can be done by all Arab and Islamic countries. In addition, if I were asked about destroying the facilities and interests of the enemies – America and Israel – in the various countries… Does the religious law allow us to do this? yes, as long as innocent people are not killed in the process.
September 1, 2006 at 1:29 pm
8/8/2006 Clip No. 1229
Moroccan Author Khanatha Banouna: We Need Millions of Hasan Nasrallahs and Osama bin Ladens
Following are excerpts from an interview with Moroccan author, Khanatha Banouna, which aired on Al-Jazeera TV on August 8, 2006:
Khanatha Banouna: Anyone with responsibility – in the home, in official institutions, in the pulpits, in the media, in the ideological sphere, and in politics – must build up active range – rage will shake the worm-eaten roots, which have brought us to this sick reality.
[...]
We need Hasan Nasrallah, millions of Hasan Nasrallahs. We need millions of Osama bin Ladens. We need millions of people armed with real active rage.
[...]
We are not Indians. I said this to an American journalist who came to me before the [9/11] New York incidents. I told them I believe in “blood for blood.” I still say this. I still believe in “blood for blood,” and if I had the power, I would do it myself.
[...]
We are not terrorists. What terrorist in the world is more terrible than Bush and all the Zionists? We are not terrorists, but if self-defense, and defending our values, our identity, our culture, and our religion is terrorism, then we welcome every type of terrorism on the face of the earth. In that case, I’m a terrorist, heading the list of terrorists.
September 1, 2006 at 1:46 pm
5/23/2006 Clip No. 1174
Saudi Shura Council member Ibrahim Al-Buleihi: Terrorism Is the Product of a Flaw in Arab and Muslim Culture
Following are excerpts from an interview with Saudi Shura Council member Ibrahim Al-Buleihi, which aired on Channel 1, Saudi TV, on May 23, 2006.
Interviewer: Some elements in Arab and Muslim societies have intensified the hostility towards Arabs and Muslims, through their acts of violence and terrorism, to the point that we see images of slaughtering the other – American or European – live on TV.
Ibrahim Al-Buleihi: In my opinion, we should not describe these people as deviant. This is the product of our culture.
[...]
They are the product of a culture that believes the other does not deserve to live, and is an absolute enemy with whom no understanding is possible.
[...]
There is a fundamental flaw in our culture that leads to this behavior. This ideology, which was advocated by Sayyid Qutb, and which is implemented by those who kill innocent people – women, children, and people who have done nothing wrong – did not emerge out of thin air, but is the product of this culture. This is a one-dimensional culture, a culture of tyranny – tyranny in culture, in politics, in society, in the family, and in everything.
[...]
The “other” does not have to be someone completely different. When we disagree with someone, even over a shoe-shine, we regard him as the “other,” we boycott him, we excommunicate him, defame him, level accusations at him, and so on.
September 1, 2006 at 2:33 pm
Very interesting, thought-provoking stuff, Big Jake. Particularly the last one, from Al-Buleihi. Keep it up.
September 1, 2006 at 3:58 pm
I want my chance to respond to Curious. I know guys like you. About 10 years ago my sister dated a guy briefly, like twice maybe. He was jealous, she didn’t like it, so she told him she didn’t want to see him anymore. He follows her home one night, pulls her out of her car and beats the shit out of her breaking her nose in two places and putting her in hospital a couple of days. She pressed charges, he went to a jail for a little while (not long enough) and he was ordered to pay restitution, (again not enough). What this clown didn’t consider, was that she had a brother in another county with a short fuse. After he was out about 6 months, I paid him a visit. I did what my 100lb sister couldn’t do. He didn’t press charges. You know why? Because I told him if he did, that he better hope I NEVER got out. Because when I did, it would never stop. I’m glad he believed me, because back then I meant it. I was a lot younger then, but honestly, I still probably do it again.
I’m also pissed the way you insult an AMERICAN SOLDIER’S wife. What the hell is wrong with you? My wife was killed in an accident 7 years ago leaving me to take care of our 2 year old son. Trust me, pal, I didn’t realize how much my wife did until she wasn’t there to do it anymore. All I had to do before the accident was bring a home a check and take care of her. I got a real dose of reality once she was gone. I didn’t know how good I had it. You pop off about father’s teaching their sons to use women for one thing. If my son EVER hit a women or treated her with disrespect he’d have to deal with me. My son’s mother was a saint, and a hard worker, and I wish I could turn back the clock and run the errand she was on when all this came down. If it doesn’t look like a women does anything, it’s because she does it too well. The husband’s of Red Dawn and American Women are lucky men. And you need your ass kicked for shooting off your mouth.
Big Jake, you said once before you were a fellow New Yorker. How about tonight, around 7:00, crack open a beer and I will, too. You’re my kind of guy.
Lets drink to curious staying the hell off this site and going to Tehran so he kind a women he can kick around. American women are too good for him.
September 1, 2006 at 4:40 pm
Big Jake–
Fantastic information!
You quoted Muhammad Said Ramadhan Al-Bouti as saying:
“I hold that people who cannot stand with the Islamic resistance, but can carry out, in their countries and in other places, actions that would in some way paralyze this enemy – they should indeed paralyze the enemies’ interests, and destroy their facilities wherever they may be, but on condition that they do not confuse things. In other words, innocent lives should not be lost, the action should be carefully planned, and should be limited to the people who are hostile to us. So, you are calling for a passive boycott, for example? Economic boycott is one option. This can be done by all Arab and Islamic countries. In addition, if I were asked about destroying the facilities and interests of the enemies – America and Israel – in the various countries… Does the religious law allow us to do this? yes, as long as innocent people are not killed in the process.”
Obviously, not one of these terrorists listens to him. I was watching a documentary the other day and they were interviewing the man who created Azzam.com (sp?) and he said that all people who the terrorists set their sights on were the enemy and were looked upon as “fighters”. How they actually justify this is beyond me. Just an excuse to murder anyone, because they’re depraved animals who get off on murder.
You quoted Ibrahim Al-Buleihi as saying:
“They are the product of a culture that believes the other does not deserve to live, and is an absolute enemy with whom no understanding is possible.”
I’m assuming he’s referring to those moslems that believe in “death to infidels” as opposed to the moslem culture in its entirety. There is nothing for it; they must be annihilated, those moslems that do not believe in the sacredness of life.
As Bush stated after 911, “You are either for us, or against us. ” Those that passively support the terrorists should be regarded as terrorists. Those that support the terrorist agenda even in idealogy included. Line ‘em up, and take ‘em out.
I’m tired of the b.s. and the moslems in this country who use their American rights to speak out for the terrorists…if you speak for the terrorists, you are the enemy. They should have their assets seized and immediately deported to the moslem nation of their choice.
zealot-
Thank you for defending American women. I am sorry for your loss and think you sound like a wonderful husband, brother, and father. I’m sure your family thinks the world of you. I’d love to have a beer with you! I’m on the east coast–I’d love to crack one open at 7:00 and toast to you and Big Jake–REAL AMERICAN men.
September 1, 2006 at 5:02 pm
To any American moslems reading this blog, I’ll put what I said above in context:
I am a christian American who does not believe in abortion–however, I do not believe doctors who perform abortions or abortion clinic should be blown up.
I dislike the IRS as much as the next American–however, I do not believe buildings that house IRS offices or IRS employees should be blown up.
I believe that Americans who believe they are justified in going out and doing such monstrous things are criminals and should be treated as such. I believe that anyone who vocally supports people who do such things are potentially dangerous themselves.
September 1, 2006 at 6:03 pm
Zealot – Like Red Dawn, I too, am so sorry for the loss of your wife. She sounds like someone who would have been a great friend! Single parenting is not easy. Your son is lucky to have you for a role model. Thank you for your comments to Curious on my behalf as well. Chivalry is not dead.
Big Jake, I think we need to get your information out to as many people as we can. Americans are gullible and too many have fallen for the “poor Hezbollah, poor Palestinians, poor Iranians” garbage perpetuated in the media that it is scary. I think your discourse on the Quran might get some attention. How do we spread the word without looking nutty?
So what does everyone (except Curious) think about the British film company doing a “fake” assassination of President Bush? Notice Americans didn’t pour into the streets burning the British flag like so many Moslems did over the comic flap.
I live in the Northeast, not far from New York. My husband is from New Hampshire. When I visited my husband-to-be for the first time, I remember being really impressed with the motto on NH plates – “Live Free or Die” – because it fits my belief system to a “T.”
September 1, 2006 at 6:17 pm
I hope I can post this here. I read it on a site called http://www.americandigest.org/ created by a man by the name of Gerard Van der Leun. He wrote this article and I think it is absolutely fantastic! It is long but a clever and insightful read.
The War of Two Religions
Through the violent attacks of a Radical Islam, two religions have been brought into conflict. The first is that of Islam, a faith that at its core requires absolute submission from its adherents, and looks towards the subjugation of the world as its ultimate apotheosis. As the youngest of the monotheistic religions, Islam is at a point in its development that Christianity passed through centuries ago. And it is not with Christianity that Islam is currently at war. Islam is saving that for the mopping up phase of its current campaign. The religion that Islam has engaged is a much younger one, the religion of Freedom.
As a religion Freedom has been gaining converts since the success of the American Revolution enabled it to go forth and be preached to the world. Freedom is easily the most popular of the new religions and historically converts nearly 100% of all populations in which it is allowed to take firm root. This is the religion which we have lately brought to Iraq.
The genius of the religion of Freedom is that it allows all other religions, from the venerable to the trivial, to exist without fear of censure or destruction. Indeed, the only thing that the religion of Freedom firmly forbids is the destruction of Freedom itself. “Thou shalt not destroy Freedom” seems to be the only commandment. And Freedom has been shown to resist efforts to destroy it in the most ferocious way. It’s enemies would do well to ponder the fate of previous attempts to do so.
On September 11, the agents of Radical Islam began their attempt to destroy Freedom by attacking it at its core. The reaction of Freedom to this assault has been, once you consider the destructive power of the weapons systems it possesses, measured, deliberate and cautious. This is because Freedom, although sorely wounded, does not yet feel that its very existence is threatened. A more serious attack at any time in the future will put paid to that specious notion.
Following a second attack at a level equal to or exceeding September 11, any political opposition to pursuing our enemies with all means at our disposal will be swept off the table. The First Terrorist War will begin in earnest and it will not be a series of small wars with long lead times and a careful consultation of allies. The war will become, virtually overnight, a global war of violent preemption and merciless attack towards the spiritual and geographic centers of our enemy. Arguments revolving around the true meaning of ‘imminent’ will be seen as they are — so much factional prattle. Due to the nature of the enemy, the First Terrorist War will be fought here and there and everywhere. It does not matter when or where the second serious strike on the American homeland takes place, it only matters that on the day after this country will be at war far beyond the current level of conflict.
[...]
During the Second World War, our system, with few alterations, brought us through to a peace in which there were greater freedoms than before the war. Victory validated our way of life. Not only were our freedoms intact in 1945 but they were poised, with the economy, for a great expansion throughout the rest of the century and into this. If you had proposed, in the summer of 1946, that within 50 years all minorities would be fully enfranchised, that women would be fully liberated, and that homosexuals would be a dominant force with their enfranchisement only a moment away, you would have been dismissed as a socialist dreamer. And yet, here we are.
The same situation can also be envisioned as the result of our victory in the First Terrorist War at the end of a less-clear but no less threatening passage of arms. But this will only happen if we remain clear about the real nature of the First Terrorist War, and committed to unequivocal victory regardless of the costs in lives and treasure. Only by matching the determination of our enemy to destroy us will we prevail. The only thing that can defeat us are a dull reliance on management, a fascination with process rather than victory and the reluctance to believe the extent to which our enemy desires our annihilation.
Beyond victory in the First Terrorist War is a greater goal. What we must seek is not merely the “control” and “containment” of terror, for terror in this guise cannot be controlled or contained. We must come to the deeper understanding that only a complete victory over the global Radical Islamic forces can prevent the onset of a confrontation more terrible than the current war.
What we must press for in the Terrorist War is a victory so decisive that we can, in the end, avoid the larger war lurking on the not-so-distant horizon – - a true war between civilizations. That war, should it come, will not take the name of The Terrorist War, but of The Islamic War.
The Terrorist War is still a struggle that can be fought and won with conventional means. An Islamic War, should it come, would engulf the world and be anything but conventional.
Vanderleun : August 21, 06
September 1, 2006 at 7:54 pm
Americanwoman–
You said “Americans are gullible and too many have fallen for the “poor Hezbollah, poor Palestinians, poor Iranians” garbage perpetuated in the media that it is scary.”
Unfortunately, these same Americans that believe the media propaganda are the ones highly unlikely to do any real research on the issue at hand because they are too complacent; much easier to have people tell you what to think and “why”, rather than formulate their own opinions based on true knowledge. That would be too much like “work”; people would far rather whine, “Can’t we all just get along???”
Since the terrorists won’t stop their war with us, these same Americans (which I believe are the majority)reason, “Well, if they have such a beef with us, it MUST be our fault. We certainly can bend over backwards for them since they won’t for us. We just want to make this all go away so we can continue on in our own little microscopic, hedonistic worlds where no great faith or idealogy or passions need to be comprehended or are required.”
This is why you hear so many American fools regurgitate that same old rhetoric the media and certain political parties spin “It’s all our fault because of our middle east policies.” When you hear them say this, ask them what our American policies in the middle east have been, since say, the 70’s to present time. I guarantee you anyone spewing this rhetoric won’t be able to pontificate with any accurate length on this.
September 1, 2006 at 9:10 pm
Zealot ,good buddy, it would be both an honor and a privilege to have a beer with you as well as Americanwoman,RedDawn ,Viber,DJ ,Duckhunter, Eagle,Mujibar and don’t forget our webhost Quayfortuna. You guys and gals are the best.
Zealot , I believe I don’t have to tell you that your beautiful wife still lives . She lives through you in everything you do as you raise your beautiful son. Look deeply into his eyes and you will see the reflection of her soul.
As he grows ,nourish him with the stories of his mother and her love for both of you. Love NEVER dies. It is just a dream postponed until we meet again.
Now lets share our thoughts tonight at 7PM .I’ll be thinking of you all . I’ll be thinking of friends lost on 9-11 at the World Trade Center.I’ll be thinking of the victims of terrorism. I’ll be saying a prayer for all the men and women serving our country, may God keep them safe and hold them in the palm of His hand
until they return. And for all our Honored Dead and wounded ,may God be with them ,lest we forget.
God Bless all of you.
God Bless the United States of America!
September 1, 2006 at 11:11 pm
Having that 7 o’clock beer now!
Here’s to you guys, you are wonderful!
Here’s to America, the last nation of hope.
Here’s most importantly to God, Yahweh, Supreme Ruler, and to His Son, Jesus Christ, who will bring, not destruction, but HOPE eternal for all of mankind.
Cheers, my friends!!!
September 1, 2006 at 11:17 pm
Cheers!
September 2, 2006 at 1:04 am
You guys are great. I didn’t give a thought that you’d be on the web site at 7:00, but just so you know, I did have a beer then and I raised it to all of you. Big Jake, I do tell my son about his Mom. A day doesn’t go by that I don’t wish she was back. I gave my sister a bunch of pictures of all of us before she died and she made a scrapbook for him with a tribute to her. He’s a great kid, and thanks to my Mom and my sister, I get a lot of help with things like birthday partys and stuff like that. But my son and I are buds. He’s into a lot of sports and I get involved in everything he does. Wouldn’t miss a game for anything. I just want him to grow up and be a good man. My wife’s name was Caroline, and she was as beautiful as her name. I’ll always love her. Thanks.
September 2, 2006 at 11:37 am
I’ll stay off this site but not before I say one more time that I think you all suck.
Zealot, I hope you got his side of the story before you beat him up. Chances are, your sister probably led him on. No guy does that after a couple of dates. Your sister did something to set him off. She got what women like her deserve.
And as far as the rest of it goes, it doesn’t sound like you were married for very long. Chances are, if that wouldn’t have happened your son would be with your wife across town with another guy and you’d be paying for it.
1In my opinion, you were lucky.
I’m done here.
September 2, 2006 at 2:10 pm
Good Riddance to Bad RUBBISH
September 2, 2006 at 2:22 pm
Interesting article in todays NY Times .What strikes me is the similarity of the problem of arab migration in the microcosm of Iraq to the Moslem immigration problem in Europe ,Australia and the US.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/02/world/middleeast/02arabs.html?ex=1314849600&en=814ef10794d8c4cf&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
September 2, 2006 at 2:33 pm
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5/4/2006 Clip No. 1132
Former Hizbullah Secretary-General Subhi Al-Tufeili Criticizes Hizbullah for Its Relations with Iran and Says Iran Brought America into Iraq to Topple Saddam
Following are excerpts from an interview with former Hizbullah secretary-general Subhi Al-Tufeili, which aired on Al-Arabiya TV on May 4, 2006.
Interviewer: How would you characterize your relationship with the current Hizbullah leadership, and especially with Secretary-General Hassan Nasrallah?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: We have no relations. Since 1997, we have had no relations.
Interviewer: Why? What is the main disagreement?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: When I called upon them to defend our people, they refused and said: “Go. We will oppose you.”
Interviewer: What was the reason?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: They are committed to the Iranian policy.
[...]
I have said before that the Shiites in Lebanon serve as Iran’s “playing ground” in the following sense: The resistance has been dragged into things that are not resistance. Today, we have no resistance, I’m sad to say.
[...]
We are a resistance organization. We have an enemy which has occupied our Jerusalem and our land. It has spilled our blood for more than half a century.
Interviewer: So you are Arab resistance, not Lebanese…
Subhi Al-Tufeili: We are Islamic resistance – an Arab resistance and even broader than that. This is what our religion has instructed us, and this was where we began. When we established the resistance, this was our point of departure. The motto of the resistance was the liberation of Jerusalem. That’s how we started.
This kind of resistance must continue. Today it is not resistance, but merely a border police. This is painful not only for me, but to our youth as well. I know them well, because I raised them myself. They are good people, pure people, who love defense, martyrdom-seeking, and Jihad. It pains them that they are stopped at the border.
This is a tragedy. The weapons of the resistance have been transformed from weapons used to strike fear in the hearts of the enemy into weapons we use to strike fear in the hearts of one another.
The resistance used to constitute glory, power, and honor for all Lebanese. Today, because it stands at the border this way, it has turned into an internal problem. Today we have the internal problem of the weapons of the resistance. What are we going to do with these weapons? One says keep them, another says disarm, a third says incorporate them in the army, and so on. The country is on the brink of civil war because of this conflict.
Interviewer: What do you, Sheik Subhi Al-Tufeili, say about this internal problem of the weapons of the resistance?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: The reason for this problem is that the resistance has given up its role.
Interviewer: So if they had carried out operations within the Israeli, or Palestinian, borders, the internal problem of the weapons of the resistance would not have existed?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: With your permission, I’d like to ask a question instead. Is there anybody in Lebanon, or even outside Lebanon – in Syria, Iraq, Iran, Palestine, anywhere – who would say no to the liberation of Palestine?
Interviewer: No one is saying no to the liberation of Palestine, but it depends on the methods. The Palestinian people have decided to sign a peace treaty, Sheik.
Subhi Al-Tufeili: Let us not get into the small details. I know that if we were to conduct a survey in Lebanon, or anywhere else in the Islamic world, I believe that most of the people – and I don’t want to say all of them… The vast majority of the people would be willing to pay the price, with their children, with their own lives, and with the destruction of their country, for the liberation of Jerusalem. The issue of Jerusalem for us…
Interviewer: You are very optimistic, Sheik. People would pay for the liberations of Jerusalem with their children, while the Palestinians have signed a peace treaty with the Israelis?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: Okay, okay. We need to put things in the proper context. The deceit, lies, threats, deception, and all the despicable methods that were used in order to force the Palestinians to agree to the plundering of their land – the recent elections have proven that all this is gone.
[...]
Hizbullah definitely fosters its relations with the Syrians, but its real leadership is “the rule of the jurisprudent” – in other words, Khamenei.
[...]
The Iranians wanted to get rid of Saddam by bringing the Americans into Iraq. This is a very grave responsibility that they bear.
Interviewer: Do you contend that they foster the American plan?
Subhi Al-Tufeili:They wanted this, and they sent Iraqis to America in order to reassure the Americans that they should come to Iraq.
[...]
Interviewer: Do you support [Iranian] nuclear weapons today?
Subhi Al-Tufeili: I’m in favor, I support, and I am willing to make sacrifices so that all the Islamic countries and peoples will develop scientifically in terms of nuclear and other technologies. We cannot remain at the bottom of the ladder of humanity. The justifications that many people use are invalid, in my opinion.
I defend the nuclear development of Saudi Arabia with the same passion and fervor with which I defend the development of Iran, Turkey, or Pakistan, in the hope that the rulers will go, and this technology, science, knowledge and capabilities will remain in the hands of the peoples, which will survive. We cannot continue to be left as prey for those who want to devour us.
September 2, 2006 at 10:48 pm
re:post#181
AnotherMAD from Turkey asks:
is it true that christian inquision courts were burning girls because they are witches. or torturing people?
muslims never burn people. they cut hands and foots and heads.
and I respond:
It was true about 500 years ago. It is not a current practice in Judeo-Christian society today. However .. as far as Muslim society is concerned, the clock stopped 500 years ago. chopping off of “foots and hands” still goes on today as well as the “cutting of necks”.
We readers of this blog now know that “muslims never burn people” because it is Allahs punishment.
“. . . The news of this event reached Ibn Abbas [Muhammad’s cousin and highly reliable transmitter of traditions] who said, “If I had been in his [Ali’s] place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Messenger forbad it, saying, ‘Do no punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah Messenger, ‘Whoever change[s] his Islamic religion, then kill him.’” (Bukhari, Apostates, no. 6922; online source)”
re: post #270
Americanwoman:
“I think we need to get your information out to as many people as we can. Americans are gullible and too many have fallen for the “poor Hezbollah, poor Palestinians, poor Iranians” garbage perpetuated in the media that it is scary. I think your discourse on the Quran might get some attention. How do we spread the word without looking nutty?”
We have to refer to this blog as a reference point when the topic comes up and not remain silent when we are confronted with uninformed
fellow Americans who promote the “poor Hezbollah, poor Palestinians, poor Iranians”
argument.
Islam will be a “Religion of Peace” only when all other religions have been eradicated.
September 3, 2006 at 3:57 am
key phrase -see post #256 re:Apostasy in the Quran
“Would you agree to become apostates, Jews, or Christians? Would you agree to abandon the religion of Islam?”
3/17/2006 Clip No. 1078
The Will of Fahd Al-Farraj, Al-Qaeda Commander in Saudi Arabia
Following are excerpts from a recorded will of Al-Qaeda Commander in Saudi Arabia Fahd Al Farraj, aired on http://www.alsaha.com on March 17, 2006:
The will of commander Fahd bin Farraj Al-Jweir Al-Farraj, one of the commanders of Al-Qaeda organization in the Arabian Peninsula.
Fahd Al-Farraj in training in the Arabian Peninsula.
The Battar Camp.
Drive the polytheists out of the Arabian Peninsula.
Fahd Al Farraj: I want to clarify and to reiterate the goals we wish to accomplish, with Allah’s help, and to respond to some doubts about the mujahideen, raised by the scholars of evil, who level such accusations against them. First of all, the goal of our Jihad is to elevate the word of Allah, to drive the polytheists out of the peninsula of Muhammad, to apply his law in all aspects of life and on all people, and to remove injustice from our oppressed brothers everywhere.
[...]
To all the Muslim peoples wherever they may be, I say: How long will you remain silent? How long will you accept this humiliation and degredation? How long will you continue to be ruled by the law of the tyrants, yet remain silent? Where is your Islam? Where is your worship of Allah? Islam is not a religion in name only – It is a religion of faith and action. The Crusaders, the Hindus, the Zoroastrians, and their apostate helpers rule and control you and your brothers. They are fighting against your religion, and are fighting you in your livelihood. They are violating your honor, yet you remain silent. Have your humiliation and degradation brought you that low? Would you agree to become apostates, Jews, or Christians? Would you agree to abandon the religion of Islam?
[...]
I ask every Muslim on the face of the earth: would you agree that one of these infidels enter your home, and violate the honor of your sister, your mother, or your daughter? Of course you would not. The women in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya, Indonesia, Kashmir, and the Philippines are our sisters, our mothers, and our daughters. I am amazed how you can continue to sleep undisturbed, while your brothers are being killed, and the honor of your sisters is being violated. Awaken from your slumber, and support your oppressed brothers. Fight for the sake of Allah, and you will receive one of the two good things: victory or martyrdom.
[...]
To the security forces, I say: I am amazed at you. When you are told to wage jihad, you cling to this world. But when [Saudi Interior Minister Prince] Naif Bin Abd Al-’Aziz tells you to sell your souls to his government and to fight for his sake, and to defend the Americans, in exchange for 3,000 rials and hell – you are willing to sell your souls cheaply. Have you stooped so low? Are your souls worthless for you? He calls you “martyrs of duty”, but think what you will say to Allah if you meet him, after having killed a mujaheed who fought for the sake of Allah, in order to defend the Americans, or if he killed you when you were defending the tyrants. Stop working for the tyrant, and join the mujahideen, otherwise – you know full well who the mujahideen are, and what they have prepared for those who stand in their way.
[..]
To the Saudi government, I say: All I say to you us what the Prophet Muhammad said to the infidels of Qureysh, when he was alone: “I have brought slaughter upon you.” By Allah, your kingdom will come to an end. The mujahideen will defeat you. Do you know why? Because Allah supports us, and no one supports you. Do you know why? Because Allah said in the Koran: “If you support Allah, He will support you,” and we trust and believe in the promise of Allah. If you only knew what our young men have in store for you, you would be busy arranging your escape from this peninsula.
[...]
To the Americans, I say: get out of the peninsula of Muhammad, and all the lands of the Muslims, and stop supporting the Jews in Palestine and the Christians in the lands of the Muslims. Otherwise, you will encounter only death, destruction, and explosions.
September 3, 2006 at 2:47 pm
#281 – “Islam will be a “Religion of Peace” only when all other religions have been eradicated.”
I think this statement is too simplistic. With absolute power comes absolute corruption. It’s a certainty. There will always be people who will stand up and fight a corrupt group, so we will always have the formation of other religions/groups who fight the rulers, resulting in (in this scenario) constant challenges to Islam (with the result that Islam will never be peaceful).
I think the radical Moslems know they can never have “Islam for everyone” as long as Americans exist on the planet (Brits, Germans, Aussies, as well). We are too used to our freedoms and look at them as a right. The only chance they have to further their cause, is to wipe us out. That’s really what it boils down to.
We had better wake up, especially our politicians who are failing all good Americans by their bickering and lack of unity.
September 3, 2006 at 8:48 pm
281 – “Islam will be a “Religion of Peace” only when all other religions have been eradicated.”
Americanwoman :
I added that comment to counter anyone who says that Islam is a peaceful religion. It is a religion of war, of Jihad, of blood and fire.
It is diametrically opposed to everything we believe and hold precious.
Freedom of Religion- in Islam there is none -you are either Muslim or the Other (an Apostate,Christian, Jew or Hindu)
Freedom of Speech – in Islam there is none . Step out of line ,the man comes and takes you away- Fatwa and the cutting of necks.
If anybody thinks that this isn’t a clash of civilizations ,they better go back to the history books. They mean to wipe us out or to convert us. Look at the pronouncement from Al Qaeda OFFERING President Bush and the American People the opportunity to convert to Islam or accept the consequences, and the offer to American and Nato forces in Afganistan to change sides .
September 3, 2006 at 11:14 pm
Big Jake, I agree. The latest tape from our “friends” says exactly what you’ve described in the past few days. They’re giving us the chance to convert and by saying no, it’s now okay to slaughter us. Makes you wonder if there’s something in the works for the very near future.
.
September 4, 2006 at 1:09 am
Eagle, Red Dawn, Viber, Zealot – hope you all are taking a few days of well deserved rest. I look forward to corresponding with you when you return and am sure Big Jake does, too.
Quay, are you by chance related to Mr. Hodges?
September 4, 2006 at 1:15 am
Let’s not get carried away here. They have just tipped their hand (or shall I say we finally understand where they are comming from)as to their long range goal which is religious world domination.
Religious world domination is also a Christian goal. Christians believe that we must spread the Gospel so that all may be saved and avoid final damnation. Ours is a beneficent desire toward mankind.Spreading the Gospel is the goal . Reception of the message is purely voluntary.
Theirs is something other than that.
Whether or not something is up in the near future may or may not be so. This could be propaganda bravado to counter the heavy losses AlQaeda and the Taliban just suffered (200 dead in Kandahar). Hopefully ,our guys are listening for increased “chatter” which always has preceeded attacks.
September 4, 2006 at 1:27 am
Big Jake, I hope you are correct. I know we have really good people in the CIA, DHS, and FBI, but our human intelligence leaves a bit to be desired in this area, thanks to President Clinton in many ways and President Bush pre 9-11. I thank you for the reality check, though. My husband says the same thing about a potential attack. It’s comforting to hear it from another educated source because I’m not completely prepared (although I continue to work on it). I just wish I could get my friends to do the same. Once prepared, you don’t have to dwell on the possibility so much. Know what I mean?
September 4, 2006 at 1:38 am
And I hear you on the Christian goal as well. I’ve got a cousin who is a doctor. He went to Africa (almost got killed there with his wife and son) to spread the word on Christianity. He’s a nice guy, a bit spoiled by my Aunt and Uncle, but it always bothered me that his primary goal there was not to practice much needed medicine, but spread the word about his religion. It’s one of the big problems I have with religion. I’m willing to admit that having no religion isn’t any better because it’s every “man for himself” in that case. I believe in a higher entity, a God, and will go to my death believing the 10 commandments are “the” way we should all strive to live our lives as long as the commandments are taken with some common sense. For instance, I believe in “Thou shalt not kill” to mean one should not go out and randomly kill another human being. If someone attacks me or one of my kids, I’m gonna fight back with death to our attacker in mind.
September 4, 2006 at 2:23 am
Americanwoman: I guess I did want to take a few days off after the last post from our “friend”. I’ve never really come across anyone quite like that and he’s anonymous so you can’t really do anything about it other than take it. It just gnaws at me that he can have such low opinions about people he doesn’t even know. I don’t care what he thinks of me, but talking about my sister and my wife like that. I hate it. My wife was terrific and so’s my sister. I read the way you feel about your husband, and that’s so great, but it made me think how much I miss my wife and how lucky your husband is. My wife was awesome. She’s been dead 7 years, and sometimes I feel like it just happened yesterday. My son hardly knew her, but he even acts like her sometimes. He says things like she would say them. He smiles like her. Then to have some creep talk down about her, like she was something cheap, I don’t know. I can’t explain it. She was my mine. All mine. And what we had was good. People tell me someday I’ll “find someone”. I don’t think that will ever happen. I’m not even looking. I just want her. I don’t know why I’m going on about this, just his post got to me the other day. I do want to keep doing this with all of you. It helps me stay sane. And you’re all so smart. I probably sound like an idiot most of the time. It’s been good getting this off my chest. Ya know, you and Red Dawn, I like you, the way you stand by your men. I really like that. I’m learning a lot from all the posts. Jake, you’re a smart guy.
September 4, 2006 at 2:32 am
American woman re post#289:
The Fifth Commandment Thou Shalt not kill means you shall mot commit murder. It doesn’t mean you can’t defend yourself or your loved ones.
The 10 Commandments lay out the basic rules to live by .Respect for God ,respect for parents and family ,respect for the rights of others.
I-I am the Lord thy God ,Thou shalt not have strange gods before me.
II- Thou shalt not take the Name of the Lord Thy God in vain.
III-Thou shalt keep holy the Sabbath
IV-Honor thy Father and thy Mother
V- Thou shalt not kill
VI-Thou shalt not commit adultry
VII-Thou shalt not steal
VIII Thou shalt not bare false witness against thy neighbor.
IX Thou shalt not covet thy neighbors wife
X Thou shalt not covet thy neighbors goods
Love thy neighbor was, in part, Jesus’ answer when the Pharisees, the chief religious sect of that day, asked Him about the greatest commandment in the Law (See Matthew 22:36-40).
He responded:
“Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
This is the essence of Christianity as I know it.
September 4, 2006 at 3:01 am
ZEALOT ,Good Buddy, great to have you back.
Don’t let that jerk get under your skin . He has no class ,never will. One of these days he will shoot off his mouth to the wrong guy . It will be the last thing he ever does.
By the way, if I was ever in a fight ,I’d be lucky to have someone like you backing me up.
Courage and honor ,Spirit and Guts.
September 4, 2006 at 3:16 am
As most of you know by now I’m a big fan of John Wayne, I came across this article and i want to share it with all of you.
JOHN WAYNE IN HEAVEN?
Most of you know John Wayne as an actor. You may not know what happened to him before he died. This is that story.
Robert Schuller’s teenage daughter, Cindy, was in a motorcycle accident and had to have her leg amputated. John Wayne was a big fan of Robert Schuller. He heard Dr. Schuller say on one of his programs that his daughter had been in an accident and had to have her leg amputated.
John Wayne wrote a note to her saying: Dear Cindy, sorry to hear about your accident. Hope you get to be all right. Signed John Wayne.
The note was delivered to her and she decided she wanted to write John Wayne a note in reply. She wrote: Dear Mr. Wayne, I got your note. Thanks for writing me. I like you very much. I am going to be all right because Jesus is going to help me. Mr. Wayne, do you know Jesus? I sure hope you know Jesus, Mr. Wayne, because I cannot imagine heaven being complete without John Wayne being there. I hope, if you don’t know Jesus, that you will give your heart to Jesus right now. See you in heaven. And then signed her name.
She had just put that letter in an envelope, sealed it, and written across the front of it “John Wayne” when a visitor came into her room to see her. He said to her: What are you doing?
She said: I just wrote a letter to John Wayne, but I don’t know how to get it to him.
He said: That’s funny, I am going to have dinner with John Wayne tonight at the Newport Club down at Newport Beach. Give it to me and I will give it to him. She gave him the letter and he put it in his coat pocket.
There were twelve of them that night sitting around the table for dinner. They were laughing and cutting up and the guy happened to reach in his pocket and felt that letter and remembered. John Wayne was seated at the end of the table and the guy took the letter out and said: Hey, Duke, I was in Schuller’s daughter’s room today and she wrote you a letter and wanted me to give it to you. Here it is. They passed it down to John Wayne and he opened it. They kept on laughing and cutting up and someone happened to look down at John Wayne. He was crying. One of them said: Hey, Duke, what is the matter? He said (and can’t you hear him saying it?): I want to read you this letter.
He read that letter. Then he began to weep. He folded it, put it in his pocket, and he pointed to the man who delivered it to him and said: You go tell that little girl that right now, in this restaurant, right here, John Wayne gives his heart to Jesus Christ and I will see her in heaven.
Three weeks later he was dead.
September 4, 2006 at 11:21 am
Re: 286 — Sorry, ma’am, I know no “Mr. Hodges.”
September 4, 2006 at 12:18 pm
Big Jake. After reading everything on here about Islam and christianity and especially after reading your 292 and 293 posts I remembered my wife had a bible that I kept in a box of her things I was saving to give my son when he got older. I got it out and was flipping through it. She had stuff underlined and highlighted and things written in the margins. She used to talk about God a lot and she always went to church. I used to go with her once in a while. Not a lot. She always told me she whe was praying for me. I’m a fireman so I always thought it was because she was always worried. Just want you to know, John Wayne is a man’s man. I believe my wife is in heaven, so if I ever want to see her again, I better make sure I get there too. So, I asked Jesus to come in to my heart a few minutes ago, and it’s weird, but I feel so good about it. I’m going to tell my son and the rest of my family. I don’t know much about this or even what I’m doing, but it just feels right. Can’t wait to meet John Wayne and someday, probably all of you.
September 4, 2006 at 3:37 pm
Zealot , Wow … The same thing happened to me.
That’s why I posted it.
My Dad passed away unexpectedly about 15 years ago. I couldn’t accept it and it hurt like hell.
My Dad was a good man. I believe he is in Heaven ,too. I realized that if I was ever to be able to see him again, I better make sure I get there and help anyone else I meet along the way.
Getting there is like running a marathon. You have good stretches and bad. You get winded and fall. But then you get up and get back in the race.
In this marathon, you also have to help your fellow runners finish. Its like the Ranger credo “Never leave a man behind”. and don’t forget “Rangers lead the way!”
Two movies that gave me alot of comfort and that I highly recommend are “Field of Dreams ”
and “Frequency”. If you havent seen them go out and get them. You’ll thank me for it.
ps I had a feeling that you were a fireman.
September 4, 2006 at 7:26 pm
Hope all are having (or had) a nice Labor Day holiday. “Curious;” what a piece of work. As my mom used to say, “Empty vessels make the most noise.” We can only hope he fills himself with The Holy Spirit and God’s love. Soon…
Zealot: I don’t mean to rub a sore spot, but wish to add my “two-cents-worth.” I went through two horrible divorces with the same woman (recycle plastic, aluminum, etc, not spouses!). Why? I thought my daughter should be raised by her mother and I tried to make it work. Divorce: not as bad as the death of the spouse you love, but almost as bad as you see them wandering down a path you know they shouldn’t be on. Where am I going with this? After “crawling into a beer can” for a little while (Yes, I made sure my daughter was seen to and did not let the beer interfere with her care) I asked God for a good woman. He answered and we’ve been married for 14 years. Paula’s views of the world, politics, and life in general are in sync with mine. Once you are ready just ask God for what you need. He doesn’t always send you what (you think) you want.
Is it just me or is any one else waiting for the “Operation Barbarosa” moment in Venezuela? Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t Venezuela a Catholic country? Aren’t the Catholics right up at the top (or bottom) of the muslim $#!* list? Odd that the Islamic Republic of Iran would throw in with the likes of Chavez and his crusader regime. Or have I missed that he converted to Islam?
I guess Chaves didn’t learn ANYTHING in history class. If Iranian Pres Ahm-ah-nut-job claims the holocost didn’t happen and who knows what else he dodesn’t recognize as fact in WW II history, then does Chavez think that Hitler had a “misunderstanding” with Joseph Stalin/Benito Mussolini/Hideki Tojo? Hitler and his followers, as the muslims, saw themselves eventually achieving world domination. Is Chavez so naive that he thinks that the islamic extremists won’t come after him in South America when all the other “infidels” are wiped out?
And what about Kim Jong (mentally) Ill in North Korea? Does he think that the extremists will really be happy with just Indochina?
Is something going to happen soon? I can’t say. My magic eight ball, ouiji board, tarot cards, and goat entrails don’t agree ; )
In regards to our observations of the folks that quote the liberal media. A good friend of mine calls such folk “sheeple.” I drift between that term and simply referring to them as “ostriches.”
Since we’re tipping our hands a little, I’m in the USAF Reserves and away from home for a while (state-side, fortunately) and this forum has helped with not being able to sit and solve the problems of the world over a glass of wine with Paula of an evening.
So, God Bless all of us and may we stay ever vigilant. Thanks Big Jake for your excellent info, Eagle, the same, Zealot, for the chance to let you see that you are not alone, American Woman and Red Dawn, for proving there are some women that care more for their families than what most mysoginistic twerps may think.
Kaplah!
September 4, 2006 at 9:09 pm
296 Big Jake, as always I appreciate you. Sorry about your Dad. I think I saw Field of Dreams a long time ago. It’s about the baseball field, right? I’ll watch it again and maybe I’ll see it in a different way. And what tipped you off that I’m a fireman? I must be a pretty easy guy to figure out.
297 DJ. Thanks for the advice. I did date a girl for a while about a year after my wife died. I thought my son needed a mother because I was pretty much going nuts trying to take care of him by myself. In the beginning all he wanted was his mother anyway so it was a pretty tuff time at first. I almost married this girl, but I knew it was more out of lonliness than anything else. Nice girl, but when it came right down do it, it didn’t feel right and I was still thinking about my wife all the time. She knew it but she thought she could make me forget her. Didn’t happen. She still calls me from time to time and shows up at my house once in a while. I work with a lot of guys who have great wives, and a lot of guys who really hate to go home nights. Some are divorced and I know I wouldn’t want to go through what they have gone through. Some of these wives really go for the juggler. I don’t think Caroline and I ever would’ve split up. We were married 5 years, but we were together about 3 years before that and we were happy. She knew me better than I knew me and she always kept me calmed down and relaxed. I used to be a real hot head. Worse than you might think I am now. But, I think now I am going to start reading the bible. I tried to pray a little bit, but it felt funny. Like I was talking to myself. I told my sister about asking Jesus into my heart. She said she thought that was nice but not to get weird on the family. I do have a good buddy that’s a christian. I’ll see him tomorrow and I’ll tell him. Like you, I like being on this web site and being able to talk things out. It wouldn’t be smart for me to reveal my “tender” side at the firehouse That could get rough. And as far as curious goes, I would love to get my hands on him and slap the shit out of him before I get into the bible too much and can’t do it.
Thanks guys. I’ll get back to more of what this website is all about after I catch up on everything.
Thanks, and God Bless all of you.
September 4, 2006 at 9:15 pm
Quay, check out The Gypsy Scholar’s website. He has given you a nice compliment.
http://gypsyscholarship.blogspot.com/2006/07/abu-bakr-najis-management-of-savagery_18.html
Zealot, I certainly don’t compare my knowledge with that of others in this exchange. They know far more about the bible and the Quran than I. I watch a lot of news (mainly FOX, CNN, and BBC to get coverage on all sides)and I read internet news pages like some read magazines. I like to try to keep informed about what’s going on in the regions my husband may find himself in. He always tells me to take any reporting by the media with a huge grain of salt because 9 times out of 10 they get the details wrong or glorify the picture in their rush to report first.
Like Big Jake, I am not surprised to hear that you are a Fireman. Thank you for your service! You all don’t get paid enough for what you do day in and day out. What do you and your fellow firefighters think about this movement saying 9-11 was a hoax perpetuated by Bush? There are college professors at quite a few universities saying that there were no Moslem hijcakers on those jets on 9-11 and that the Towers were brought down because they were wired for explosives to ignite on impact. The images of that day that I will never forget are of people jumping to their deaths from 100+ floors high and the firefighters, police, and EMT’s going into the towers as they burned. We were stationed in Germany at the time. My husband was stateside attending a military conference. I wanted him to take a ship back to Germany!
Big Jake, thanks for the reprint on the big 10 … needed that.
DJ – glad you found Paula! There are lots of great women out there just like there are lots of great men. Sometimes, you’ve gotta kiss a couple toads before you find the real thing. I was lucky and continue to remain lucky in that my husband has returned a-okay from three missions in Afghanistan. I do understand wanting to find someone to help raise the kids, but having been the product of divorced parents at the age of 19, it’s hard to find a spouse who will love another person’s kids like their own. I’m glad Paula can. Hang on to her. Your kids will appreciate it!
September 4, 2006 at 9:34 pm
Zealot, saw you posted about the same time I did. You’ll know the real thing when it comes into your life. It’ll probably come out of the clear blue and it may take you a little while to realize it! Curious got under my skin, too. He’s probably still monitoring this site and that will make him very happy being the true jerk he is. I’d like to call him every name in the book and I know some good ones! He is a person filled with such hate and contempt … is it any wonder why women are mean to him? Anyway, it meant a lot to hear the good guys on this post come to defense of me, Red Dawn, and Viber. Thanks, guys!
Big Jake, I lost my mom a little over a year ago. We only had one fight in our entire mother-daughter years together. I miss her … especially now with things so uncertain on Earth. I thank God for my husband and know I have to be strong for my kids. I’m sorry for the loss of your dad! My older brother died of a massive, sudden and completely unexpected heart attack at the age of 44. We were very close and I was actually flying out to OK to see him, his family, and my mom but he died three days before I got there. I know there is a heaven because I experienced a phenomenon about 2 weeks after he died. Some would say I’m nuts, but I know what happened and I don’t care what anyone thinks. I had a similar experience when my mother-in-law and mom died within a month of one another.
Talk to you soon!
September 5, 2006 at 1:48 am
Americanwoman, would you be willing to share your phenomenon? If it’s too personal, I understand. I’d like to hear about it. I won’t think you’re nuts. I know nuts, and you’re not it.
None of the firefighters I know would take too kindly to having anyone say that 9-11 was a hoax. I wouldn’t even want to hear anyone saying that. I don’t think any of the Professors in NY are teaching that. We’d all probably run them out of town if they were. I think it’s insulting to everyone that lost anyone in that tragedy and Bush didn’t perpetuate that any more than I did. To me, teaching something like that is an act of treason and anyone teaching it should be prosecuted and stripped of their credentials. They’re obviously idiots and shouldn’t be anywhere near an educational institution. If they really are teaching that, I don’t know how they’re getting away with it. I don’t know how American people would LET them get away with it. 9-11 sure woke me up. My wife died in 1999, so that was still pretty new. My son was staying at my Mom’s for a few days because all of us were called out, and I remember when I finally got to her house, he just came running out the door and jumped up to me. I just hugged him and cried for the longest time. That was the first time I really cried. I couldn’t put him down. I’ll never forget it. All he said was I’m glad you’re home Daddy. H’ed just wipe the tears off my face and hug me back. I had been so depressed for so long, and after that, I was so glad I still had my son and that I was alive. I realized how much I love America and my fellow Americans. And how much I’d fight to protect what I have and love. You said, thank you for my service. Well, my hat’s off to your husband and every American soldier. I look up to all of them. I’m sorry about your Mom and your brother, too. Those sudden deaths are something else. No one can understand it until they go through it.
It’s getting late and I need some sleep.
God Bless America
September 5, 2006 at 4:32 am
#297 DJ-Welcome back- Paula sounds like your ideal soulmate . I’m happy for both of you.
Regarding Iran and Chavez – Geo-politics makes strange bed-fellows. Chavez will align himself with anyone who opposes the U.S. and the Bush administration. In the 1800’s at the height of British Power and influence , it was common for lesser powers to “tweak the Lion’s tail”. As this is the “American Century” so to speak ,I
guess Chavez and his ilk get their jollies by plucking the Eagle’s feather.
#298 Zealot -you wrote:
“Big Jake, as always I appreciate you. Sorry about your Dad. I think I saw Field of Dreams a long time ago. It’s about the baseball field, right? I’ll watch it again and maybe I’ll see it in a different way. And what tipped you off that I’m a fireman? I must be a pretty easy guy to figure out”.
When you watch “Field of Dreams” remember what I posted in #296
“Getting there is like running a marathon. You have good stretches and bad. You get winded and fall. But then you get up and get back in the race.
In this marathon, you also have to help your fellow runners finish”.
This Marathon is akin to a pilgrimage.
“Field of Dreams” is really about a Pilgrimage.
Life is a pilgrimage ,a journey hopefully to a better place.
As you may recall, Ray Kinsella hears a voice that tells him to build a baseball field in his cornfield in Iowa. He goes on a mystical cross-country journey (a pilgrimage) for reasons unknown to him at the time. He discovers those reasons at various points in his journey. He finds that while helping others ,he is ultimately helping himself.
You asked how I knew you were a fireman. I didn’t know. My post #292
“By the way, if I was ever in a fight ,I’d be lucky to have someone like you backing me up.
Courage and honor ,Spirit and Guts”.
I sensed it from your posts. When you see “Frequency” you will know what I’m talking about . You remind me of the character Frank Sullivan ,a Fireman deeply in love with his wife and his son. Keep the phrase “Spirit and Guts ” in mind while you watch the movie.
By the way , are you a Met fan?
Zealot, I started my pilgrimage 15 years ago.
You are asking the same questions ,looking for the same answers (POST #301) that I am looking for. The journey you are on will bring you the peace you desire and deserve.
September 5, 2006 at 11:41 am
I know this blog is about Iran and terrorism.
It may seem that I have gone off topic alot lately ,but I really haven’t.
Islamo-fascists hate everything American. Our Freedom, our way of life.
I want to remind everybody not to take anything for granted and to celebrate each day, those freedoms we so cherish.
September 5, 2006 at 12:23 pm
Re: Big Jake #302. I check in on the site almost daily. I simply don’t post when one of our fellow posters says something very eloquently. It’s hard to improve on perfection. I appreciate “spending time” with folks of similar “cloth.”
God Bless
September 5, 2006 at 6:13 pm
Big Jake #302 – Let’s see Chavez is best buds with Fidel and now Amahdinejad. What’s not to love? (Sorry, couldn’t resist a bit of humor.)
Zealot – I was in OK for two weeks following my brother’s death. My mom was completely devastated. When I came back east, my husband picked me up at the airport and immediately headed out for some training in Canada. Until my husband went to Afghanistan, I was a total chicken to stay alone at night and I never slept much. I used to check the locks on the windows and doors twice before going to bed. I’d jam a chair under the door knob on a couple doors – probably not too smart from a fire standpoint. Anyway, the first night back home after my brother’s death, I got the little ones to bed early so I could get everything ready for work the next day. I went through my nightly routine of checking locks and went to bed. As I lay there just thinking about how much I was going to miss talking to my brother and wondering how the family would go on without him, I closed my eyes and a couple seconds later, I felt someone sit on the bed at my knees. My split second thought was of terror thinking somehow someone had gotten in. Then I felt a gentle hand on my knee and I had the most incredible sense of peace. I knew it was my brother. I didn’t want to open my eyes because I didn’t want to see that he wouldn’t be there. He communicated to me via unspoken thought that everything would be okay, we’d see each other again, and he wanted me to go on and be happy. Then the bed lifted and I had a peaceful night’s sleep. It wasn’t easy sailing as far as missing him goes after that, but it did give me a firm faith that there is a heaven. My mother-in-law lives in NH and she passed away unexpectedly one month before my mom. I was out in OK with my youngest child helping to care for my mom in the end stages of brain cancer when my mother-in-law died. A couple of nights after my mom died, I was following my daughter and nephew in the yard while they played and I saw a white piece of paper in a planter I had cleaned out about a week earlier. I didn’t think much of it and figured one of the kids put it there. I walked by it without picking it up. They circled the planter again. Something told me to pick the paper up. I did and when I turned it over I saw it was a business card for a car dealer rep in Concord, NH (down the street from where my mother-in-law) lived. It had a picture of a Dodge Magnum on it. The last time my mom had been in NH was in 1985 when I married my husband. We haven’t lived there since 1986. My mother-in-law quit driving years ago, so she wouldn’t have needed that card. So how did a relatively new business card from this NH car dealer end up in a planter in Lawton, OK? My husband hadn’t arrived yet and my brother who was there is from TX. I think my mother-in-law left it so I’d know they’d both made it to heaven and were happy. I had told her about the experience I had with my brother and we promised we’d try to leave a sign for one another if we passed away. It’s weird but I am a firm believer.
Good news on the oil front today … looks like they found a big producer in the Gulf. I still think we need to start looking for decent alternative fuels so we can tell the Arabs, Chavez, and anyone else wanting to see us fail to pound sand.
September 5, 2006 at 10:30 pm
#302 Big Jake, yeah, I like the Mets. They’re doing really good this year. Maybe they’ll finally get to the series. I think they’re selling play off tickets now.
Later….just got some company
September 5, 2006 at 11:18 pm
Zealot, there’s some teacher at the University of Vermont and then some professor in the midwest who are openly teaching their students that 9-11 was a hoax. At first I just dismissed them, but then I noticed they started to gain more coverage (Fox News morning interviewed the guy in the midwest and I think Brian, Steve, and ED wanted to shoot him). I did a little research on the net and found a site on Wikipedia that outlines their argument. Wikipedia does a pretty good job of remaining neutral, but it concerns me that they’d even have the stuff on their site because by doing so, it gives the idea some credibility. I completely agree with you that it is utterly disprectful for any of the victims, their families, and I’ll go so far to say anyone who was in the vicinity of the crashes that day to make such statements. My kids will never go to the colleges and universities who have teachers like that on staff. My list of good colleges gets smaller by the day. I took Columbia University off the list when that jerk Nicholas DeGenoa openly said he hoped American troops would suffer 1000 deaths in Iraq (at the start of the war). I don’t know what made me angrier, that an American would actually say something like that or that the students present in the audience would actually clap the way they did. I wonder what our professors who are against fighting terrorists think of Ahmadinejad’s statement today that they need to purge secular/liberals from the university system in Iran. I’d be willing to bet that if DeGenoa had said he hoped Iranian troops suffered 1000 deaths with a fight against America, that he wouldn’t wake up the next morning. Where is the balance in our college system?
Well, can’t wait for the opening NFL games this weekend! Go ‘Skins! (I like the Patriots, too.)
September 6, 2006 at 2:14 am
6/16/2005 Clip No. 718
Coptic Priest Zakariya Boutrus on the Spreading of Islam
The following are excerpts from an discussion with Coptic Priest Zakariya Boutrus, which aired on Al-Hayat TV on June 16, 2005
Boutrus: Islam, as portrayed in the encyclopedia of Islam, in the Koran and the Hadith, was spread by means of the sword.
“The sword played a major role in spreading Islam in the past, and it is the sword that preserves Islam today. Islam relies upon Jihad in spreading the religion.” This is very clear in the encyclopedia. This appears in section 11, page. 3,245. It says: “Spreading Islam by means of the sword is a duty incumbent upon all Muslims.” Thus, Islam is spread by means of the sword.
Another thing is the punishment for apostate. “The punishment of killing any Muslim who abandons Islam is one of the most important factors terrifying all Muslim. He does not dare question the truth of Islam, so that his thoughts will not lead him to abandon Islam. In such a case, he would receive the punishment for apostasy: He would lose his life, and his property and wives would permitted for all.”
This reminds me of a true story that I heard about the preachers who spread Islam in Africa. They reached a certain place in order to spread Islam, and they asked one of the locals: “Do you prefer to worship one god and have four wives, or to worship three gods and have one wife? We, of course, don’t worship three gods, but that’s what they said.
The African said “I like four women, and I don’t care which god. I want four women.” So they told him to say the shahada, and he did.
Then they told him he had to be circumcised in order to become a Muslim. He asked: “Do I really have to? I am a grown man.” They answered: “Yes, you have to, in order to get the monthly stipend, and you can marry four wives.”
The man agreed, and underwent the pains of circumcision despite his advanced age. They began to pay him the monthly stipend, and after a few months they cancelled the stipend. The man went and asked: “Where’s the money?” They told him: “Now you are deep in Islam, you don’t need the monthly stipend any more.”
He threatened: “I will abandon Islam.” They said: “If you leave Islam, we will carry out the apostasy punishment on you.” He asked what the it was, and they said: “We will chop off your head, and cut you into pieces. ” This African man began to mumble: “What a strange religion: when you go in they cut off a little piece of you, and when you go out, they cut you into little pieces.”
This is the punishment for apostasy that keeps people afraid. Even when they reach the truth, they’re afraid to express their opinion.
There are other factors, such as upbringing from a young age. Children are brainwashed that Islam is the truth, that Mohammad is the last prophet, that the Christians are infidels and that the Jews are infidels. They repeat it constantly. Since early childhood, he cannot think properly, because a certain way of thinking is forced on him.
In addition, the religion of Islam satisfies the human urges, just like our (African) friend who said he preferred four wives. “Two, three, four, or however many you can.” It satisfies the sexual urges and man’s desire for ownership. It goes hand in hand with human nature. It does not exalt human nature, but reduces itself to the level of human nature.
September 6, 2006 at 2:20 am
3/2/2005 Clip No. 623
Former Dean of Islamic Law at Qatar University ‘Abd Al-Hamid Al-Ansari: The Arab Intellectuals are More Oppressive Than the Governments
Former dean of Islamic law at Qatar University ‘Abd Al-Hamid Al-Ansari, was interviewed by Bahrain TV on March 2, 2005. The following are excerpts:
‘Abd Al-Hamid Al Ansari: Our satellite channels deserve the name “media of terrorism.” They spread among the youth ideas that might not be considered outright terrorism but spread extremism. Such extremism is the beginning of violence and fanaticism, and violence leads to terrorism. Fanaticism – extremism -violence – terrorism.
When you host key figures [on TV] – either religious personalities or extremist personalities of a specific ideology… Anyone who disagrees with them is considered a traitor or a collaborator. When one guest is a nationalist, the other is a traitor and collaborator. When one guest is a religious figure, the other is considered deviant, with false beliefs. Such a guest pours his wrath out on the West and on Western culture. He starts by saying: “Look what they are doing to the Muslims,” “The materialistic West,” “The permissive West,” “The US is the enemy of Islam and the Muslims.”
What do such expressions instill in the souls of the youth if not hatred? At the same time, he depicts the past as glamorous and glorious – “The beautiful Caliphate,” and so on. When a young man listens to such depictions and compares them to his own situation, with its many tragedies… Who does he blame? He blames others, not himself. He doesn’t assume responsibility for the situation.
Oppression of intellectuals by intellectuals is worse than oppression by governments. I’m afraid of intellectuals like myself, who push me to the sidelines and call me a traitor and an infidel, more than I’m afraid of the governments. Today the governments give room for freedom, and they are the ones that protect us now.
The civil society organizations, which are supposed to protect liberties and democracy, are the ones that oppress the intellectuals and accuse them of treason and of being at odds with them.
Look what the Jordanian unions are doing. They applaud Saddam and still feel sorrow for the fallen regime. The Arab Lawyers Association has compiled a team to defend Saddam, and they haven’t said a word about the mass graves.
After 50 years of enlightenment, education, and modernization, along comes someone like Bin Laden, like Saddam, like Al-Zawahiri, like [Sleiman] Abu Al-Gheith, someone like Al-Zarqawi… We need to act as Germany upon its defeat.
The German elite reexamined its culture and found that the entire German culture is full of poison. Its sources are full of poison.
September 6, 2006 at 2:28 am
8/27/2004 Clip No. 226
Friday Sermon on Qatar TV: With Some Women, Life is Impossible Unless You Carry a Rod
The following are excerpts from a Friday sermon aired live on Qatar TV on August 27:
We must know that [wife] beating is a punishment in Islamic religious law. No one should deny this because this was permitted by the Creator of Man, and because when you purchase an electric appliance or a car you get instructions – a catalogue, explaining how to use it. The Creator of Man has sent down this book [the Koran] in order to show Man which ways he must choose.
We shouldn’t be ashamed before the nations of the world who are still in their days of ignorance, to admit that these [beatings] are part of our religious law. We must remind the ignorant from among the Islamic Nation who followed the [West], that those [westerners] acknowledge the wondrous nature of this verse. There are three types of women with whom life is impossible without beatings.
In America six million women are beaten by their husbands every year. These are their own official statistics. 4000-6000 women die as a result of their husbands’ beatings. London police, every year, answer 100,000 phone calls and complaints of attacks against wives. In France, their slogan is, “Beat the wife morning, noon and night, and don’t ask her why – she knows the reason.” But they use their media to blow this out of proportion. They blow what is happening in the Muslim countries out of proportion. They bring a woman from South-Eastern Asia with a swollen face and present her on TV, claiming this was done by a Muslim who attacked his wife. They forget that Islam is a religion that forbids beating the face even of beasts. It is forbidden to beat even a donkey on its face.
The intelligent people in the [West] admit that a woman does not feel comfort and is not happy unless she’s under a man who commands, forbids, controls, and leads. This is the nature of people according to Allah’s creation. Allah has created woman, whether Muslim or infidel, so she is happy under a strong man who will protect her and lives with her. It is not surprising, then, that a French woman came before a judge in the land of false freedom and equality and said: “I don’t want this husband.” The judge asked her: “Why?” and she replied: “He didn’t lead me, didn’t oppress me, didn’t castigate me, didn’t talk to me violently, didn’t say: Don’t do this, do that.” The judge replied: “Don’t [his actions] support those who call for equality between man and woman?” The infidel woman answered, “No, no, I don’t want him to compete with me, I want a man who leads and rules me.”
This is the nature according to which Allah created people, but they contaminated and replaced it with licentiousness and evil. A woman there knows that she lost the battle, and was mislead in the worst way, and she became like gum that the husband chews and throws into the filthy garbage can.
[The Koran says:] “and beat them.” This verse is of a wondrous nature. There are three types of women with whom a man cannot live unless he carries a rod on his shoulder. The first type is a girl who was brought up this way. Her parents ask her to go to school and she doesn’t – they beat her. “Eat” – “I don’t want to” – they beat her. So she became accustomed to beatings, she was brought up that way. We pray Allah will help her husband later. He will only get along with her if he practices wife beating.
The second type is a woman who is condescending towards her husband and ignores him. With her, too, only a rod will help. The third type is a twisted woman who will not obey her husband unless he oppresses her, beats her, uses force against her, and overpowers her with his voice.
September 6, 2006 at 2:39 am
God Bless America! Mom ,Apple Pie,Freedom of Religion,Freedom of Speech ,Women Lib,Civil Rights ,Afirmative Action , and on and on and on, Sure we have our problems . We DON’T agree on everything , but we try to work toward the common good. We vote ,we debate ,we discuss,
we change ,hopefully for the better.
September 6, 2006 at 10:35 am
“WE will never forget! (And that’s a whole lot of bunches of WE!)”
By: Ed Evans
I sat in a movie theater watching “Schindler’s List,” asked myself, “why didn’t the Jews fight back?” Now I know why.
I sat in a movie theater, watching “Pearl Harbor” and asked myself, “Why weren’t we prepared?” Now I know why.
Civilized people cannot fathom, much less predict, the actions of evil people.
On September 11, dozens of capable airplane passengers allowed themselves to be overpowered by a handful of poorly armed terrorists because they did not comprehend the depth of hatred that motivated their captors.
On September 11, thousands of innocent people were murdered because too many Americans naively reject the reality that some nations are dedicated to the dominance of others. Many political pundits, pacifists and media personnel want us to forget the carnage. They say we must focus on the bravery of the rescuers and ignore the cowardice of the killers. They implore us to understand the motivation of the perpetrators.
Major television stations have announced they will assist the healing process by not replaying devastating footage of the planes crashing into the Twin Towers.
I will not be manipulated.
I will not pretend to understand.
I will not forget.
I will not forget the liberal media who abused freedom of the press to kick our country when it was vulnerable and hurting.
I will not forget that CBS anchor Dan Rather preceded President Bush’s address to the nation with the snide remark, “No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president.”
I will not forget that ABC TV anchor Peter Jennings questioned President Bush’s motives for not returning immediately to Washington, DC and commented, “We’re all pretty skeptical and cynical about Washington.”
And I will not forget that ABC’s Mark Halperin warned if reporters weren’t informed of every little detail of this war, they aren’t “likely — nor should they be expected — to show deference.”
I will not isolate myself from my fellow Americans by pretending an attack on the USS Cole in Yemen was not an attack on the United States of America.
I will not forget the Clinton administration equipped Islamic terrorists and their supporters with the world’s most sophisticated telecommunications equipment and encryption technology, thereby compromising America’s ability to trace terrorist radio, cell phone, land lines, faxes and modem communications.
I will not be appeased with pointless, quick retaliatory strikes like those perfected by the previous administration.
I will not be comforted by “feel-good, do nothing” regulations like the silly “Have your bags been under your control?” question at the airport. {This Q has been withdrawn.}
I will not be influenced by so called,”antiwar demonstrators” who exploit the right of expression to chant anti-American obscenities.
I will not forget the moral victory handed the North Vietnamese by American war protesters who reviled and spat upon the returning soldiers, airmen, sailors and Marines.
I will not be softened by the wishful thinking of pacifists who chose reassurance over reality. I will embrace the wise words of Prime Minister Tony Blair who told Labor Party conference, “They have no moral inhibition on the slaughter of the innocent. If they could have murdered not 7,000 but 70,000, does anyone doubt they would have done so and rejoiced in it?
There is no compromise possible with such people, no meeting of minds, no point of understanding with such terror. Just a choice: defeat it or be defeated by it. And defeat it we must!”
I will force myself to:
- hear the weeping
- feel the helplessness
- imagine the terror
- sense the panic
- smell the burning flesh
- experience the loss
- remember the hatred.
I sat in a movie theater, watching “Private Ryan” and asked myself, “Where did they find the courage?”
Now I know.
We have no choice. Living without liberty is not living.
– Ed Evans, MGySgt., USMC (Ret.)
Not as lean, Not as mean, But still a Marine.
(Keep this going until every living American has read it and memorized it so we don’t make the same mistake again.)
September 6, 2006 at 10:40 am
SEMPER FI, Ed. SEMPER FI!
September 6, 2006 at 10:56 am
Big Jake Wow. Had a good buddy over last night and we talked for hours. He’s a christian and answered a lot of my questions. He showed me verses in the bible. He told me the bible was several books combined into one book and they’re all in sync. He called the bible God’s love letter to humanity and an instruction book on living successfully. We’re going to get together again so we can talk some more.
After reading all of your last posts, I don’t know how anyone unless you were brainwashed would want anything to do with Islam. It sounds like they turn you into a prisoner. They take away your ability to think for yourself. It’s nothing like christianity at all.
They don’t have any respect for women, that’s for sure. I wouldn’t want ownership of a women. How is that fulfilling? I want her to want to be with me on her own. That’s the real high. I don’t want to have to beat her into submission. My wife did all kinds of things for me, but she did it because she loved me. I did things for her, too. What man in their right mind would enjoy beating the woman you love? The mother of your kids. How could you even make love to her after that? I would think she’d hate your guts. I believe women like strong men that they know will protect and provide for the family, but I think they want a man they can look up to and feel safe with. Not some jerk that hits them to keep them in line. I think if you love her and treat her right, she’ll just automatically take care of you back. I would think that the goal would be to have peace and harmony in the home so you can enjoy each other. I used to look forward to coming home. The house was always nice, she always fixed good food, she’d kiss me as soon as I walked threw the door. I don’t get this Islamic way of living. Doesn’t sound appealing to me at all.
By the way, you asked me if I like the Mets. Do you? I’m thinking it could quite possibly be a Mets and Yankees series this year. Who will you be rooting for if it is?
Americanwomen, thanks for sharing your encounters. I don’t know what to think of that, but I’ll say you’re pretty gutsy. Supernatural things like that give me the creeps.
September 6, 2006 at 11:39 am
Zealot, I agree that men shouldn’t hit women. However, some women aren’t sweet, loving, sex kittens. Some are whiney, nasty, lazy, selfish, bitches that are never happy no matter what you do and they will come after you. I know. I had a women that used to bitch, scratch and dig me everytime she had a bug up her ass. I told her several times to knock it off. She only quit when I finally had enough and laid her out.
Yes, we’re divorced. Thank God. Islam is the only religion when you have a shrew like that in the house.
September 6, 2006 at 8:20 pm
Niceguy, I know what you mean. But, didn’t you have signs before you married this girl that she was like that? I mean, it just seems that you would have some indication how she reacts to things before you make a commitment. I posted earlier that I dated a girl for awhile after my wife died and it didn’t work out. Let me just say first, that she’s a really nice girl. She just was insecure and wanted me to stop doing things that I enjoyed doing. She was always putting me through a drill if I didn’t call her on time, or if I stopped someplace on the way home. I knew I couldn’t handle that forever. Anyway, I know what you mean. I was just lucky.
Big Jake, have to be honest with you. I’m not really in to baseball. I like the series, mostly because I get into pools, but I like football. And my team is the Buffalo Bills. I know, I know, say what you want. I’m orginally from a little town south of Buffalo right on the PA border. Someday the Bills will win that Super Bowl and you’ll hear me hollering where ever you are.
September 6, 2006 at 8:37 pm
“Had a good buddy over last night and we talked for hours.”
How beautiful these words are; how precious such a time.
ref. Zealot Says: #314
September 6, 2006 at 9:27 pm
Zealot – the Bills have come close to taking the SB. Maybe this will be their year! I’ve been a skins fan since living in the DC area in high school. I actually met Mike Thomas and had a coca-cola with him and a few other people the year or two after he took “Rookie of the Year.” It was so exciting! My dad is career Army and we were stationed in Carlisle, PA where the skins had summer training. I talked a friend into going to watch them practice. Long story short, Mike and a couple of guys invited us out to a local pizza place for a soda. They were complete gentlemen. My friend and I were high school seniors, and I know it’s hard for some on this site to believe, but Mike and his buddies weren’t in to using young girls. We had a coke, talked football, family, and high school and went our separate ways. The skins have had good times and bad. This year isn’t looking too hot so far, but hey, there’s always hope! My dad is from Erie, PA. I hope you aren’t near that creep who shot the state troopers!
Niceguy – I know there are people who live to make life for others a miserable ride. From a woman’s standpoint, I just can’t imagine a guy hitting me and I don’t think I’d ever be able to get over it. I know women harp on communication and negotioation but I think they are key to any successful relationship. Some people (women and men) want it their way or no way. I couldn’t live like that. I think you have to find someone who you have enough in common with and where there’s enough love for the other person that each person is willing to compromise and forgive the other person’s faults. It’s not always an easy ride. I just wish the genders would stop looking at each other as something to be dominated. This is the naive part of my personality showing … but men and women are different (thank heavens!). I worked in a well-paid career for 18 years. I had to hang with the tough guys without being manly. I don’t wanna be a guy. I want a strong guy (and have one) to take care of me and the kids but I want to be respected for what I bring to the family. I love to do the decorating, cooking, and housekeeping stuff and I love yard work, too. That doesn’t mean there aren’t days when I feel fed up and want my husband to say, “what do you want me to order for take out, babe?” It’s not easy being at home with the kids all day. I know it’s not easy being at work all day, too. That’s the thing … both people need to stop comparing, compromise a little, and be thankful for the person they’re with who help tough life out.
Big Jake, as always, more knowledge and on point with you. I talked to a couple of my women friends today and discussed your discourse on the Quran. It scared them but I noticed the subject was quickly changed. Women want to pretend we won’t see our freedoms erased … yeah, I guess we’ll expect our guys to put their lives on the line for us. I’m not gonna let it drop.
September 6, 2006 at 10:10 pm
Americanwoman, actually, I am near that creep. I told you I’m a NYorker. I was born and raised in a little NY town south of Buffalo. I live in Pa in a bordertown right on the state line, about 90 miles south of Buffalo. I love Buffalo and go there a lot. And I’m not too far from Erie. I go to Bemus Point occassionally. Anyway, there are roadblocks all over the place. Troopers at all the checkpoints have rifles and they have their guns drawn when they check the vehickles. I hope they catch the guy. It’s a shame how he took the life of a decent man.
September 6, 2006 at 11:21 pm
I read that having the kids going back to school this week has really complicated the search. I can see a guy like that take some little kid hostage. Does NY have the death penalty? I hope so. I feel so badly for Trooper Longobardo and his family. The guy was only 32! It sounds like the trooper who was shot in the back has a long road to recovery ahead of him. Let’s hope the good guys win on this one.
September 7, 2006 at 4:10 am
ZEALOT ,I’ve always been a Met fan . Grew up in
September 7, 2006 at 4:23 am
Sorry about that ,folks. Like I was saying ,I grew up in Queens . The 1969 World Series ,Ron Swoboda’s amazing catch. How could I not be a Met fan?
I asked you if you were a Met fan in Post #302 in reference to the movie “Frequency” . (You really have to see it). Frank Sullivan and his son are die hard Met fans in 1969.
As far as football goes , sorry , my allegience is Jets ,Giants a very distant 2nd .
September 7, 2006 at 5:00 am
post #304 DJ, Thanks for the compliment . I was just speaking from the heart.You guys and gals are like family to me.
Post #315 niceguy I don’t believe you condone hitting women. The situation you were in became unbearable. You reacted on a bad day to an unseemly provocation.
My guess is that you are not proud of the outcome. In fact,I venture to say that you are ashamed of losing control of yourself and you are throwing it out for discussion because it bothers you that it came to that.
If you really felt that it was ok to hit a woman if she “asks for it” then it would be an everyday occurrence for you and you would have a problem .
By being man enough to realize you were in a bad situation you did the mature thing and ended it. The selfish and immature solution would be to perpetuate the problem by staying in the marriage not seeking counseling, and knocking each other silly for the rest of your lives.
September 7, 2006 at 7:38 am
Big Jake, like I said before, you’re a smart guy. Please explain to me what you think post 317 is trying to tell me. We’re good buddies. JUST good buddies. That’s it. The beautiful and precious time thing? I hope the guy means well because it sounds queer to me. I’m definitely not queer. And let’s please everyone, not start a debate on this issue because, well, just because.
Lke the Jets, Like the Giants, Love the Bills, with the Steelers being a close 2nd. (If Norwood would’ve made that field goal in the first SB the Bills were in, the Giants wouldn’t have won…what a game. I was ticked!!)
For some reason I can’t sleep tonight. Went back and re-read a lot of the comments and your 312 post I read several times. I printed it off so I will always have it. With 9-11 just a few days away we should honor and never forget what our country went through that day. Our country has the greatest military in the world, but what our enemies seem to forget is that there are millions of us, without uniforms, right here, that are ready to fight and protect our way of life. Everytime I see re-plays of the towers getting hit, I get a fury inside me that only a true American can feel. I know I will NEVER FORGET. And that nut in Iran is messing with the wrong people. Time will tell.
Good night. I’m going to see if I can rent Frequency this weekend.
September 7, 2006 at 10:16 am
P.S. Big Jake, don’t remember Ron Swoboda’s catch you were talking about. I was born that year.
September 7, 2006 at 12:17 pm
Zealot re post #317 I took it at face value. I think you are reading too much into it. You must have had a rough day! Your reaction gave me a chuckle.
It brought back memories of my first summertime job at Kodak. I had a summer job sorting film orders ,packing and loading trucks while I was in high school. As I was the new kid , the loading dock crew decided to have some fun with me. They got together and made like they were all gay and if I was going to work there I had to go through some kind of “initiation”. OMG! What were they going to do with me,to me? HELP!! Boy did they have a laugh at my reaction . I was so jumpy ,I knocked over a few cartons of film. When I finally realized they were all in on it and were pulling my leg, I couldn’t stop laughing out of relief along
with them. It was one of the best summers of my life. Moral of the story? ,chill out!
Seriously though , I have to thank you forhelping me get back in the race.
“Getting there is like running a marathon. You have good stretches and bad. You get winded and fall. But then you get up and get back in the race.
In this marathon, you also have to help your fellow runners finish”.
I have been reflecting more on the important things and renewing my relationship with God . Funny though ,He is always there for us. It is like when a little kid trys to assert his independence from his parent . He tries to go it alone for a while and finds that he needs that parental reassurance to go on. Thanks for helping me get back on track . I’ve been talking more with the “Big Guy” and it feels great.
By the way, I’m not so smart, I’m just older than you . I’ve had a little more to deal with.
I was born in 1954, married to the same beautiful woman for 27 years ,4 great kids and a bunch of challenges I won’t get into right now.
I’m glad you are going to rent “Frequency”. I’d love to discuss it with you. And don’t forget “Field of Dreams”.
I am going to throw this one out there- “Quantum Physics”.
If you don’t know what it is ,look it up on the net. Both these movies deal with it. Man has been groping around with it for all of recorded history. The big “What if?”
September 7, 2006 at 7:34 pm
Guys, I feel really weird being the only woman here lately. I wish Viber and Red Dawn would check back in … for that matter, I’d like to hear from Vera. I wish Eagle would also come back in, because like Big Jake, Zealot, and DJ (I apologize to those not listed), it’s really nice to hear from Americans who cherish what we have.
Zealot – I have to say that I did do a double take on Richard’s response to you. (Although I have to say, I can tend to read a little too much into things at times!) I have no problem with gays/lesbians. I’ve worked side by side with some and I am convinced that most are genitically inclined and are good, law abiding people. However, as a straight female, I would not want to be “hit” on by another female and can understand straight guys feeling the same way. (Big Jake, I know the Bible probably disagrees with me on the homosexuality issue.) Guys, I absolutely need time with my girlfriends and I think you need the same with your male friends. There is nothing sexual about it. It’s healthy to be able to relax, talk, and be oneself without worrying about what a member of the opposite sex thinks of you. It doesn’t mean you want to sleep with that person. Give me a break! When I get together with my girlfriends and we talk about how sick we are of cleaning up after the kids and husband, the conversation always (and I mean always) turns to how thankful we are to have our kids and a husband who comes home every night, gives us a kiss, and plays with the kids. It took me a few years to come to terms with the fact that my husband doesn’t wipe the counters down like I think they need to be wiped down. Know what? I don’t check the pressure in the tires like he does. I think part of becoming an adult is accepting the other gender for what they have to offer. Don’t take that to mean I want my husband to yell at me or hit me, because I don’t. I also wouldn’t want to do anything that makes that happen.
Headlines today – looks like Americans are spending big bucks to protect Iranian diplomats to come “talk” to us. Let’s save a bunch of tax dollars by telling the UN to find somewhere else to practice. If Ahmadinejad comes here … how about mass demonstrations protesting his presence. I have to say if someone shoots him, I won’t lose a second’s sleep.
September 7, 2006 at 8:35 pm
Hi everyone – I just got off the phone with my 19 year old son who is at FT Bragg. He’ll be making his first jump out of an airplane on 9-11. He says it is the highest honor to be making the jump on that date. (This from a boy who gave me a run for my money when his dad was in Afghanistan!) I have to say that I am so proud of him, but as a mom who remembers him being an infant and toddler, I am also so worried for him and all of our children! I HATE terrorists! I thank God for American men who put their lives on the line for their families! That means you Big Jake, Zealot, Eagle, DJ, Niceguy and everyone you’ve worked with! We may not always agree on the nitty gritty, but we are united as Americans who cherish our freedoms and know that Freedom is not Free.
September 7, 2006 at 9:03 pm
Americanwoman, it’s been a long time since I’ve written in, but I have checked in every couple of days to read what you’re all talking about. Like DJ said, with Big Jake he says everything so well and has so many facts it’s hard to find anything to add. I was also leary about being attacked by that “curious” fellow. He could be monitoring, but he’s not saying anything so hopefully he doesn’t jump in now. He certainly adds to new meaning to the word asshole. So, take that if your monitoring. I’m a woman and I don’t swear a lot, but sometimes those are the only words that really get across.
Congratulations on your wonderful son and his jump. I don’t have any kids. Maybe someday. If I do, I hope I raise them well and they’re not afraid to stand up for what’s right.
Big Jake, I printed off #312, too. That was great. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
I hate, HATE the thought of Ahmadjinehad coming to our country, and at OUR EXPENSE??? Who thinks that’s a good idea? I’m shocked.
And, as far as Zealot goes, there’s no way that man is gay. You wrote one time that I need to get a boyfriend. Well honey, how about YOU?? I have to tell you, I even let some of my girlfriends read your posts, and you make our knees weak. You’re our new hearthrob. You come across like a really hot, sexy, guy. Don’t let Richard (317) put you off. WE KNOW BETTER.
September 7, 2006 at 9:08 pm
Zealot, I’d set my house on fire if I thought you come to put it out.
September 8, 2006 at 1:22 am
Big Jake. #326 I hope I’m not reading too much into it. Guys just don’t ordinarily talk like that. None that I know anyway. I’ve never considered my time with the guys beautiful and precious. Those two words just never come to mind when I’m with guys. I enjoyed your story. That sounds like something the guys I work with would do.
It makes me feel proud that you’re thanking me for you deciding to get back in the race. You’re a stand up guy, and I have a lot of respect for what you know and how you deliver it. So, you were born in 1954? You’re not that much older than me. I’ll consider you the older brother I never had, if you don’t mind. I am anxious to see Frequency so I know what you’re talking about.
Americanwoman #327 You are fortunate to have such great men around you. A soldier for a husband, and a soldier for a son. Like father, like son they say. I know you’re proud. I would be, too. Tell you’re son we’re rooting for him.
And now, lovesamerica. I’ve never been hit on via the internet before and to be honest it doesn’t do a hell of a lot for me. Maybe that’s because I’m not a pervert. I don’t know what you’re reading that makes your knees weak, but I’m just an ordinary guy. I did like being called hot, and I did like being called sexy, so thanks. You definitely have a fire that needs put out, so I hope you have someone on deck that can help you out.
September 8, 2006 at 2:24 am
lovesamerica: You almost got me fired today.
I was sneaking a peak at the blog when I read
your posts 329 and 330.
“Zealot, I’d set my house on fire if I thought you come to put it out.”
I COULDN’T STOP LAUGHING ! Where did that come from? The people I work with think there is something really wrong with me. I told them it was a form of Touretts Syndrome . Instead of making strange noises, I suffer from fits of uncontrollable laughter. My buddy Al is now calling me “Tomato Face”. Thanks.
Oh ,by the way , arn’t you concerned about ruffling Eagles’ Feathers?
#201 zealot: “and you have women falling all over Eagle like he’s some 6′2″ pretty boy they’re hoping to snag, when in reality, he’s probably some balding, pencil neck with thick glasses,”
OK Little Brother ,now you have the girls falling all over you!
Zealot , you honor me by thinking of me as an older brother. I have two sons. Joe is 22 and Louie is 15 . Joe teases Louie unmercifully.
Comes with the territory.- a lot of love there.
Americanwoman -FT. Brag jump school- your son must be in the 82ND OR 101ST ,tough outfits. YOU AND YOUR HUSBAND MUST BE SO PROUD OF HIM! May God keep him safe .
September 8, 2006 at 11:35 am
Big Jake, I’m glad you got some humor out of my post. I really wouldn’t set my house on fire. I don’t even own a house, but I’d love to meet a guy like Zealot.
Zealot, you wonder what makes our knees weak? I’ll tell you.
You’re a fireman. I don’t know what it is about policemen, firemen, and sorry Americanwoman, even soldiers, that there awfully appealing. Maybe it’s that you have to have a certain character to do such dangerous jobs, or maybe it’s the uniform. I don’t know what it is, but it’s a turn on. You avenged your sister. That in itself is a real turn on. Every woman likes to know a man will fight for her. You even admitted you had a tender side. It shows you’re sensitive, and probably pretty romantic when you want to be. You like to talk. So you would be a friend to the woman you loved. Women like to talk and they love sensitive guys. One of the men I work with is a volunteer firemen, and he told us once that the physical side to the firemen’s test is pretty grueling. That tells us that since you’re still a fairly young man, you’re probably in pretty good shape. You obviously would never hit a woman or even intentionally mistreat her and just the way you talk about your wife makes me think she was pretty lucky. Every woman wants to be cherished. Every woman wants to be cared for the way you cared about her. And since you avenged your sister, you probably would’ve gone ballistic if anyone ever hurt your wife. You said you cried after 9-11 when your son ran to you. Again, very sensitive. Very appealing.
I’m only 23 years old and I’m really not hitting on you. It just seems like all I ever meet are jerks. I’m a nice girl and I don’t hit and scratch men or demand my own way. You just sound like my dream man. I’m not a pervert, either. I like to have fun and kid around. I really do hope you find a woman that you can love and will satisfy you the way your first wife did. I just wish it were me.
September 8, 2006 at 12:30 pm
lovesamerica : you are alot like my wife. You’ve got it all together just like she did at 23. That’s when we got married .That was 27 years ago. Make sure you wait for the right guy . You deserve the best.
September 8, 2006 at 12:50 pm
Zealot:
Little brother, re post #333 Lovesamerica said it perfectly . You have alot to offer the right woman.
I’m going to add another movie to your list
“Always “with Richard Dreyfus.
September 8, 2006 at 1:19 pm
#333 – Lovesamerica, you said it perfectly. I lived in Lawton OK, home of FT Sill, when I met my husband. I knew I’d probably marry a guy in the service, becuase most of them are pretty exceptional … not that there aren’t other great guys out there as well, but I was born into the military and wasn’t afraid of the moving around. I don’t know if you and your friends live near a military post, but if you do, there are always functions on post for single soldiers and they’re always looking for women to attend them. Lots of posts/bases will have concerts that are open to the public. Call the MWR (Morale, Welfare, and Recreation) office on post and ask them if there are any events that you and your friends can attend to meet single soldiers. I was a waitress at Chi-Chi’s after I got out of college and couldn’t get a decent job. It was a great way to meet single soldiers who would come out for dinner. It enabled me to get a handle on their personality before going on a date, too. Just a use a little caution, because while most of the guys are really great guys, there are a few who are not nice people. I bet Zealot has some advice on how you can meet firemen (without doing something drastic like setting a fire – I got a laugh out of that, too!).
#332 – Big Jake, my son joined the RI National Guard because they have a Special Forces component. He went to selection and made it through that, so he’s at Jump School now. My husband corrected me … he’s at FT Benning, not Bragg. He’ll be going to Special Forces Training sometime in November and he’s planning to go full-time with Special Forces. We really are proud of him although I do worry about him.
September 8, 2006 at 1:19 pm
I don’t remember if anyone has pointed this fact out, but have the homosexuals considered how they will fare in an Islamic society? Have they monitored the fate of their “brethren” in those countries.
And, Yes, I hope the liberal professors are paying attention to the “cleansing” in the Iranian universities. Alas, probably, No. Their brain cells not corrupted by LSD, ’shrooms, and other recreational drugs are occupied by their short-sighted, “we’re all citizens of the world,” touchy-feely, the conservatives are the one to blame, nonsense.
Anyone, besides me, remember the “Far Side” cartoon by Gary Trudeau that showed a father and son looking over the fence at the next residence that had wolves in and around the house? The caption read something to the affect of, “Yes, Timmy, I miss the Wilkersons, too. But they were stupid people. But, that’s why we have wolves and other large predators.” Being a biologist, that cartoon says volumes to me.
I’m one of the unique scientists that has balanced religion with science knowledge. My acceptance of science fact, theory, and possibilites is strengthened by the recognition of God’s hand in nature in general. If it can’t be explained by science, why not attribute it to Him (or Her). And I thank God every day for giving me the right and the intelligence to make decisions on my own. I’ve noticed that most of the folks that flock to Islam are simple minded (and I don’t mean that in a negative context) that need the strong control of this religion to keep their human nature in control. But not by much.
Note Big Jake’s article(s) about how the middle-east is basically a patriarchal society. Have you ever NOTICED a muslim family in public? One instance of a family on an airplane comes to mind. I was disgusted. The father was seated forward in the cabin WITH HIS SONS, while his wife sat to the rear of the cabin WITH THE DAUGHTERS. What did he do with most of his time during the flight? He read an airline magazine. No, not unusual, but what caught my eye was that he kept flipping back to a one page add of a gorgeous, blonde model. Yeah, a real pious, faithful muslim!
Second point, note that …(infidels and) apostates property and women are for all to take.” How many times have we heard the stories about the rapes and killings of the women in the areas that they attack that have opposing views to theirs? And they say that they respect women?
Seems to me that the sexual violence that is allowed during the spread Islam is a “vent” of the basic human behavior that most western countries have grown out of. Unlike us, the mullahs and imams have recognized the ways to dominate, control, and “guide” their mindless minions on the path to world domination.
This war is not neccessarily religious in nature, it is one of control of wealth. Ask anyone and they will recount stories of fat-cat priors, monks, priests, bishops, imams, mullahs, rabbis, etc. I, personally, have noticed that Nasrallah, Al Sadr, and other prominent muslims “leaders” appear to not have missed any meals. Yes, without the tithe money from their “flocks” they cannot continue to live in the style to which they’ve become accustomed. Oh, Allah forbid, that their congregations spend it on books, education, internet access, and (gasp!) knowledge that there is more out there than heat, sand, goats, camels, and manure. Oh, the woe, that their people might uncover their eyes and learn that the “way” shoved down their throats since they were able to listen IS NOT the ONLY way to live!
Yes, I am very disconcerted that the average American cannot see the danger of the “large predators” that are getting very near our doors. The women in conversations that quickly change the topic when something as serious as this is brought up.
Yep, we’ve got a tough row to hoe ahead of us. And if I’ve got to be one of the stubborn mules to plow the fields to sow freedom, then hitch me up. I’m rarin’ to go.
September 8, 2006 at 1:52 pm
DJ – Thanks so much for saying what you said and saying it so well! My husband and I were driving back from visiting family in Williamsburg, VA, and we stopped in Crown Point, NY, to fill up and get snacks for the kids. The place was owned by an Afghan man and his elderly dad. His dad just glared at me and my daughters (probably because we were wearing shorts and short sleeved tops and had the audacity to stand next to my husband instead of behind him). My husband talked about Afghanistan with the son for a couple minutes. When we got back to the car, I mentioned the dad glaring at me and the girls and my husband said, yeah, they want to keep you all covered up because they “respect” you so much and in the meantime sell porn magazines in their stores. I hadn’t noticed all the magazines at the front counter.
I don’t know how homosexuals will fare under Islam. I don’t think many people realize how rampant homosexual-like behavior is in Afghanistan. Apparently, because it costs so much for a wife and men are not highly paid, a man can be 35 or older before he can buy a wife. They can’t have sex with a woman they aren’t married to, so it’s fairly common to see older men forcing young men to take care of those needs. It’s just sick.
September 8, 2006 at 6:43 pm
Re: American Woman # 338. BINGO! It’s all about the USE of women. Very rarely do you read about a muslim man speaking about his love for his wife. Mostly it’s about his MALE children, perhaps his daughter(s), and rarely about his wife. You mostly hear negative things, i.e. backtalk, showing hair from under a scarf, speaking her mind, etc.
I’m sorry, but they will have to do a lot of convincing to get me to believe that they consider women for anything other than breeding children and being a receptor for their carnal urges. In my humble opinion they are just above the club and dragging the woman by the hair to their cave. Now the women are brainwashed to believe that it is Allah’s will that they be treated as such. If they only knew the freedom they could have there might be more “Lorena Bobbitt” moments in the middle east.
But that’s why the imams and mullahs keep such a death grip on the media. You don’t miss what you’ve never experienced. You don’t rebel if you have nothing with which to compare your present situation. We need to increase our Radio Free “U-pick-a-stan” programs and lambast the islamic lies over the airwaves, jam the “Al Jeer-at-ya” and equivalents’ signals to stop the propaganda, and start a massive leaflet drop of information on the regimes. Give the mindless minions something to think about, something to compare the lies to, tell them the truth. What a concept.
September 8, 2006 at 7:16 pm
Big Jake, yeah, #201, I remember writing that. I wonder if she’ll feel the same way when she learns I’m the pencil neck. I could never meet her because I doubt I’d live up to her expectations. When reality and fantasy collide, it’s pretty messy.
I had to chuckle about the “turn on” for avenging my sister, though. My wife sure didn’t find it that way. To say she raised the roof is an understatement. We had just found out about two weeks prior to me doing that, that she was pregnant. If he would’ve pressed charges, I would have lost my job and probably done some jail time myself. I knew that, and that’s why I threatened him. It was just a real stupid thing to do. It felt good doing it, but I should’ve been smarter and paid more attention to what could happen and how it would affect my family if I got caught. My wife gave me the dagger stare for days. Once she felt comfortable that nothing was going to happen she forgave me, but for about two weeks, I paid dearly. Turned on, that’s a laugh. I was afraid to go near her.
Lovesamerica, if you want to find a firefighter, I suggest you go to NYC. They have 5 boroughs to take care of and thousands of firefighters. The NYFD is now taking applications, or will be soon, and there will be plenty of guys around your age that will be applying. If I was a resident I’d probably apply myself. They have the toughest training in the country and I’m sure you’ll find what you’re looking for. Firefighters are a great group of guys. We’re a brotherhood and look out for each other. Our motto “No man left behind”. Great, great guys.
Just remember something, some men may not wear the uniform, but the majority of men are all firemen, policemen, and soldiers at heart. What you’re looking for could be right in front of you.
DJ & Americanwoman, the more I read about Islam and their lame religion, the more I don’t understand how this religion ever got started. The homo stuff. They have to save to buy a wife and until they do they do each other. These guys sound pretty sad. They need to get a backbone and forget that shit.
September 8, 2006 at 9:12 pm
Zealot, I really laugh when I read some of your posts because you remind me of my husband. You two could be brothers, I swear! (And all of you great guys – Big Jake, Eagle, DJ, Zealot – remind me of my big brother. He was just such a decent man who did everything he could to take care of his family, be a great son, and brother!)
Just before my husband and I got married, I was in Concord visiting him and my future in-laws and the two of us went to a movie. This drunk guy walks up and tries to cheat the line. He gets really belligerent with a couple people in line and I glanced at my husband and recognized the “I’m about to pound this jerk” signs. My husband said something to the guy and the guy came towards him ready for trouble. I knew my husband could and would take the guy down, but I always worry about concealed weapons, so I kept saying quietly, “He’s drunk, ignore him, look the other way … yadda, yadda, yadda.” They got into a slight tussle and the guy took off. I was so mad at my husband over it though because he had potentially put his life in jeopardy for that drunk jerk. I can totally understand where Caroline was coming from, but I know deep down she also expected you to stand up for your sister and respected you for it. It’s a bit schizophrenic of us women and I know it’s one of the things about us that drives you guys nuts.
September 8, 2006 at 9:50 pm
Big Jake, I’m still laughing over the picture in my mind of you telling your co-workers you have Tourette’s. I love the American sense of humor! You guys are too funny.
September 9, 2006 at 1:42 am
Americanwoman:
I personally think not being able to control my laughter ,sitting there beet red and gasping for breath, and my buddy Al exploiting the whole thing(I’m surprised he didn’t sell tickets!)makes a much funnier mental picture.
September 9, 2006 at 3:32 am
DJ #337 Kudos again my friend , an excellent
observation .
” How many times have we heard the stories about the rapes and killings of the women in the areas that they attack that have opposing views to theirs? And they say that they respect women?
Seems to me that the sexual violence that is allowed during the spread Islam is a “vent” of the basic human behavior that most western countries have grown out of.”
This has been done throughout their history
as an effective tool to asert their dominance and to cow the conquered peoples into submission. Two such events come to mind the fall of Constantinople in 1453 and the fall of Khatoum to the Madhi
The Fall of Constantinople
The Emperor and his commanders were trying frantically to rally their troops and push back the enemy. It was too late. Waves of Janissaries, followed by other regular units of the Ottoman army, were crashing throught the open Gates, mixed with fleeing and slaughtered Christian soldiers. Then the Emperor, realizing that everything was lost, removed his Imperial insignia, and followed by his cousin Theophilus Palaeologus, the Castilian Don Francisco of Toledo, and John Dalmatus, all four holding their swords, charged into the sea of the enemy soldiers, hitting left and right in a final act of defiance. They were never seen again.
Now thousands of Ottoman soldiers were pouring into the city. One after the other the city Gates were opened. The Ottoman flags began appearing on the walls, on the towers, on the Palace at Blachernae. Civilians in panic were rushing to the churches. Others locked themselves in their homes, some continued fighting in the streets, crowds of Greeks and foreigners were rushing towards the port area. The allied ships were still there and began collecting refugees. The Cretan soldiers and sailors, manning three towers near the entrance of the Golden Horn, were still fighting and had no intention of surrendering. At the end, the Ottoman commanders had to agree to a truce and let them sail away, carrying their arms.
The excesses which followed, druing the early hours of the Ottoman victory, are described in detail by eyewitnesses. They were, and unfortunately still are, a common practice, almost a ritual, among all armies capturing enemy strongholds and territory after a prolonged and violent struggle. Thus, bands of soldiers began now looting. Doors were broken, private homes were looted, their tenants were massacred. Shops in the city markets were looted. Monasteries and Convents were broken in. Their tenants were killed, nuns were raped, many, to avoid dishonor, killed themselves. Killing, raping, looting, burning, enslaving, went on and on according to tradition. The troops had to satisfy themselves. The great doors of Saint Sophia were forced open, and crowds of angry soldiers came in and fell upon the unfortunate worshippers. Pillaging and killing in the holy place went on for hours. Similar was the fate of worshippers in most churches in the city. Everything that could be taken from the splendid buildings was taken by the new masters of the Imperial capital. Icons were destroyed, precious manuscripts were lost forever. Thousands of civilians were enslaved, soldiers fought over young boys and young women. Death and enslavement did not distinguish among social classes. Nobles and peasants were treated with equal ruthlessness.
September 9, 2006 at 11:15 am
Big Jake, where do you find all this information? Do you search it out on the internet, or is it in books & magazines you read? These people sound like animals. I’ve never been in the military, but if I was and I was under orders to take a city, I can’t see myself willingly participating in these activities. I would hope that I’m more civilized, or have a conscience? Part of this says the troops had to satisfy themselves. I can’t see the satisfaction about any of it.
I’ll be gone for a few days. A friend of mine asked me to take her to Niagra Falls. She’s new to the area and has never been there. I’ll take my laptop and check in if I can. Doubt if I will, but if I’m able to, I will.
Have a great weekend everyone.
September 9, 2006 at 12:36 pm
ZEALOT:
I have always been a history buff . I am a CPA and a Tax Manager by trade. I do Tax research on the internet. Those skills are readily transferable to general internet research,sooooo.. all I do is apply my history knowlege to my research skills and you see what I am able to pull up.
Getting back to my last post, that kind of behavior ,beleive it or not was common to warfare in general on both sides of the Islamic -Christian struggle commonly known to us as the Crusades.
We hear alot about how the Christians behaved .We never hear about how the Moslems behaved and I went to Catholic elementary and high school.
They are still calling us “Crusaders” as if it was a derogatory term. Guess what they teach the kids in the Madras’s about the Crusades?
That result is the cause of the problems we have today.
We are constantly doing a “Mea Culpa” over what happened over 500 years ago. Look at how President Bush had to backtrack over his use of the term Crusade and all the flak he took from the Liberal media. They ,the Islamists”, don’t do that because it is their belief system. When was the last time you heard an Islamist do a “Mea Culpa”? You haven’t heard it in the Liberal press. I found instances of honest Muslims doing a self examination of their society ON THEIR MEDIA and have posted it previously.
Remember ,they were the agressors here. The entire Middle East and North Africa was Christian in 600AD .
We are demonized over the introduction of Christianity to the New World and what we did to the indigenous population ,the Indians.
The Aztecs were peforming Human sacrifices. There are still tribes in the Amazon that practice cannibalism. We’re not the bad guys here either,at least not as bad as we are made out to be.
If Columbus was such a monster , why then do the Hispanic Americans celebrate Columbus Day ?
Hispanic Americans are among the most devout Christians in the world.
Well ,that’s all for now. Have a great time at the Falls, Little Brother!
September 9, 2006 at 12:48 pm
Big Jake – I agree with Zealot. Are you a history major? Anyway, it makes for some great reading, even if it is depressing. My husband reads tons of stuff about the countries he’s likely to find himself in these days and he knows US history like the back of his hand. I’ve done a little reading about the Roman Empire (beyond what I did in high school) and worry about some of the similarities between the downfall of the Empire and some of what we’re seeing in America today.
Zealot, I’ve been part of the military from birth. While we’re no different than any other segment of society where there are some bad “nickles” as a good friend used to put it, the vast number of American troops are decent people and would never do such vile things. My husband and dad would never do anything like that … even if they thought they could get away with it. Also, glad to hear they caught Phillips.
September 9, 2006 at 2:24 pm
My, my, my. Zealot, hope you have a great weekend. It would be a shame for you to drive all the way up to the Falls for nothing. I mean gas, meals, hotel. Good luck. I hope you get a lot of ass. From the sounds of it, you can get plenty if you want it. Even the queers like you. All this bonding between you and Big Jake. And it all started after I revealed his true identity. What…does he give you free samples or something? I thought you really were the pencil neck from all the sucking, but after I found out DJ was the biologist, well, you know biologists, thick glasses, bald, he just fits that description all too well.
lovesamerica, why would you be afraid I would attack you? I don’t attack horny girls. I don’t have to. They know their position, and it’s usually on their back. Unless you’re real lucky and get a kinky one. How about I put on a firemen’s hat and throw one into you? You’d like it. See, I like to be helpful. I’m right here on deck, honey. Or should I say horny?
Americanwoman, I would like to thank you for giving lovesamerica the slut route to finding a man. You seem to be an expert in that area. You even solicited Zealot into helping out. Good girl. But,I’m convinced Zealot probably has all he can handle with women falling at his feet and having Big Jake in the background watching and humping whatever is close by. The dog, the cat, Al, tax forms.
I hope I have the same weekend Zealot is in for. I hope he has a real hot one.
September 9, 2006 at 3:31 pm
Curious:
Boy are you a sicko.
Get some help.
Please, GET SOME HELP!
September 9, 2006 at 5:11 pm
Curious, I see you’re back again. I told you I wouldn’t read your posts, so I didn’t and won’t. I did see Big Jake’s reply to you so it’s no surprise to see your full of the same hate and contempt for us. Go someplace else!
September 9, 2006 at 11:50 pm
Regarding Curious:
He’s a fountain of misplaced rage. Name your cliche; Mother held him too much or not enough, last picked at kickball, late night sneaky uncle, whatever. Now he’s so angry that moments of levity actually cause him pain; give him headaches. Happiness, for that gentleman, hurts.
September 10, 2006 at 12:28 am
Big Jake, Americanwoman, lovesamerica, Zealot:
I just did it for laughs.
Sorry.
September 10, 2006 at 1:37 pm
Just got up and out of the shower. Thought I’d check the website on my laptop….lo and behold…he’s back.
Curious: When I first read your input I went from zero to ninety in about 2 seconds. I even fantasized about slamming you up against a wall, but after thinking about it, I’ve changed my mind. I know I like being able to express myself anonomously. I like talking with people that are like-minded. People I know I would like and respect if I knew them personally. So I came to this conclusion. You need us. You need us to vent all the hate and rage that’s stored up inside you. Jake was right. That’s why you monitor us, and then, when you have enough to spew out some crap, you let us have it. It’s probably therapy for you, which is good. Because, you’d probably be dangerous if you didn’t have some outlet. So go ahead, say what you want. You’re meaningless to all of us. Who cares what you say, except, maybe you. You even threw us a curve. You get back on and say it was for laughs. That you’re sorry? Please. Was that a spark of consience, or just a trap so we would start responding and give you some more ammo? Americanwoman is right, too. Who needs to read anything you write? I probably will if you do, because, that’s the way I am, but I won’t answer it, and I don’t think it will even make me mad anymore. You’re a frickin nut, and you really should take Jake’s advice, and get some help before you snap and do something stupid. And by the way, I didn’t have the romp you seemed to think I was in for. This girl lost her husband to cancer after a long battle several months ago. She has the cutest little 4 year old girl you’d ever want to see, and we took her, as well as my son and a friend of his with us. Not really the atmosphere for a sexual encounter. She and her daughter have their room, and we have ours. And guess what, I even paid for everything. We used my SUV, I paid for all the gas, the meals, the rooms, the entertainment, the souveneirs…everything. She offered to chip in several times, but I refused. I enjoyed doing it, too. We’ve had a great time so far. So, pal, I guess chivalry is only dead to little weasels like you.
Jake, if I ever lose this website, and can never talk to you again, I want you to know I really am glad I “met” you. I think you’re a great guy and would like to shake you’re hand. I take that back. I’d like to hug you.
Curious, I’m not queer and I’m not a pedophile. I just love people and kids.
September 10, 2006 at 4:27 pm
Zealot:
Glad to hear you are having a good time. Your post #353 -PERFECTION and just when Curious had me speachless.
Curious: If you ever want to rejoin the human race,I sincerely hope you get some counseling.
I don’t know what your problems are but I venture to say they will not go away by themselves.
The people on this board are a microcosm of American society in general and as a whole ,we are a pretty good bunch of people. We take care of our own .
As Zealot just said,regarding your behavior towards the people on this board-
“It’s probably therapy for you, which is good. Because, you’d probably be dangerous if you didn’t have some outlet”.
There’s nothing to be ashamed of in seeking counseling. We all have problems which we have to deal with. Sometimes it helps to talk it out with a counselor or a friend.
And by the way ,I think that most of the people on this board “turn the other cheek” because thats the way we are. There is one caveat: we only have 2.
September 10, 2006 at 9:24 pm
I have to say after reading what Curious had to say about me, I was so embarrassed I cried. It even made me sick to my stomach because I knew all of you would read that and I just felt awful all day. I was never going to get on here again because of him, but, Zealot, you are still my hero and my dream man. I envy that girl if you’re interested in her. I really do. Thank you and Big Jake. You two fella’s are something else. And you know what? I don’t care what that loser has to say about me anymore, either. He’s such a low life. I wish he’d crawl back under his rock and stay there.
September 10, 2006 at 9:27 pm
Date: 09/20/2001 01:54 PM EDT
From: John
To: President George W. Bush
Subject: I am an American
Dear Mr. President,
I am an American.
I am not of one color, but of many.
My forefathers are not from one country, but from all countries.
I have brothers and sisters from Washington state to Washington D.C.,
from California to the Carolinas, from Hawaii to New Hampshire,
from Alaska to Alabama, and from Minnesota to Mississippi.
I am an American.
I believe in the importance of sharing Thanksgiving Dinner with your family,
and Fourth of July parades with your community.
I enjoy the peace of Christmas Day, and the excitement of New Year’s Eve.
I am an American.
I believe in a kind and benevolent God,
Who does not condone the taking of innocent life.
I believe our worth is measured not by what we have,
but by what we do.
I am an American.
I believe in Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness,
The Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
And I believe in the Pledge of Allegiance to Our Flag.
I AM AN AMERICAN,
AND I WILL NOT ALLOW
OUR FREEDOM TO BE DEFEATED!
John
Rome, New York
September 10, 2006 at 9:56 pm
Peace
Date: 09/18/2001 09:03 AM EDT
From: Sami
To: President George W. Bush
Subject: Peace
Dear Mr. President,
Your words at the Islamic Center in Washington D.C. have touched all Arab Americans and Muslim Americans. Thank you for standing out so strongly for the rights of all people in this nation regardless of color, race, creed or religion. You are a patriot of principles. We all stand with you in condemning this heinious crime against humanity.
Please accept our heartfelt sympathies and condolences. As a 2nd generation Arab-American family, we share and grieve with everyone. We all wake up everyday to go to work in order to provide for our loved ones. We all fly on planes as part of business or pleasure.
This is the American way of life, and we cherish it. The tragedy that befell all those who went to work that morning or who got onto an airplane touches each and everyone. Brooklyn is my place of birth, and New York City is one of mankind’s greatest engineering marvels. The devastation brought on by such senseless and mad people is beyond comprehension.
The henious acts perpetrated on Sept. 11 is condemned in the strongest terms by people of all faiths and ethnic backgrounds. This is clearly a crime against humanity. May God bless you with all the strength and wisdom needed to carry this nation forward in these difficult times.
Salam, Peace, and Shalom,
Sami
Naperville, Illinois
2nd Generation Arab American
September 10, 2006 at 10:11 pm
Lovesamerica – I was going to drop visiting the site, too. It makes me physically ill to think there are guys like Curious out there. You didn’t say anything wrong either. So you want a decent guy. What woman doesn’t? Zealot sounds like an awesome guy. He’s single. You’re single. All you did was tell him why you and your friends think he’s great. He took it well and I’m sure you gave his ego a boost. There is nothing wrong with that.
Big Jake – nice letters especially with the impending anniversary. I live in a very, very liberal state right now. I caught a show on Canadian television pursuing this theory that 9-11 was put in motion by Bust. It makes me sick.
September 10, 2006 at 10:36 pm
You all really do make me sick. You’re all a bunch of psychiatrists now. Trying to make me feel like I have a problem because I see what’s deep inside all of you and you don’t want to admit it. But you all know it’s there. I try to make amends and you still just tear me down. You have your own little clique. You never asked me to join it. None of you ever got on here and said, Hey Curious, what do you think about this or that. And we like you and you’re smart. I never got that. All the compliments go to Big Jake and Zealot. And they seem to be each other’s biggest fans. You all chum up to each other and act like you care so much about each other and you don’t even know who you’re talking to and you call me nuts. Zealot, you look up to Big Jake like you actually know him. How did that happen? You said you want to hug him. Why? What does he do that makes you act like that? And the girls think you’re so special. Why? What’s so great about you? Just because you’re a firemen? So what if you are. Big deal. Whoopdy do. A firemen. Like that’s something so great. Every little kid wants to be a firemen so all that tells me is that you never grew up. All men go to work and most of us work our asses off. So what I don’t go into burning buildings or save someone millions on their taxes. Does that make you both better than me? I think it’s dumb to go into a burning building, but the girls seem to think it’s what a real man does. I don’t think so. You girls act like Big Jake and Zealot are so great. So smart. So hot. So sexy. Most of the stuff Big Jake puts on here someone else wrote. But Zealot looks up to him like he’s the big king. And then you talk about me like I’m crazy. I’m not crazy. I would’ve been different if you would’ve been nice to me in the beginning. But no, Zealot had to call me a prick right away and that lovesamerica chick had to incinuate that she would say F-you to me. The only problem I have is why your clique is so exclusive. I like to get on here and read what you all say but you don’t want me to be a part of it. I’m still going to read what you say and if you don’t like what I say and you want to ignore me I don’t really care. I’m still going to read everything the big kingpins write.
September 10, 2006 at 11:26 pm
Okay Curious, I did what I said I wouldn’t (and I’ll probably kick myself for it) but I read your last post. I am willing to give you a chance despite a few really mean things you’ve said about me and my husband. You say you feel attacked. To be bluntly honest, I think you’ve brought alot of it on yourself. You called me ugly, fat, and stupid. You don’t know what I look like and I’m none of those things. I think if you read what’s been said on this site, you’ll find that we (women) value guys who get up, go to work everyday, work their butts off when they’re at work, and come home every night (in a pretty decent mood). We just want some recognition and appreciation that what we do day in and day out isn’t easy either. I know there are crappy women in this world who use men and I’ll be the first to condemn what they do. However, there are men out there who really hate women and abuse them. I’ll take plenty of heat from feminists, but it’s a fact that 99% of you men are one hell of a lot stronger than us women. If you want to hit us, you can do one hell of a lot of damage. If I punched you, you’d probably laugh your head off. So the way I look at it is that men are responsible for keeping their tempers in check and walking away when an argument gets out of control because it is you who can do the most damage. I know one of the guys just told Lovesamerica that heroes come in all kinds of packages, not just military, police, and fire uniforms and that is a true, true statement. I think the comment you made to Viber probably initiated alot of the heat you took. You have to admit that was really below the belt. Women don’t forget stuff like that. We take it really personally. And so what if we give Big Jake, Eagle, DJ and others lots of credit for knowing the stuff they do. I know just about everything you need to know on how to keep a lawn green and in great shape. I make a mean apple pie and if it’s decorating/color matching, I’d be an expert there, too. If we were talking about that stuff on the site, then I’d be getting the compliments. Just because others get compliments on what they know, doesn’t mean the rest of us, you included, are a bunch of dummies. Big Jake and Zealot have clicked. Good for them! I feel like I could be Lovesamerica’s big sister. Do you know how discouraging it is to be a 24 year old women and date guy after guy who just wants to sleep with you? You feel like a piece of meat. There’s a saying out there … “once bitten, twice shy” and I think you’ll probably have that from some of us. For me, if you want to chime in with your opinions on the topic and they aren’t a personal attack, I’ll read them.
September 10, 2006 at 11:32 pm
zealot :
Buffalo lost 19-17to Bills heartbreaker
Jets won 23-16 over Titans Pennington is BACK !
September 11, 2006 at 12:30 am
Big Jake: I know, I know. Rub it in..I’m cryin’ in my beer. They should’ve won that game, too. They were up for awhile. I think that will be their legacy..”they shoulda won” Man, I wish they’d make me proud!
Watchin the Giants/Colts game right now. They had a great intro with pictures of 9-11.
5 years tomorrow…never again.
September 11, 2006 at 12:32 am
I like football, too.
September 11, 2006 at 12:36 am
Big Jake: Got home this afternoon. Have the laptop in the living room with me while I’m watching the game.
Too bad I can’t talk with you one on one, because, quite frankly, I don’t know what to make of this shit, if you know what I mean.
September 11, 2006 at 12:58 am
Curious:
I just read your post #359 . It brought me back to my college days ,dealing with friends who had too much to drink and had alcohol poisoning.
They would puke up their guts or have their stomachs pumped . Then they felt better .
You just went through a catharsis. You let out the poison that was in your system. You will feel alot better because you got it off your chest.
No one ever said that you were unwelcome prior to the insults . Unfortunately , the insults started with your first post #139 and got worse as time went on. I’d say you got off on the wrong foot.
As to who’s smart and who’s great and who’s this or that ,that’s all kid stuff. We all have an opinion about something .That’s what a forum is all about . We want to promote an exchange of ideas .That is how we see a different point of view and form and adjust opinions we may or may not have.
Regarding counseling , I speak from the heart and from experience. I was being honest when I suggested that you talk to a friend or see a counselor . We all have things that bother us . Death of a loved one, the end of a relationship , EVEN THINGS ,YOU ARE NOT AWARE OF.whatever. I’ve had problems in my life with accepting my father’s death and my reaction almost ended my marriage. Dude, I’ve been to hell and back looking for answers. Read my posts,I think I am finding my way.
I’m willing to bury the hatchet if you are.
What do you say?
September 11, 2006 at 1:02 am
Curious:
Favorite team?
September 11, 2006 at 1:14 am
Zealot, I think I know what you mean. Is it possible that Curious is serious about an apology? Could he really have been kidding? If so, he has far different a funny bone than I, but maybe he’s serious. I had asked him once if he’s an American and I didn’t get an answer. I’ve lived in a lot of foreign countries and what goes for “joking” around is a lot different than what we think is okay. He said once that I am naive, and I can be. I’m willing to give him a chance if he cleans up his act. One of the dangers of being in these exchanges is that one could potentially come in as several different people. I’m an honest person. What I say is what I think. I’ve worried that I’ve given far too much personal info away, but it’s hard not to trust stuff written by you, Big Jake, Eagle, and DJ (Red Dawn, Viber, Lovesamerica and a few others as well). I would hate to lose communication with you all. Red Dawn, Viber, and Eagle have probably checked out, and I think that’s a shame. I don’t know what to think!
September 11, 2006 at 1:37 am
Big Jake: Post 239 was just a joke. Viber got all upset because she’s so religious she doesn’t know how to take something that’s a little dirty, so she pulls a pout and never comes back. Then Red Dawn put me down about it. That’s what bugs me about women. They all act like a bunch of sisters. Be honest. Didn’t you laugh at some of the stuff I said? Zealot, he drives me nuts. I always thought he acted pissed when he wrote in. As soon as everyone finds out he’s a firemen everything changed. Why do you like him so much and want him to watch movies and discuss it with you? I know he’s going to read this, and I don’t care. I know he’d like to hit me. He always says it or implies it. I think he sounds violent. These women on here don’t like hitting, but they love him because he beat the shit out of somebody. Do you just feel sorry for him because his wife died? And I didn’t tell Americanwoman she was fat and ugly. All I said was that it was a possibility. You all could be fat and ugly for all I know. Even wonderful firefighter Zealot. He could have zits and pimples and B.O. And he takes offense to everything you say about women. Like he’s their big protector. You all kicked me out of here once and I really don’t think I did anything all that bad.
I hate the Bills. I like the Jets, the Giants, and the Patriots. But, I hate the Bills.
September 11, 2006 at 2:12 am
Americanwoman & Big Jake: It’s been nice. But this thing isn’t going to be the same anymore. Curious is a basket case. He’s playing us and I’m not in to mind games.
I’ve liked knowing all of you.
God Bless and Good luck in all you do.
September 11, 2006 at 4:58 am
curious:
To be honest ,I got a chuckle out of the male enhancement video thing but the rest of it especially with the ladies was mean spirited and crass.
You have to consider other people’s feelings, and be sensitive to issues that might be hurtful.
You have been reading the posts enough to see that things you posted have been hurtful but you didn’t care.
There is a decorum ,a community standard that should be followed . This isn’t a bar room .
I don’t know what you want me to tell you.
September 11, 2006 at 5:04 am
Zealot:
Happy trails ,Little Brother.
It has been fun .
God Bless and take care of yourself.
September 11, 2006 at 6:15 am
I’m up at 2am to say the same thing. Curious, I think you’re of Middle Eastern heritage where women are on the bottom of the rung and that’s what made it okay for you to say the stuff you did to us women and why it means so much to you that BJ and Z had issues with you.
Best wishes to you all. May we remain ever vigilent after 9-11. Zealot, I hope you find a woman worthy of you. Lovesamerica, hang in there and don’t settle short, but don’t overlook the guy who’s a little on the quiet side.
September 11, 2006 at 7:42 am
Americanwoman, Lovesamerica, DJ,VIBER,EAGLE,Red Dawn:
Take care of yourselves .God Bless America.
Its a shame that we got torpedoed as a group on 9-11 AGAIN
September 11, 2006 at 6:04 pm
All,
If this is “Happy Trails,” then it’s been a pleasure. I hope we cross paths in some other web forum in the future.
Oh, and Curious, I’m not bald and I don’t wear thick glasses, just thin ones for reading. Remember, you can’t judge a book by its cover and stereotypes are soooo last week. Except for male muslim extremists between the ages of 14 and 45. ; )
September 11, 2006 at 6:18 pm
WAIT A MINUTE!!!
I’m back guys! What, we can’t still discuss things because someone wants to be nasty? Are we REALLY going to allow ourselves to be bombed again on 9-11?
We don’t have to respond to his posts, don’t have to be played. It’s a choice.
Geez, guys; this the American way? People get hateful or rude and we tuck tail and run?
Americanwoman–Don’t leave yet! Just been real busy but I have been coming in and keeping up with your posts. And I’ve missed you too!
Big Jake and D.J.–I love your commentary and your insightful knowledge.
zealot–I was truly touched to see that you became a christian and am so happy to know you’re my spiritual brother.
lovesamerica–Don’t be ashamed of thinking the qualities that zealot has exhibited are to be desired in a man. Find the man that emulates those qualities and you will have a friend, and potentially more, for life.
Guys, you are like a brother/sisterhood to me. I feel that we could all be the greatest of friends.
If we don’t want to communicate here because we can’t keep certain people out, would it be possible for us to set up our own discussion forum and moderate it so that only those that are considerate are allowed? How could we do this? I know the forum would be easy, but how to let one another know where to go to join up? I was talking to my husband about this the another night and he says there’s a way, he’d have to think about it. He’s been following all of our conversations and has been impressed with everyone.
Come on guys, what do you say???
I know I could go and set up a forum, make it with a membership only, and post the site here.
You guys could come over and join.
We’d know each other and anyone that revealed themselves as a jerk I’d knock off.
What do you think? Hope you guys are reading this!
September 11, 2006 at 6:31 pm
Red Dawn – I just checked in to read other farewells. I’d be willing to participate in your blog. My concern is that Curious has been a few different people on this site. His hatred for Zealot would eventually show through I guess. I’ll check back to see what you can come up with. I had wondered if we could do something similar.
September 11, 2006 at 6:56 pm
Yes, he would eventually show himself.
How about this: I could get a temporary email address and each one of you guys could email me from whatever address you wish to use.
How to know it’s you…hmmm. Well, for starters, you’d have to use your moniker here in your email to me.
Perhaps you could tell me a couple of stand-out letters or something to look for to authenticate your email address here…like, say you posted as usual under your name “Americanwoman” here and told me to look for “ca” in the email address you mailed from. Of course, someone could go to the trouble of creating an email with that in it and say it was from you BUT I could check back here first and tell you I have received your email and ask you for one more clarifying part of your email address. I know it sounds like a little bit of work but not really…we can do this and it would take no time. Come on guys!
September 11, 2006 at 7:11 pm
Ok, better yet…
I’ll post an email address for you guys that are interested in starting our own private discussion group to contact me at. You contact me and I’ll come back and post here that I have received your email.
I’ll then take something from that email address, say your address is susanbanthony@service.com, and post here asking you to verify, saying “Americanwoman-does your email address contain the word “ant”?” You verify whether or not this is the case. Very unlikely someone would send me an email from “you” with that in their email address.
September 11, 2006 at 7:18 pm
I hope I’m getting you guys before you sign off for good!
You never know if we could have that cocktail party in real life oneday!
September 11, 2006 at 7:39 pm
YEHAA COUNT ME IN TOO! I LOVE YOU GUYS!
September 11, 2006 at 8:02 pm
Oh YEA!
I’m going to get that email address right now and we’ll work out the particulars.
I love you guys, too, and this is going to be FANTASTIC!
September 11, 2006 at 8:17 pm
Calling zealot, viber, DJ, lovesamerica, Eagle, I’ll be back with an address you can contact me on.
Hope you all will join us!
September 11, 2006 at 8:41 pm
Alright guys, contact me here:
eyes.heart.truth@hotmail.com
I really hope to hear from everyone I mentioned. I will post here that I have received your email and pick a “word” made up from letters in your email address. You’ll have to verify it for me on this blog.
Again, example:
You email with the address j.q.public@service.com and obviously use the moniker you have here. I will contact you here and ask you specifically if this “word” can be found in your email address. If we verify this, I’ll contact you via your email address.
Make sense?
September 11, 2006 at 8:44 pm
Sorry, meant to say that if your email address was “j.q.public@service.com” I’d post here and ask you if your email address contained a “word”, in this case, “pub”.
September 11, 2006 at 9:48 pm
Red Dawn, why don’t you mind you’re own business?
Big Jake and I are starting to connect and you start this thing to squeeze me out. Just because I made you mad a couple of times. That’s not fair. Where’s the rest of the crew at? I don’t see them hopping on trying to get some private thing going. Where’s Zealot. Haven’t heard a peep from him since I said I hated the Bills. Everyone hates the Bills, so I don’t know why that made him mad. He just wants me off, too, because he doesn’t like to hear the truth about himself. And DJ, shut up. Glasses for reading…now we know you’re an old man.
September 12, 2006 at 3:03 am
Big Jake–
I do believe I’ve received your email. Is the word “pal” in your email address? Let me know and also if you have received my email.
September 12, 2006 at 3:15 am
curious–I AM minding my own business by not allowing your disruptions into further conversations that we’d like to share. If you’ve noticed, everyone wanted out when you continued to post and you really ruined it for everyone. Nobody has any desire to pander to someone who wants to make his posts, not about articulate matters, but about their own hang ups.
I have developed quite a bit of affection for these other people and would like to continue without your snide comments or your rather less than sublime observations. I’m being kind there, so take it for what it is.
September 12, 2006 at 3:19 am
Red Dawn:
“pal”is my middle name.
September 12, 2006 at 3:26 am
Thank you! I’m good with that. Be back at the other….
September 12, 2006 at 3:34 am
Americanwoman–
Still waiting on you to contact me at eyes.heart.truth@hotmail.com
And all those that I mentioned.
September 12, 2006 at 12:44 pm
visit http://mylinkpedia.com/myfav.php?mode=&mw=search&pa=aXJhbiArZmFyc2kgK3BlcnNpYW4=&pa2=1&pa3=0
to find links about iran
September 12, 2006 at 2:55 pm
Re: Red Dawn #390, my info is inbound to you.
Curious # 385. So I need reading glasses. Why does that make me “old?” “Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.” I’ll always be a child at heart. Just a mature one. You on the other hand insist on stirring up discord. You would be the one to have to go stand in the hall for disrupting the class. Making jokes with your comments? Not that I can see. Simply hurtful barbs meant to get a similar response from the ones you tried to hurt to garner the attention your tortured soul craves. Please follow Big Jake’s advice and seek help. No one on this site wishes you ill. We wish you a happy life and the chance to fulfill your dreams and desires. We simply do not appreciate your style of commentary. But, hey, that’s what America was founded on. Freedom of speech, expression, beliefs, etc. When some of the others responded to you they were excercising their rights, too. It is a “two-way street.” If you don’t like it, you are free to leave. The fact that a lot of us are wishing to start a private forum should be a message to you to do some soul searching and self analyzing. Like the saying goes, “Do unto to others as you would have done unto you.” WWJD?
September 12, 2006 at 4:27 pm
DJ–
I believe I received your email. So I’ll ask, do you work for the state of Texas?
Let me know and I’ll be back with you on the other.
BTW guys, I had a blast getting to know “Big Jake” better through private emails. We “talked” last night for quite awhile! I look forward to doing the same with the rest of you.
I am getting ready to set up the forum and believe Big Jake and I have a good name for it. So email me!
September 12, 2006 at 4:47 pm
Red Dawn –
I’m in.
September 12, 2006 at 6:18 pm
Americanwoman–
I believe I’ve received your email so here’s the word verification:
“eve”
September 12, 2006 at 7:17 pm
Hi Red Dawn and all the others I feel I know.
I hae never commented on here before, because there were so many undesirables, (especially one) that I was nervous about it.
I love reading all the information from Big Jake,
DJ, Eagle, American Woman, and of course, you.
I would like to be part of your private forum, so
if you will allow me to, my email is ksipko@verizon.net
I understand if you hesitate to do this, and there will be no hard feelings.
I will miss you all, and thank you for all of your wonderful commentaries.
September 12, 2006 at 7:42 pm
Everyone!!! I just did something really stupid and I will be changing my email address tonight when I get home!!
September 12, 2006 at 8:43 pm
Red Dawn – that would be me.
Sispan – change your email address ASAP and then follow Red Dawn’s instructions on how to participate in the new venture.
September 12, 2006 at 8:44 pm
Re: Red Dawn # 393; Yes, I work for the state of Texas.
Re: Sipsan # 396; ooops! “See” ya on the new site.
September 12, 2006 at 10:36 pm
Zealot, Lovesamerica, if you’re monitoring … get another email address (and make it anonymous so there’s no name in it) that you can drop if this doesn’t work out. That way, there’s little to no vulnerability on your part. Believe me, I was worried about it. You don’t have to give any personal info … follow Red Dawn’s instructions. You can even monitor the new site before responding. I feel like you two are the “real” deal and I think I speak for all when I say we’d like to continue the correspondence.
Amir … so, what can you tell us about you?
September 13, 2006 at 1:14 am
Amir, I went out to the site and it didn’t say much. What would you like us to glean from it?
September 13, 2006 at 1:29 am
An Open Letter to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
September 6, 2006
Mr. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, President of the Islamic Republic of Iran,
Please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Joel Richardson. Actually this is not my real name, but rather a pen name that I use when engaging in interfaith dialogue with Muslims—a labor of love which has occupied me for the past several years. The reason that I use this pen name is because I have been issued some very specific Islamic death threats after a Muslim that I was dialoguing with converted to Christianity. The e-mail that I received essentially threatened that my head would be cut off and that my family would be killed. Since those days, I have continued to dialogue with Muslims in a spirit of peace and love, although I now have chosen to use this pen name. As such, I ask for your forgiveness for not fully revealing myself to you. I would very much like to do so. Nevertheless, it is my sincere hope that if this letter should miraculously find its way into your hands that you would consider what this little American Christian of no account would like to express to you.
It was with a certain measure of amazement that I read the news that you would be visiting my country next week to address the United Nation General Assembly. Indeed you have surprised the world on more than one occasion over the past several months since your recent election as President of the Islamic Republic of Iran. Many people all over the world have read your open letter to George W. Bush, the President of the United States and invited him to convert to Islam. Many of us also watched as you were interviewed by Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes. As for myself, I have been closely following your brief career as the President of Iran. I have watched as you have made some very bold and at times some very threatening statements. I have also closely followed your many open declarations about the soon emergence of your Messiah figure, Imam al-Mahdi. And of course, most have closely watched as your nation continues its apparent rush toward the acquiring of nuclear capabilities.
As a Christian and an American, I write to you not only to express some of my concerns, but also to ask you some questions—if you would allow me the privilege to do so.
I am greatly concerned of course for the future relationship between our two countries; the U.S. and Iran. I am most concerned of course for the future of my children—their safety and their well-being. But I am also greatly concerned for the millions of lives of common people that also may be at risk in these seemingly tense times—Iranian, Israeli, American and European—Muslim, Christian and Jewish.
Mr. President, in your letter to President Bush, you said this:
“I have no doubt that telling lies is reprehensible in any culture, and you do not like to be lied to.”
Of course, while much of the world has never heard of the doctrines of Kithman or al-Taqiyya, as a Shi’a Muslim, you are most certainly aware of these terms, are you not? Certainly you are aware of the words of Imam Jafar Sadiq, the sixth Imam of Shi’a Islam who clearly disagrees with you about the reprehensibility of lying. In fact, he even states that Allah will dishonor anyone who tells the truth about certain elements of Islam:
“One who exposes something from our religion is like one who intentionally kills us.”
“You belong to a religion that whosoever conceals it, Allah will honor him and whosoever reveals it, Allah will disgrace him.”
I have also read from A Shi’a Enclopedia a specific definition of al-Taqiyya:
“The word ‘al-Taqiyya’ literally means: ‘Concealing or disguising one’s beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or strategies at a time of imminent danger, whether now or later in time, to save oneself from physical and/or mental injury.’ A one-word translation would be ‘Dissimulation’”.
So Mr. President, my first question to you would be the following: Would I be wrong to believe the words of your Imam and the words of your scholars by understanding that Shi’a Muslims are commanded to purposefully hide what they truly believe in order to mislead others as to the true nature of their religion, their “beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or strategies”? As a Christian I am immediately reminded of the words of Jesus who told his followers never to hide their religion:
You are the light of the world. A city on a hill cannot be hidden. Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven. Matthew 5:14-16
Mr. President, to the vast majority of the people of the world, religion and deceit are simply not compatible concepts. Basic human intuition exposes such as completely contrary to the divine nature. God does not lie, nor does he ask his followers to lie or hide the truth. In short Mr. President, how could any religion that claims to emanate from God—who is pure light and truth—ever actually command and promote deception toward non-believers and outsiders?
And even more importantly, Mr. President; you are a Shi’a Muslim. In light of the doctrines of Kithman and al-Taqiyya, how can anyone not question the truthfulness of anything that you say to those of us outside of the Shi’a faith? How do the people and the leaders of the world not know that you are simply utilizing al-Taqiyya in an attempt to deceive us?
Mr. President, despite the fact that your nation essentially sits atop an endless supply of oil, how is it that you expect intelligent people to believe you when you claim that your only motivation to achieve nuclear capabilities is for energy? In light of the millions of lives that may potentially be at risk due to a potential nuclear exchange, wouldn’t the leaders of the world be utterly foolish to accept anything you say regarding your nuclear program? And wouldn’t their foolishness be multiplied by the fact that you regularly seem to make outlandish comments such as your recent statement at the “World without Zionism Conference”:
“They say, ‘how could we have a world without America and Zionism?’ But you know well that this slogan and goal can be achieved and can definitely be realized.”
Mr. President, certainly you must realize how such comments will be viewed by the rest of the world.
Mr. President, I would like to be as frank and as honest with you as I can. What thoughts come to your mind when you think about such men as Adolph Hitler, or Saddam Hussein? History has judged these men as both pawns of the devil and failures, but a far worse judgment awaits both of these men when they face their Creator. Surely you would not desire to be found in the company of such men on the Day of Judgment?
Mr. President, I read your invitation issued just today calling the people of the West to Islam. You also said that anyone who declines such an invitation would have a bad future. Mr. President, I would like to now also invite you to become a Christian—a follower of Jesus. I would also like to explain to you why I must decline your invitation to Islam and why you should accept my invitation.
Mr. President, if you would allow me, I would like to tell you a story. You are obviously a very influential Muslim leader. For the sake of this story, let us say that we have two other great and legendary Muslim leaders: Caliph Omar and also Salah’ ad-Din (Saladin). These two men are among the most legendary and admired leaders throughout Muslim history. Now imagine if I claimed that both of these great leaders played with little girls’ dolls. Initially any self-respecting Muslim would be infuriated at such an allegation. “Never!” it would be protested; “Far be it from Omar or Saladin that they should play with little girls’ dolls! These are great men! It is not befitting that Omar or Saladin to say that they would play with dolls!”
Initially this might sound quite reasonable. But what if the story unfolded that both Omar and Saladin had a daughter? And what if we learned that these daughters were most pleased with their Daddy when he got down on the floor and played with them as they played with their little dolls? What if we learned that because of the father’s great love for their daughters, that they humbled themselves and did this with their beautiful little daughters on a regular basis? Would these men be better leaders and better men for doing this or would they be less respectable men and poorer leaders? Surely, Mr. President, you would agree that this humble act would make them better men and greater leaders?
Now, what if we learned that Saladin played with his daughters while Omar absolutely refused to do so? What if Omar agreed with the statement above that he was far above ever doing such a thing? Which leader would then be a greater leader? Which would be more appealing? Omar or Saladin? Personally I would see Saladin as being a far better Daddy, a far better man, and thus a far better leader. I’m sure you would agree. As such Saladin would be a better and more admirable leader, while Omar would be a less qualified leader. Remember, Mr. President; true greatness does not need to be guarded. It does not need to be belabored in order to be authentic. True greatness is self-evident and self-preserving.
Your religion claims that God would never become a man, regardless of the reason.
“Far be it from God that He should have a son! It is not befitting of the Almighty that He should do such a thing!” Sura 19:35
But in this attempt to establish Allah as greater, he has simply become more distant. Is not Allah like Omar in the story above? The Christian belief of God, however, is that He is more like unto Saladin, the loving father in the story above. Because God is good in the purest sense, He desires to share Himself with us. He wants to reveal himself to us. He doesn’t merely want us to have abstract knowledge about Him—He wants us to actually know Him. Jesus revealed the man-befriending-God to us. Jesus said:
“I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” John 14:6,7
Mr. President, your religion also refers to Jesus as “The Word of God”. Let me ask you, can a person’s words be separated from him? Or are a person’s words invariably part of him? This is an analogy that God wanted us to understand when we think about the relationship of the Son to the Father. Both the terms, the Son and the Word, are very similar in the sense that each proceeds forth from the Father. The Son bears the very essence of the Father while the Word is the inner expression of a person. “Out of the heart, the mouth speaks.” So again affirming both the Son’s divinity as well as the fact that all things were created by Him, John the Apostle says that,
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men.” John 1:1-4
When we compare the Islamic concept of God to the Christian concept on this point, the Christian concept is far more intellectually and emotionally appealing. The incarnation (God dwelling among men through the person of Jesus) as utterly astounding as it is, is also the most awe-inspiring and incredible idea that one could ever conceive. In fact it is Islam’s denial of the incarnation that makes it so utterly unappealing. In Christian theology, God says to each individual, “I love you this much, and here is how I have proven it forever.” God became a man and suffered in our place for our deliverance.
Mr. President, throughout history, the Christian Church has affirmed the following:
We believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Creator of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:
Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into hades.
The third day He arose again from the dead.
He ascended into heaven
and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty,
whence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.
According to this ancient Christian Creed, Mr. President, when you stand before the Judge of the Earth, His name will be Jesus Christ. On that day there will be no excuse for denying that He indeed has come, was crucified, buried and has risen from the dead. Of course, I’m quite sure that you do not accept this. But Mr. President, have you ever considered the fact that every one of Jesus’ disciples, except possibly John, dedicated and eventually gave their very lives as martyrs while preaching the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus—the very Christian Gospel message? Mr. President, what logical answer is there as to why the disciples would give their lives for a complete lie? Unless the disciples were wholly confident of the fact that Jesus was crucified and resurrected, why would they dedicate the remainder of their lives preaching such a lie? Muslims deny the historicity of the crucifixion and resurrection, but they are unable to answer some of the basic questions that explain why the disciples—the very eyewitnesses—would have lived and died as if it were absolutely true. There are many theories among Muslim scholars as to what may have happened. But none can agree. For regarding the crucifixion, burial and resurrection of Christ, in light of the abundant historical evidence attesting such, the Muslim scholars have only conjecture to follow (Surah 4:157-8). Among the various theories offered, some Muslim Scholars teach that God tricked or deceived the disciples.
Mr. President, did Allah deceive Jesus’ followers? Does this make any sense to you? If Jesus’ disciples were preaching a lie, then would you agree that Jesus was the biggest failure of all of the prophets? For if Jesus’ true message was not carried on by a single one of his disciples, if after he ascended to heaven, all his disciples were deceived, then indeed, Jesus was the greatest failure of all prophets. Yet even Islam claims that Jesus is second only to Muhammad in terms of the greatest prophets.
Mr. President, the Islamic worldview, when compared to the simple facts of history, simply does not make sense. Jesus—the historical facts surrounding His life and the life of His disciples—is the thorn in the side of Islam, not its vindicator, as we would expect if indeed Islam were only a continuation of the religion that Jesus preached. Islam is not a continuation of the true religion that was declared by the true prophets of God, but something new altogether. Mr. President, I call on you to turn away from religious innovations and to turn to the Truth.
Mr. President, I have heard much of your repeated eschatological references to the soon emergence of Imam al-Mahdi, the one who you refer to as the “last repository, the promised one, that perfect and pure human being, the one that will fill this world with justice and peace.” I have also studied the Islamic traditions about al-Mahdi in great depth. As you have stated to your people, “Today, we should define our economic, cultural and political policies based on the policy of Imam Mahdi’s return.” I also noticed in your letter to President Bush that you accept the idea that Jesus will also return to the earth. Those of us who are familiar with Islamic eschatology understand that Muslims believe that Jesus will return as a subordinate to the Mahdi. We have seen the Islamic traditions that have spoken of the day when Imam Mahdi, with the assistance of Jesus will unite the Muslim Ummah, attack and defeat the Jewish nation and ultimately cause the entire world to submit to Islam. We have read the opinions of your scholars that the rule of your Imam will only be established with great bloodshed. In Ayatollah Ibrahim Amini’s work on the subject of Mahdism for instance: Al-Imam Al-Mahdi: The Just Leader of Humanity, we read of those who refuse to convert to Islam and submit to the Mahdi’s leadership over the earth:
This group will indisputably be opposed to justice and will never give up their stubborn antagonism against any power. Such people will do anything against the promised Mahdi to protect their vested interests. Moreover, they will do anything within their power to demoralize and combat those who support the Imam (Mahdi). To crush the negative influence of this group there is no other solution except warfare and bloodshed.
And again, we read that:
The Mahdi will offer the religion of Islam to the Jews and Christians; if they accept it they will be spared, otherwise they will be killed.
Mr. President, thinking people around the world will certainly ask; if Islam is such a true and wonderful religion, why then is it necessary to resort to jihad, force and bloodshed to spread among mankind? If God truly wanted Islam to spread, would he not simply cause it to do so through peaceful means? Or is he unable to do so Himself? In this, do we not see the difference between God and Satan. Does God not offer His truth to mankind according to their own choice and free will? Does not God’s ultimate judgment of each person hinge on their own response to His invitation? But historically it is always oppressive and tyrannical regimes that enforce their ideologies onto the people. Can you see how your religious worldview regarding the eventual triumph of Islam does not reflect the manner in which God offers His mercy to mankind? Can you see how your worldview and expectations of the coming new world under al-Mahdi instead reflect the pattern of other various failed regimes of the past, having been exposed by the very people that they once controlled as being destructive and oppressive to the human spirit? In appealing to all of mankind, Jesus Christ once said,
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. (Matthew 11:28)
Again, if Islam were a true and naturally appealing religion to mankind, then why do we find such a radically different call to accept Islam from your prophet with the words:
“Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that ye hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, ye know not.” Surah 2:216
Mr. President, why would anyone long for the day when all of mankind will openly be subjugated to a religion that openly calls for warfare despite mankind’s natural hatred for such? Should not the true religion be something which the very collective soul of mankind bears witness to and affirms rather than something which your Quran admits is “hateful” to mankind? You seem to be a very brave man; will you search your heart and ask the Lord if indeed he has truly called on his followers to carry out that which is hateful to mankind or if the above quoted verse from your prophet finds it’s inspiration not from God but instead from another source altogether? Will you consider harnessing your bravery and choose to turn toward the truth, which is found only in the freedom that Christ offers and not in Islamic Jihad and the forceful spread of totalitarian religious ideologies? Most importantly, Mr. President, will you reconsider the direction that you are presently leading the Iranian people? Will you choose to lead the Iranian people away from Islamic Jihad and instead to the One whose burden is light—the one who calls those who are weary and burdened and promises genuine rest for their souls? Or will you choose to continue following a dark path and continue to lead the Iranian people toward that which is not only “hateful” to them but also destructive to their lives and their souls? As a humble Christian and a citizens of the Eternal Kingdom of God, I appeal to you to change the path that you are presently leading the Iranian people down and instead to choose the righteous way (John 14:6), whatever the consequences may be. I appeal to you to leave behind the road of Jihad and of Islam and to become a follower of Jesus and a genuine peacemaker. For in doing so, Jesus said that you would be called a Child of God. (Matthew 5)
With Love in Christ,
Joel Richardson
September 13, 2006 at 11:51 am
Dear Joel
I have come as a sister in Christ to offer you comfort, prayer and blessings. I ask you to join me in my fervent prayer. Jesus asked us to pray for our enemies and I understood him to mean that we should pray for their salvation. We are not fighting men, but principalities. They will be defeated by God’s spirit.
May God bless you indeed.
September 13, 2006 at 12:11 pm
Principalities, Powers, World Rulers of Darkness, and Spiritual Wickedness in Spiritual Warfare
A special note: The purpose of this teaching is that we may begin to understand the goodness of God as opposed to the evilness of the devil. These two parameters are often blurred and confused, whereby evil is wrongfully attributed to God, the Father of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Understanding the goodness of God is first and foremost in spiritual warfare, in order to build the kind of faith that will move mountains and fulfill God’s promise of victory in our lives.
What are “Principalities, Powers, World Rulers of Darkness, and Spiritual Wickedness in High Places”?
The Apostle Paul tells us to put on our spiritual armour because our battle in this world is a “spiritual” one. A warfare that is against the trickery and power of the devil, as opposed to a human battle. Even though human beings will certainly play a role in this spiritual warfare, they are being used by these entities for the purposes of accomplishing evil. Evil spirits are the true power behind such people. We read,
Eph 6:12: For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the world-rulers of this darkness, against the spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
Our Spiritual Warfare is Against “Principalities”
The concept of principalities is understood by the Greek word arche meaning chief or ruler. These principalities are ruling devil spirits possessing executive authority or governmental rule in the world. As we will see, this ruling power usually involves a particular nation, people or race. There are evil angels ruling the kingdoms of the world that oppose the truth of God, and of which Satan is the chief prince or ruler, of both the world system and its organization of demons, as noted in the gospel of Matthew.
In Matthew 12:24 the devil is called “Beelzebub” meaning lord of the dwelling, in which these wicked spirits are subject to and operate under Satan’s dominion. They, like their chief prince, direct, control, rule and carry out the present darkness of this world.
The American Heritage Dictionary defines principalities as:
1. A territory ruled by a prince or from which a prince derives his title.
2. The position, authority, or jurisdiction of a prince; sovereignty.
The idea of prince devil spirits ruling or controlling a region is supported in the Old Testament book of Daniel, chapter 10. Daniel is visited by an angel in response to his prayer to God. This angel, who was sent by God to answer Daniel’s prayer, was delayed for 21 days because of a battle that took place between God’s angel and “a prince of the kingdom of Persia.” Daniel reveals the angel’s message in the following verses:
Dan 10:12-13
“Then said he [the angel] unto me, Fear not, Daniel: for from the first day that thou didst set thine heart to understand, and to chasten [humble] thyself before thy God, thy words were heard, and I am come for thy words. But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia.”
The spiritual battle, for this angel, was of such magnitude that Michael, the archangel of God and designated prince of Israel, assisted the angel in battle. Another enemy of God, the prince of Greece, is also mentioned in the verses below.
Dan 10:20-21
“Then said he [the angel], Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grecia shall come. But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.”
The book of Daniel gives us an excellent example of how these unseen spiritual entities fight to increase and maintain their realms of influence and control in order to hinder God’s purposes. In addition, as previously stated, these princes are named after the nations or rather their principalities in which they rule.
It is Satan’s purpose to deceive these nations and to keep them from obtaining a knowledge of God’s truth and salvation through His Son Jesus Christ. In the book of Revelation, chapter 20, Satan is depicted as a deceiver of nations. The Greek word for deceive is planaho, and according to Strong’s Greek Dictionary, this word means to “cause to roam from safety, truth or virtue, go astray, seduce, wander, and to be out of the way.”
Satan’s major success, in deceiving a nation, is due to a lack of discernment on the part of the people. The people are blind to the invisible forces of supernatural evil that are operating and influencing their visible human agents of political, social, religious and philosophical programs. Satan’s greatest victory would be to convince the world that he just doesn’t exist. However, God signifies the devil as the author of sin, sickness and death, and warns us to be alert and vigilant because the devil, as a roaring lion roams about seeking whom he may devour (1 Pet. 5:8).
Therefore, we conclude that our wrestling involves principalities or peoples or regions under the influence and deception of Satan.
Our Spiritual Warfare is Against “Powers and World Rulers of Darkness”
The Greek word for “powers” is exousia which means derived or conferred authority, the warrant or right to do something, or delegated influences of control. Although the word “powers” is left unclear as to Paul’s precise meaning in the verse, this expression is used elsewhere in scripture to infer the powers that be in authority. In keeping with the context of this verse, this would include all high-ranking, evil supernatural powers and the power of sin and evil in operation in the world. The fruits of this type of evil can probably be seen in drug cartels, gross poverty, plagues, terrorism, and other heinous crimes against humanity, even toward the animal kingdom.
Some Christian authors associate “world rulers” with magic and demonic pagan gods such as the Ephesians’ Artemis and seems to be in line with the pagan culture of ancient times, in which temples were dedicated to these pagan deities.
Our Spiritual Warfare is Against “Spiritual Wickedness in Heavenly Places”
The Greek word for wickedness is ponēria and means depravity and particularly in the sense of malice and mischief, plots, sins, and iniquity (Strong’s Gk. Dict.).
Malice [A. H. Dict.] is defined as:
1. A desire to harm others or to see others suffer; extreme ill will or spite.
2. Law — The intent, without just cause or reason, to commit a wrongful act that will result in harm to another.
Satan is also depicted as the prince of the power of the air
Since Satan is the prince of the power of the air, these wicked spirits, in high places, are often understood to be the collective organization of all of Satan’s devil spirits. These malevolent spirits work evil and mischief and operate in our atmosphere. They operate as close to the very air we breathe, and reach to realms beyond. All kinds of spiritual filth is propagated , in these realms, for the purpose of humanity’s deception and subsequent destruction. Prior to becoming a Christian we too walked according to the prince of the power of the air.
Eph 2:2-3
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
1Jo 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. (This verse will be treated in a separate post)
As Christians we are delivered from the power of the prince of the air, and from the sinful nature that once ruled our path in life. When we received God’s Holy Spirit, at the moment of our conversion to Christ, we were translated from the kingdom of darkness to the kingdom of God’s light in which we now have God in Christ in us. We are continually delivered and empowered by God as we walk according to His Word and Spirit that He has given us. As we do this, we take our seat in the heavenlies with Christ, for scripture reads,
Eph 2:5-7
Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
Jesus is also called a Prince, He is called the Prince of Peace and of Life (Isa. 9:6 and Acts 3:15) Whose kingdom plays no part in this present world system of darkness. Prior to His arrest, Jesus said to His disciples,
Joh 14:30
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
Joh 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Please note: Jesus is not speaking against the Jews, for Jesus and His followers were Jewish. He is speaking against the hypocritical religious authorities who would have Jesus killed versus lose their sphere of control over the people of God, in which their own belly was their god.
The details of God’s plan, His provision of escape from Satan’s kingdom of darkness through faith in Christ, was kept a mystery from the beginning of time. It wasn’t until the revelation of the Son of God on earth, and His complete victory in His death and resurrection for the salvation of humanity, that the mystery of salvation through Christ is revealed to us. The Apostle Paul states,
1Co 2:7-10: “But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory. Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.”
In other words, if God’s enemies knew that the Lord’s death would bring the Kingdom of God and His power into the hearts of every believer, with His gift of Holy Spirit, and thus bring God’s light into the world, they would not have crucified Him.
Who is your prince?
For the Christian, Jesus Christ is our Prince of Peace and Life and we will reign with Him forevermore.
(orig. post 8/18)
More to come . . .
*Click on the links below if you would like more information on:
What is Salvation and How Do We Know if We Are Saved?
Discerning the difference between the good and false shepherds
The 3 promises of God for abiding in Christ
David’s witness ” O taste and see that the Lord is good”
**Click on the links below if you would like to read more on Spiritual Warfare:
Why the World, the Flesh, and the Devil in Spiritual Warfare?
The Battlefield of the Mind (Part I) Prepare Your Heart for War
Battlefield of the Mind II – Spiritual Armor of God in Spiritual Warfare
send to a friend
About Me
Name: Magdalene
Location: New York, United States
A Christian, servant of Christ & lifetime Bible student. The Kingdom of God is within every believer, and true Christianity is not about being religious or legalistic, but it is to believe in God’s love, Word and power. To walk in His love and power is to live by faith.
Pulling down strongholds with the truth of God’s Word, the power of the holy spirit, and in the operation of faith in our spiritual warfare with the world, flesh, and devil!
http://www.battleinchrist.com
September 13, 2006 at 8:51 pm
Psalms 63:9 But those [that] seek my soul, to destroy [it], shall go into the lower parts of the earth.
Psalms 63:10 They shall fall by the sword: they shall be a portion for foxes.
September 13, 2006 at 8:56 pm
Psalms 63:6 When I remember thee upon my bed, [and] meditate on thee in the [night] watches.
Psalms 63:7 Because thou hast been my help, therefore in the shadow of thy wings will I rejoice.
Psalms 63:8 My soul followeth hard after thee: thy right hand upholdeth me.
Psalms 63:9 But those [that] seek my soul, to destroy [it], shall go into the lower parts of the earth.
Psalms 63:10 They shall fall by the sword: they shall be a portion for foxes.
Psalms 63:11 But the king shall rejoice in God; every one that sweareth by him shall glory: but the mouth of them that speak lies shall be stopped.
September 13, 2006 at 9:15 pm
Hey Buddy…this is great.
Thanks
September 13, 2006 at 9:15 pm
Sipsan and Hepzibah–
If you guys are interested in joining us on the new private board, please email me here and I will tell you where to go.
eyes.heart.truth@hotmail.com
Calling on zealot! Calling on lovesamerica. Hope you guys check back in! We miss you guys; and I’m speaking for Americanwoman, DJ, and Big Jake.
September 14, 2006 at 3:37 am
Just checking something out, sorry
September 14, 2006 at 3:39 am
So, “zealot”, have you decided to address us with upper case “Zealot”? Just curious.
Let me try something else…
September 14, 2006 at 3:41 am
This is Red Dawn. Just wanted to see if I could post as Americanwoman using my registered email address.
If this posts, I know I obviously can. See above.
September 14, 2006 at 3:43 am
Ok guys, I’m over to the other forum and out of here for good. Nothing is protected here. See you there.
September 15, 2006 at 7:00 pm
Zealot ,viber,lovesamerica and Eagle
Please check in .
September 15, 2006 at 9:31 pm
Big Jake: Got your message. It meant a lot. I enjoyed all the friendships, and I miss the exchange. I’m just little hesitant about doing this again. Not that I don’t trust Red Dawn. She’s great. I think I told too much about myself too soon and it didn’t work out very well for me. I’ve got a big mouth, too, and I need to work on that. But I’ll still check in here. I consider you a friend and I learn a lot from your posts. Take care, I’ll keep in touch.
September 15, 2006 at 11:16 pm
zealot:
Good to hear from you again! I will continue to post on this board also. I know you had a difficult time with a certain party on this board ,as we all did.
I know it was aggravating, but I don’t understand your reaction.
“I think I told too much about myself too soon and it didn’t work out very well for me. I’ve got a big mouth, too, and I need to work on that”.
What difference does it make? This is an annoymous board. As long as you do not compromise your id(personal identification,credit card account #’s,personal address, telephone etc.)there should be no problem. If an obnoxious poster makes personal attacks we should contact Quay Fortuna and have him banned from posting.
Anyway , I will continue contributing and as always ,little brother ,it is great to hear from you.
Big Jake
September 15, 2006 at 11:42 pm
zealot–
If this is truly you, we so miss you! Please join us on the other site. We really miss you.
eyes.heart.truth@hotmail.com
You’ll have to check in there and we’ll verify back here.
We can exchange info there, unlike here, on a more personal level. It is safe there.
September 16, 2006 at 1:15 am
This is truly me. Big Jake: I know I’m anonymous. It just seems that my initial resonse to the guy was what got him started. And the more he knew about me, the more he was fueled. All I meant was I should think before I write. I didn’t like my personal life being talked about, and had I not revealed certain things, it wouldn’t have been.
On another note, I really enjoyed the scriptures you posted about spiritual warfare. I must’ve had the “caps” on when I typed because Red Dawn was questioning it. Sorry. I’m not the best typer in the world, either.
What do you think about Pres. Bush not getting his law passed concerning interrogating terrorists?
I have a lot to do this weekend, but if I’m able to, I’m going to watch Frequency. A friend of mine had Field of Dreams and he loaned it to me, so if anything, I’ll watch that again. Just trying to start fresh again. I never did thank lovesamerica for all the nice qualities she attributes to me. American woman said something once that it probably boosted my ego. Stuff like that always makes you feel good, so lovesamerica, thank you. I’m sipping a beer so, “here’s to you”. Here’s to all of you!! You’re great internet friends. No faces, don’t have a clue what any of you are really all about, but I like you all anyway.
September 16, 2006 at 6:29 pm
Hey Z,
Your response didn’t get Curious started. It was probably Viber’s posts. He obviously has issues with Jews or those who support them. He has an issue with you becaue you’re Fire Dept. He doesn’t like lovesamerica because she, being the smart girl she is, is looking for a guy like you. Come on over to the new forum!
September 16, 2006 at 7:33 pm
Americanwoman: I think I will. I want to say what I think and feel and let the chips fall.
Had a tough week and saw some sad things. Messed me up a little bit, but I’m getting back to normal. Whatever that is.
Talk to all of you soon.
September 16, 2006 at 9:38 pm
zealot:
re “What do you think about Pres. Bush not getting his law passed concerning interrogating terrorists?”
We can’t go on following the “Marquis of Queensberry Rules” while the terrorists run rampant.
I heard today that the prisoners were not to be subjected to “humiliation”. They were to have their own private individual toilets.
My post #213
“I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is strange that we are putting the Haditha 8 on trial for their lives and kow-towing to political correctness while these monsters are running wild”.
September 17, 2006 at 2:44 pm
Do not go gentle into that good night
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Dylan Thomas
September 17, 2006 at 3:19 pm
zealot–
Let us cheer you up my friend.We’re here for you and still waiting for you on our forum.
And my brother-in-Christ, I want to share some words that have always given me great comfort.
” Blessed be the God and Father
of our Lord Jesus Christ,
the Father of mercies
and God of all comfort
Who comforts us in all our tribulation,
that we may be able to comfort those
who are in trouble,
with the comfort with which
we ourselves are comforted by God.”
2 Corinthians 1:3-4
And this:
“Anxiety in the heart of a man
causes depression,
But a good word makes it glad!”
Proverbs 12:25
This has ALWAYS given me great comfort because I am so completely imperfect and screw up a lot:
” The steps of a good man
are ordered by the Lord,
And He delights in his way.
Though he fall, he shall not be
utterly cast down;
For the Lord upholds him with His hand.”
This last one absolutely applies to me now as I have gone/ am going through some very difficult circumstances:
” The Lord is near to those who
have a broken heart,
And saves such as have a contrite spirit.”
Psalm 34:18
Hope you all have a good day! I’m off to football and am NOT going to think about how completely ironic it is that all the muslims are outraged because the pope said parts of the Quran were evil as it advocated violence and the muslims, upon hearing this, go and prove the truth of this statement by behaving violently.
September 17, 2006 at 4:16 pm
Bravo, Red Dawn post # 422 closing comment. Why aren’t we hearing more commentaries about that FACT. We christians just brush off insults and move on. What makes their religion so special that insults and parodies are unacceptable? Tolerance, moderation, understanding of other religions: totally alien concepts to the brainwashed muslim extremist.
The moderate muslims are, in some cases, denouncing their violent brethren, but the world’s media moguls refuse to make it front page news. Plus, I’m fairly certain, that a lot of moderate muslims are afraid they’ll get blown up/killed as apostates.
Amd we have our own “famous folks” like Rosie O’Donnell saying that extremist christians are no worse than extremist muslims. So what!? We admit this in our history books when we explain the purpose and intent of the crusades. But that was then, this is now! The muslims WANT to bury the hatchet… between our eyes!
We have got to stop the politcal correctness ham-stringing that’s preventing us from taking this battle to the level it needs to be fought. As mentioned above, these vermin DO NOT play by any rules. How many of our troops captured/killed by the muslims extremists were treated respectfully and humanely ACCORDING TO THE TERMS OF THE GENEVA CONVENTION by their captors? NONE!!! Our troops were brutally TORTURED, MURDERED and their bodies DESECRATED by the enemy. Where has the outcry been the greatest? In America. Where has the cheering been the greatest? Three guesses and the first two don’t count.
My Dad always liked to say, “You don’t bite the hand that feeds you.” Well, I’m tired of the people that we have set free and protect to this day being the ungreatful wretches that they are. It’s time to take off the kid gloves and kick some muslim extremist buttocks. If we kill or injure any civilians in the execution of our missions, oh, well. We’ll say, “Sorry” and move on to the next target. Maybe the civilians will get the message after the first few attacks that we will not differentiate between neighborhoods and where the animals that we are after are hiding.
I swear, if I hear one more IDIOT cry foul and insist that we should take the moral high ground in the treatment of these extremists I think I’ll hurl. High ground is only useful in a ground war. Moral high ground simply places us in a position from which to fall. We need to be seen as the meanest, toughest SOBs on the planet that will kick your butt, then help you find the way to a better life. That’s what we did with the Germans and the Japanese. So far they been fairly mature with the assistance we gave them after WW II. Yeah, there’s still the UN vote nonsense, but, hey, who in the UN is on our side?
No, Big Jake. I will not go gently into that night. You can bet I’ll be clawing, kicking, and screaming all the way! What’s scary is between my screams all I hear are crickets. There are too few and far between of us that have a clue as to what is going on around us.
September 18, 2006 at 1:26 am
DJ–
There may be few and far between us that have a clue as to what is going on around us, but at least we are aware and most of us willing to fight for what we believe in.
And I do not think Big Jake was advocating in that poem to “go gently into the night”.
What I read was “Fight, Fight, Fight!”
September 18, 2006 at 3:05 am
Bravo DJ & Red Dawn -I had to post that poem in reference to the sad state of affairs that currently presents itself.
If a Christian with the Pope’s bona fides can not comment without provoking such a reaction ,how can there ever be a dialogue between the two religions.
I personally do not believe that an exchange of ideas or a religious discussion is what the Muslims are interested in.
VATICAN CITY (AFP) – A wave of protest from Muslims across the globe descended on the Vatican as the Islamic world denounced comments by Pope Benedict XVI linking Islam with violence.
In Germany, however, Chancellor Angela Merkel came to Benedict’s defence saying: “Those who criticize the pope misunderstand the intention of his speech, which was to call for dialogue between the religions.
“The pope clearly took a stand in favour of dialogue, which I personally support and consider necessary and urgent. What Benedict XVI was expressing was his absolute rejection without compromise of any use of violence in the name of religion.”
Most Muslims did not see things the same way.
In Gaza City, four small home-made bombs exploded near the oldest Christian church, although there were no casualties, and Palestinian prime minister Ismail Haniya slammed the pope’s comments saying: “These remarks go against the truth and touch the heart of our faith.
“The pope should revise his comments and stop attacking Islam, which is the religion of more than 1.5 billion people in the world,” he said after the main weekly Muslim prayers in a Gaza mosque.
In a complex speech in the German city of Regensburg on Tuesday, the German-born head of more than one billion Roman Catholics implicitly denounced links between Islam and violence particularly in regard to jihad, or “holy war”.
Quoting a 14th-century Byzantine emperor on Prophet Mohammed, founder of the Muslim faith, the pope said: “He said, I quote, ‘Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.’”
The pope’s official spokesman said later Benedict respected Islam but rejected violence motivated by religion. The explanation, however, failed to quell Muslims’ fury.
The Pakistani parliament unanimously passed a resolution demanding the pope “retract his remarks in the interest of harmony between religions.
“The derogatory remarks of the pope about the philosophy of jihad and Prophet Mohammed have injured sentiments across the Muslim world and pose the danger of spreading acrimony among the religions,” the resolution said.
The comments also stirred anger in India where the chairman of the National Commission for Minorities, Hamid Ansari, said: “The language used by the pope sounds like that of his 12th century counterpart who ordered the crusades.”
The head of the Islamic Society of North America made the same parallel.
“If we want to sit down and compare the history of violence committed in the name of the Catholic Church and violence committed in the name of Islam, that would take a long time,” Ingrid Mattson said.
“We have 500 years of inquisition, the counter-reformation, the crusades… All religions have been used for violence. None has been excluded, including Judaism,” she continued.
The Muslim Brotherhood, the leading opposition force in the Egyptian parliament, said the pope’s speech was more serious than the cartoons depicting the Prophet Mohammed whose publication in European newspapers caused outrage among many Muslims earlier this year.
“I foresee an extreme reaction to the pope’s words, which harm Islam more than the cartoons because they come from a leader who represents millions of people and not just from a journalist,” said a senior official of the group, Abdel Moneim Abul Futuh.
The pope’s speech also caused anger in Turkey, the destination of his next foreign trip in November.
The head of Turkey’s state-run religious affairs directorate, Ali Bardakoglu, described the remarks as “full of enmity and grudge” and said he should not come to Turkey.
In Iran, a top hardline cleric, Ahmad Khatami, said: “It is a pity that the leader of the world’s Christians is so uninformed about Islam and speaks so rudely.”
A powerful Sunni cleric in Iraq urged the government to expel the Vatican’s representative over the comments.
And in Britain the Ramadan Foundation compared the pope unfavourably to his predecessor John Paul II.
“The late pope John Paul II spent over 25 years to build bridges and links with the Muslim community. He showed the world that its perception of Islam was false and that we are peace-loving people,” it said.
In contrast, the British Catholic Church explained that the pope’s comments were trying to reinforce his message that the world must learn from its past mistakes and learn to live with respect for each others’ identity.
“Benedict has made clear … that Christianity as he sees it is based on love for all humanity, whatever religion,” the church said.
September 18, 2006 at 3:54 am
• Pope Benedict XVI, Islam and ‘Holy War
Much of the Regensburg address was a meditation on faith and reason, the roots of religiously inspired violence and the need for believers to see God as a figure of love. Roughly put, his argument was this: to Benedict, Islam’s conception of God so stresses God’s will that God can be understood to command the irrational——————————–
For the pope, the Christian encounter with the classical world married faith and reason and thereby precluded, in principle, such misunderstandings of the nature of the God of Abraham, a nature that is, according to this argument, rooted in love and reason, not the will to dominance. Seen in such a light, “jihad,” which means “struggle,” can too easily be taken literally (as a call to violence against others) rather than figuratively (as many Muslim scholars argue it should be).
In the stormy aftermath of the address—on Saturday two churches in the West Bank were bombed—the Vatican argued that the real point of the lecture was to be found in this sentence: “A reason which is deaf to the divine and which relegates religion into the realm of subcultures,” Benedict said, “is incapable of entering into the dialogue of cultures.” In a post-Regensburg statement, Paul Cardinal Poupard, president of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue, said, “Readers will find that this central theme is far more important than the introductory citation of the Emperor Manuel II …”
Then why did Benedict quote the emperor in the first place? The most likely answer is that, no matter what the Vatican says now, the pope believes in having what the Catholic theologian and papal biographer George Weigel calls “a hard-headed conversation” about the role of faith in the life of the world. “He knew exactly what he was doing,” says Weigel. “He is saying that irrational violence is displeasing to God. The question Benedict is putting on the table is: ‘Does a significant part of Islam have the capacity to be self-critical?’ ”
Finding a way for the children of Abraham to live together in something approaching peace a perennial challenge, and Benedict understands that. “We must seek paths of reconciliation and learn to live with respect for each other’s identity,” he told a Muslim audience in Cologne last year. There was no such language at Regensburg. He did say Manuel II’s words were “startlingly brusque,” and made certain the audience understood he was reading a quotation, but the pope must have known his words would carry. And by speaking of jihad without alluding to Christianity’s dark history of violence in the name of God—the Crusades, forced conversions, pogroms, the Inquisition—Benedict seemed to be denouncing Islam while failing to acknowledge that any religion, including his own, can be manipulated and perverted to evil ends. “It is very hard to construe the pope’s remarks in a benign way,” says William A. Graham, the dean of the Harvard Divinity School. “Historically, there is no more basis for arguing that Islam is irrational than there is for arguing the same about Christianity or Judaism. In all three you can find tremendous discussion about revelation and reason, and there are people in all three who have landed outside the rational. Islam has bloody borders right now, but Christianity has certainly been bloody, as has Judaism in its more extreme forms.”
Two years before he became pope, Benedict published a book entitled “Truth and Tolerance,” in which he wrote that “religion demands the making of distinctions, distinctions between different forms of religion and distinctions within a religion itself, so as to find the way to its higher points.” One of the pities of Regensburg is that he made no such distinctions about Islam.
Is the ideology of hate that fuels Al Qaeda and its fellow travelers evil? Yes, it is, and too few Muslim leaders have spoken out against it in compelling and memorable terms. An Islamic reformation in which the young are educated to understand faith through critical thinking would, one hopes, push the forces of violence ever farther to the margins. History offers some consolation. “Islam spread far more thoroughly by proselytizing than by the sword,” says Graham. And the tradition most ruthlessly excluded in the first few centuries of the faith was one devoted to extreme violence, the Kharijites.
Going forward, the pope could usefully consult the words of another powerful Christian leader: “And given that Islam and Christianity worship the one God, Creator of heaven and earth, there is ample room for agreement and cooperation between them,” the leader said three months after September 11. “A clash ensues only when Islam or Christianity is misconstrued or manipulated for political or ideological ends.” The leader? John Paul II.
With Edward Pentin in Rome
Update: Pope Benedict XVI said Sunday that he was “deeply sorry” about the angry reaction to his recent remarks about Islam, which he said came from a text that didn’t reflect his personal opinion. “These [words] were in fact a quotation from a medieval text which do not in any way express my personal thought,” Benedict told pilgrims at his summer palace of Castel Gandolfo, outside Rome, according to a report by The Associated Press.
© 2006 Newsweek
September 18, 2006 at 2:13 pm
Re: The Pope’s comments. It doesn’t matter what is said, when it is said, or where it is said by whomever. ANYTHING remotely negative is taken out of context by the muslim extremists to fan the embers of discontent, thus trying to ignite a war against the infidels. They WANT to fight. They WANT to die. They WANT to bring about the new messiah. What they NEED is some education.
Something I mentioned in a previous post. The average Arab is uneducated and has little knowledge/experience with which to compare what he/she hears from their leaders, religious or otherwise. Like sheep, they are easily led down the path that is desired by their “shepherd.” But, as I also said, education is something that the leaders fear, so they do their best to limit the flock’s exposure to the outside world.
On another subject: My wife made an excellent suggestion when we last spoke. We need to insist that the Geneva Convention meet to develop guidelines as to how to deal with terrorists. The fact that the terrorists have no central affiliation with a country, government, flag, formal military, uniform, etc, needs to be addressed. If the entire world objects to our treatment of the terrorist
detainees to obtain viable counter-terrorist information, then the entire world should participate in the forum and establish the protocols to deal with such matters.
However, instead of giving them rights as criminals, we should establish an “open season” on their kind that would make their form of protest extremely unpleasant and hazardous to their health. I say hunt them down relentlessly and kill them like the mad dogs that they are, no matter what nationality, religion, or race.
And to the media: do not print stories of the terrorists’ atrocities or events. Treat them as the spoiled brats that they are: do not give them ANY recognition for their behavior. In the media the saying goes, “If it bleeds, it leads.” Fine, use that to OUR advantage. ANY terrorist killed will be on the FRONT PAGE with a note to their comrades, “This, too, will happen to you if you continue to follow your leadership. Lay down your weapons, surrender, and denounce violence against innocent civilians.”
To our governing parties: stop the bickering and political posturing! You are only showing the terrorists that we are divided, thus unfocused in our objective to achieve the goal of eliminating extremist islamic terrorists from influence and power. We don’t need to be “Fortress America,” but we DO need to tighten up on who comes in and for how long. We DO need the monitoring programs to watch suspects THAT ARE NOT AMERICAN CITIZENS, THEREFORE THAT HAVE NO RIGHTS to protect those of us that ARE citizens. We DO need to stop ignoring the “500 lb gorilla in the living room” and start putting the blame on the ISLAMIC EXTREMISTS and screen ANYONE of middle-eastern heritage until they say, “Hey! we’ve had enough of being blamed by the bad element in our culture” and clean up their own “back yard.”
To the muslims: act civilized and you will be treated accordingly. It’s time to join the 21st century. That behavior includes accepting that others around you will have other faiths and beliefs (or none at all), that whatever power and glory your culture had in the past IS PAST, and that you will be judged on your present actions, good and bad. How we perceive and relate to you is how you present yourselves. If you insist on remaining firmly entrenched in a by-gone era, you will be bypassed by the world. Like it or not, we now live in a world run by a market economy. Your religious leaders realize this and are frantically trying to hold back the tide. They will fail. Just as in our country, there will be “pockets of resistance” that will isolate themselves from reality. That is their right. If you need an oppressive doctrine to keep in line, then I feel sorry for you that you will never know the joys of a “free” life. Please try to help your brethren see the error of their ways. Violence is a poor solution for any disagreement, however, when one refuses to see that he/she is in error, then there are times when violence is the only option. So, with that in mind, as we say here in America, “The ball is in your court.” That means, do something about your extremist brethren, make it public and loud, make it heard around the world, and be truthful about it.
September 23, 2006 at 10:39 am
“There comes a time..
“…when all the cosmic tumblers
have clicked into place…
“…and the universe
opens itself up for a few seconds…
“…to show you what’s possible.”
September 24, 2006 at 3:51 am
Big Jake: I’m trying to get on to your new forum, and for the life of me, I can’t do it. The page keeps coming up that it cannot displayed………would you please tell me how I can correct this problem..I really miss all your comentaries..you’re all so smart.
Thanks
September 24, 2006 at 4:54 pm
angel:
contact the coordinator Red Dawn
emailto:eyes.heart.truth@hotmail.com
Glad to have you aboard!
September 24, 2006 at 5:17 pm
6/27/2005 Clip No. 753
Coptic Priest Zakariya Boutrus Demands to Strike Out Verses from the Koran and Demands an Official Apology from Muslim Governments to Christians
The following are excerpts from an interview with Coptic priest Zakariya Boutrus which aired on June 27, 2005 on Al-Hayat TV.
Boutrus: I live in a country (the US) that respects freedom of speech. I exercise my freedom of speech and talk, and no one can deny my free will. Gone are the days of the sharp sword that cut off the tongues of our people and forefathers to prevent them from speaking in the Coptic language. Gone are the days people’s heads would be chopped off if they did not convert to Islam.
Interviewer: What should the Muslims do to make you stop saying these things?
Boutrus: My demands involve ten important issues. Let’s call it ten demands. The first demand… They are not for my sake, but for the sake of truth, belief, and Jesus.
First, striking out all the Koranic verses that deny the divinity of Jesus and the revelation of God in him.
Second, acknowledging that Jesus is the spirit and word of God, as they truly believe, without hiding this fact.
Third, striking out the Koranic verses and Hadiths that incite to kill Christians, like in the Al-Tawba chapter, v.29: “Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in Judgment Day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His messenger have prohibited, nor do they follow the religion of truth” – that is, Islam. Among whom? “Among the People of the Book.”
Interviewer: Who are…
Boutrus: The Christians and Jews. “Until they pay the Jizya poll tax in submission.” This is murder.
Number four, striking out the Koranic verses and Hadiths that incite to terrorism and oppression in all their forms.
Interviewer: What do you mean by terrorism and oppression?
Boutrus: Terrorism – “Urge the believers to fight,” and the Hadith: “I was commanded to fight people until they say: ‘There is no God but Allah’.” All this is terrorism and murder.
Number six: Stopping the attack on Jesus and the Holy Book in mosques and in all the media.
Number seven: Giving people and Muslims the freedom of… You may ask what do I care about the Muslims? No! They must have the freedom to choose their religion and the freedom to express their belief.
Number eight: To abolish the punishment for apostasy, to stop torturing people who convert to Christianity, and to stop imprisoning or even killing them.
Number nine: Formal apologies must be made by leaders throughout the Arab world for the murder of Christians in countries invaded by Islam.
Number ten: Leaders throughout the Arab world should make formal apologies for the insults directed against our faith throughout Islamic history.
The viewers may say, “Is this priest crazy, or what? These demands could only be made by an insane man… To strike out Koranic verses… Does this make any sense? What is he going on about?” OK, if you cannot change (the Koran), why are you asking us to change our beliefs? Why do you demand that we say what you say, or else – the sword?
(Al-Halabi) says: “If the Prophet wanted an available woman…” – in other words, an unmarried woman, a widow, or a single woman – “…he was allowed to enter her…” I don’t like to use the word i-n-t-e-r-c-o-u-r-s-e. “…without her guardian and without witnesses…” Without witnesses. “…and against her will.” Against her will. “If he desired a married woman, her husband had to divorce her for him. And if he desired a servant-girl, her master had to give her to him. He can even marry off the woman to whoever he wants, against her will.”
Interviewer: We know that the Prophet is allowed what others are not.
Boutrus: Why? Is he made of different stuff than the rest of mankind?
September 24, 2006 at 5:59 pm
Now I’ve heard everything ! Can you believe this baloney being force-fed on arab media?
4/15/2005 Clip No. 647
Sheik Ibrahim Mudeiris in a PA Friday Sermon: Muslim Prisoners Are Forced to Convert to Christianity in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Palestine
The following are excerpts from the Friday sermon in Gaze by Sheik Ibrahim Mudeiris that aired on Palestinian Authority TV on April 15, 2005
Mudeiris: Muslims prisoners are subject to force conversion to Christianity. They are forced to abandon their faith today, as in the past. Muslim prisoners are forced to curse Muhammad. They are forced to curse the religion of Allah. They are forced to curse God. Haven’t you heard about our prisoners in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and throughout the world… They are oppressed and incarcerated, and then they are offered conversion to Christianity. This is an old-new policy of heresy. Abdallah bin Huzafa Al-Sahmi, categorically refused. The emperor said to him: “We will put you in boiling oil.” He said: “I don’t care.” He was shown two Muslims who had been placed him in boiling oil until their flesh came off their bones. But the emperor’s deeds were not as bad as those of his successors, who preach freedom and democracy in this era. By Allah, what this emperor did, when he put the Muslims in boiling oil, is a thousand times better than what their soldiers are doing today to our wives and daughters in Iraq, Palestine, Guantanamo, and Abu Ghureib.
September 24, 2006 at 9:00 pm
Zealot:
JETS 28-20 OVER Bills Ouch!
September 24, 2006 at 10:42 pm
I know!!! I was thinking about you when I was watching the game. Wondering if you were watching it, too. I thought the Bills had it in the bag in the begining. The bums let me down again! I’m even starting to ask myself why I stick with them. But I’m a die hard. They need at least one loyal fan don’t you think????
September 24, 2006 at 11:29 pm
Zealot:
I know how you feel. I’ve lived and died with the Jets for 38 years. I remember one Jets-Bills game in 1973 that O.J.ran for over 100 yards and single handedly “murdered” the entire team.
September 27, 2006 at 2:18 am
“Republic. I like the sound of the word. It means people can live free, talk free. Go or come, buy or sell, be drunk or sober, however they choose. Some words give ya a feeling. Republic is one of those words that makes me tight in the throat. The same tightness a man gets when his baby takes his first step, or his first baby shaves, makes his first sound like a man. Some words can give ya a feeling that makes your heart warm. Republic is one of those words.”
John Wayne -as Davy Crockett in The Alamo
September 27, 2006 at 12:31 pm
I know what you mean. My daughter made her “first adult sound” yesterday. She disagreed with something she read in a teen magazine and wrote in to the publisher to complain about it. What a girl!
September 29, 2006 at 4:47 am
read post #404 and prepare for battle. This is not a drill. Repeat -This is not a drill!
What about Time Travel?
From: http://www.stargods.org/TimeTravel.htm
The way one “time travels” is through the hyper space which is called the forth dimension. This is the frequency range of the demons and their habitation. Breaking the dimension barrier is easy and has been broken. Teleporting also involves going through the hyper space of the 4th dimension. Again you are forced to enter the abode of the demons and fallen angels. There many doctors that will tell you of seeing strange entities from being around electromagnetic scanning and imaging. Apparently the electromagnetic field can punch a hole through to the 4th dimension.
Us humans can only see light and we can only see 10% of all the matter in the universe with our eyes. The rest is “dark matter” which emits NO light frequencies. Therefore demons and the kingdom of Satan are invisible to us.
More and more we are hearing about Quantum Physics and the possibility of time travel. The reason you are seeing more information come out and more time travel documentaries is because the veil that separates us from the spirits will be torn down after the rapture. It will be a time when the unseen kingdom of satan, and the kingdom of man will merge and become one empire under Lucifer. People do not have a clue as to what is coming! Even most Christians remain willfully ignorant.
The governing fallen angels do not need their subjects going into a deep culture shock when the spiritual curtain comes down. For the first time the invisible will become visible! So in order to condition and prepare the public, it has to come forward into the conscience mind of man first. Magazines produce articles while TV pumps out the usual talk shows and documentaries.
In ancient times the fallen angels gave man secret knowledge in exchange for worship and human sacrifices. Now it is done in private through secret societies of Satan. When the antichrist system comes, the masses of people will be given hidden technology to improve their lives in exchange for advanced knowledge and technology. What is done in secret today will be done in the open soon. When the Beast comes he will not tempt mankind to to worship him, he will demand it! He will enforce a mark on all mankind and those that do not receive it will be tortured and executed.
In the end the fallen will use teleportation to come into our world and the human elite into theirs. Soon the curtain that divides our world and the world of the demons will be pulled wide open for the kingdom of Satan to become all powerfull
September 29, 2006 at 2:03 pm
Big Jake…….You are freaking me out! I am a christian and I do believe in demons but I never have heard anything like this before!! It gives me chills…I sure don’t want any of these evil beings hanging around me! Where did you get this information? It’s interesting, and part of me wants to read more about it, but tapping into that world really creeps me out. It attracts me for some reason, but at the same time it scares me. I don’t want them coming after me!! I just don’t want to be home alone some time and start imagining these spirits will toy with me. I DO BELIEVE IN GHOSTS…I DO BELEIVE IN GHOSTS!!!
September 30, 2006 at 5:11 am
Angel,
It gives me the creeps ,too. The Devil mimics and is envious of our relationship with God. Satan wants to be worshiped as a god. This leads to the danger to us of demonic possession.
Go to my post #293 . I believe that all Christians should affirmatively give their heart to Jesus Christ.
Don’t forget to put on the Armor of God for protection and in preparation for the battle with evil forces.
http://www.faithflashes.com/armor2.html
On Sunday April 24th 1994, Pope John Paul II recommended this prayer be used by all Catholics as a prayer for the Church when he said:
‘”May prayer strengthen us for the spiritual battle we are told about in the Letter to the Ephesians: ‘Draw strength from the Lord and from His mighty power’ (Ephesians 6:10). The Book of Revelation refers to this same battle, recalling before our eyes the image of St. Michael the Archangel (Revelation 12:7). Pope Leo XIII certainly had a very vivid recollection of this scene when, at the end of the last century, he introduced a special prayer to St. Michael throughout the Church. Although this prayer is no longer recited at the end of Mass, I ask everyone not to forget it and to recite it to obtain help in the battle against forces of darkness and against the spirit of this world.”‘
Saint Michael the Archangel,
defend us in battle.
Be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil.
May God rebuke him, we humbly pray;
and do Thou, O Prince of the Heavenly Host -
by the Divine Power of God -
cast into hell, satan and all the evil spirits,
who roam throughout the world seeking the ruin of souls.
Amen.
The Spirit of Babylon
Chuck Pierce, another friend and internationally trusted prophet connected our desperate condition to the war in Iraq: “the spirit of Babylon is slapping us around.” Iraq is modern day Babylon. Babylon means “confusion,” which is obviously one of the results of this spiritual war. America’s armies had no problem taking out Saddam’s physical army, but we are now dealing with an ancient principality, the spirit of Babylon, which cannot be defeated with natural weapons and strategies. This spirit is currently, though I believe it not be permanently, prevailing against us. As previously stated, the symptoms of confusion and disarray can be seen in the church, on our president and in the nation in general.
A further result of all this on our president is political disfavor. He has one of the most unfavorable performance ratings of any president in history, ranking down with Nixon during Watergate.
September 30, 2006 at 11:20 am
I gave my heart to Jesus over 30 years ago. I find it hard to believe that since the Holy Spirit dwells in me, that anything “unholy” could take up residence inside of me…”this leads to the danger to us of demon possession”. I believe satan is a very real foe, but I also believe he only has as much power as you personally give him. I do fear the spirit world, mainly because of Hollywood and all the freaky and weird movies I’ve seen over the years. (I’ll give you a little hint, tho. Years ago while watching one of those demon possessed movies, something went wrong with the sound for a few minutes. The picture was still on, but no sound. The movie didn’t seem that scary. We adjusted the VCR and fixed the sound, and rewound the film…the SOUND,(the MUSIC) along WITH the picture is what made the movie so scary!!) Anyway, I don’t think I could ever become possessed, but I do think the devil could scare me to death with his antics. Do you agree? If so, tell me where I’m wrong.
September 30, 2006 at 11:23 am
Big Jake…me again..forgot something..I was interested where you got your information about the electromagnetic field punching a hole into the 4th dimension.
A while ago you suggested the movie Frequency to another person. Do you agree with that movie? That that actually happens?
October 1, 2006 at 1:25 am
Angel: you are protected from Satan by being Baptized and Confirmed. You have accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour and you have rejected Satan, all his works and empty promises. You have become a Temple of the Holy Spirit . If the Holy Spirit dwells within you, no demon spirit can.
By giving your heart to Jesus you further reaffirm your love for him.
A hymn from my childhood comes to mind:
Soul of my saviour, sanctify my breast,
body of Christ, be thou my saving guest,
blood of my saviour, bathe me in thy tide,
wash me with water flowing from thy side.
Strength and protection may thy passion be,
0 blessed Jesus, hear and answer me;
deep in thy wounds, Lord, hide and shelter me,
so shall I never, never part from thee.
Guard and defend me from the foe malign,
in death’s dread moments make me only thine;
call me and bid me come to thee on high
where I may praise thee with thy saints for ay.
Latin, 14th Century Translation
Regarding Frequency, solar flares affected the electromagnetic fields surrounding the earth and disrupted radio transmissions in such a way that a son was able to contact his father who had died 30 years before. Whether it actually can happen ,I don’t know. But theoretically , time travel is possible according to Albert Einstein and Carl Sagan.
Sagan on Time Travel
Carl Sagan, the astronomer, Pulitzer Prize-winning author, and legendary popularizer of science, gave this interview during the making of “Time Travel.” True to form, he discusses arcane aspects of the field—from how you define time to what it might look like inside a wormhole—with flair and a refreshing dash of humor. Sagan was David Duncan Professor of Astronomy and Space Sciences and director of the Laboratory for Planetary Studies at Cornell University when he died in 1996.
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NOVA: Let’s start with the crux of the matter. What for you is time?
Sagan: Ever since St. Augustine, people have wrestled with this, and there are all sorts of things it isn’t. It isn’t a flow of something, because what does it flow past? We use time to measure flow. How could we use time to measure time? We are stuck in it, each of us time travels into the future, one year, every year. None of us to any significant precision does otherwise. If we could travel close to the speed of light, then we could travel further into the future in a given amount of time. It is one of those concepts that is profoundly resistant to a simple definition.
NOVA: Do you think that backwards time travel will ever be possible?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: Such questions are purely a matter of evidence, and if the evidence is inconsistent or insufficient, then we withhold judgment until there is better evidence. Right now we’re in one of those classic, wonderfully evocative moments in science when we don’t know, when there are those on both sides of the debate, and when what is at stake is very mystifying and very profound.
If we could travel into the past, it’s mind-boggling what would be possible. For one thing, history would become an experimental science, which it certainly isn’t today. The possible insights into our own past and nature and origins would be dazzling. For another, we would be facing the deep paradoxes of interfering with the scheme of causality that has led to our own time and ourselves. I have no idea whether it’s possible, but it’s certainly worth exploring.
NOVA: Would you like it to be possible?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: I have mixed feelings. The explorer and experimentalist in me would very much like it to be possible. But the idea that going into the past could wipe me out so that I would have never lived is somewhat disquieting.
NOVA: On that note, can you describe the “grandfather paradox?”
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: The grandfather paradox is a very simple, science-fiction-based apparent inconsistency at the very heart of the idea of time travel into the past. It’s very simply that you travel into the past and murder your own grandfather before he sires your mother or your father, and where does that then leave you? Do you instantly pop out of existence because you were never made? Or are you in a new causality scheme in which, since you are there you are there, and the events in the future leading to your adult life are now very different? The heart of the paradox is the apparent existence of you, the murderer of your own grandfather, when the very act of you murdering your own grandfather eliminates the possibility of you ever coming into existence.
Among the claimed solutions are that you can’t murder your grandfather. You shoot him, but at the critical moment he bends over to tie his shoelace, or the gun jams, or somehow nature contrives to prevent the act that interrupts the causality scheme leading to your own existence.
NOVA: Do you find it easy to believe the world might work that way—that is, self-consistently—or do you think it’s more likely that that there are parallel universes?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: It’s still somewhat of a heretical ideal to suggest that every interference with an event in the past leads to a fork, a branch in causality. You have two equally valid universes: one, the one that we all know and love, and the other, which is brought about by the act of time travel. I know the idea of the universe having to work out a self-consistent causality is appealing to a great many physicists, but I don’t find the argument for it so compelling. I think inconsistencies might very well be consistent with the universe.
NOVA: As a physicist, what do you make of Stephen Hawking’s chronological protection conjecture [which holds that the laws of physics disallow time machines]?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: There have been some toy experiments in which, at just the moment that the time machine is actuated, the universe conspires to blow it up, which has led Hawking and others to conclude that nature will contrive it so that time travel never in fact occurs. But no one actually knows that this is the case, and it cannot be known until we have a full theory of quantum gravity, which we do not seem to be on the verge of yet.
One of Hawking’s arguments in the conjecture is that we are not awash in thousands of time travelers from the future, and therefore time travel is impossible. This argument I find very dubious, and it reminds me very much of the argument that there cannot be intelligences elsewhere in space, because otherwise the Earth would be awash in aliens. I can think half a dozen ways in which we could not be awash in time travelers, and still time travel is possible.
NOVA: Such as?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: First of all, it might be that you can build a time machine to go into the future, but not into the past, and we don’t know about it because we haven’t yet invented that time machine. Secondly, it might be that time travel into the past is possible, but they haven’t gotten to our time yet, they’re very far in the future and the further back in time you go, the more expensive it is. Thirdly, maybe backward time travel is possible, but only up to the moment that time travel is invented. We haven’t invented it yet, so they can’t come to us. They can come to as far back as whatever it would be, say A.D. 2300, but not further back in time.
Then there’s the possibility that they’re here alright, but we don’t see them. They have perfect invisibility cloaks or something. If they have such highly developed technology, then why not? Then there’s the possibility that they’re here and we do see them, but we call them something else—UFOs or ghosts or hobgoblins or fairies or something like that. Finally, there’s the possibility that time travel is perfectly possible, but it requires a great advance in our technology, and human civilization will destroy itself before time travelers invent it.
I’m sure there are other possibilities as well, but if you just think of that range of possibilities, I don’t think the fact that we’re not obviously being visited by time travelers shows that time travel is impossible.
NOVA: How is the speed of light connected to time travel?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: A profound consequence of Einstein’s special theory of relativity is that no material object can travel as fast as light. It is forbidden. There is a commandment: Thou shalt not travel at the speed of light, and there’s nothing we can do to travel that fast.
The reason this is connected with time travel is because another consequence of special relativity is that time, as measured by the speeding space traveler, slows down compared to time as measured by a friend left home on Earth. This is sometimes described as the “twin paradox”: two identical twins, one of whom goes off on a voyage close to the speed of light, and the other one stays home. When the space-traveling twin returns home, he or she has aged only a little, while the twin who has remained at home has aged at the regular pace. So we have two identical twins who may be decades apart in age. Or maybe the traveling twin returns in the far future, if you go close enough to the speed of light, and everybody he knows, everybody he ever heard of has died, and it’s a very different civilization.
It’s an intriguing idea, and it underscores the fact that time travel into the indefinite future is consistent with the laws of nature. It’s only travel backwards in time that is the source of the debate and the tingling sensations that physicists and science-fiction readers delight in.
NOVA: In your novel Contact, your main character Eleanor Arroway travels through a wormhole. Can you describe a wormhole?
Hear Sagan via RealAudio
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Sagan: Let’s imagine that we live in a two-dimensional space. We wish to go from spot A to spot B. But A and B are so far apart that at the speed of light it would take much longer than a generational time or two to get there as measured back on world A. Instead, you have a kind of tunnel that goes through an otherwise inaccessible third dimension and connects A and B. You can go much faster through the tunnel, and so you get from A to B without covering the intervening space, which is somewhat mind-boggling but consistent with the laws of nature. And [the theoretical physicist] Kip Thorne found that if we imagine an indefinitely advanced technical civilization, such a wormhole is consistent with the laws of physics.
It’s very different from saying that we ourselves could construct such a wormhole. One of the basic ideas of how to do it is that there are fantastically minute wormholes that are forming and decaying all the time at the quantum level, and the idea is to grab one of those and keep it permanently open. Our high-energy particle accelerators don’t have enough energy to even detect the phenomenon at that scale, much less do anything like holding a wormhole open. But it did seem in principle possible, so I reconfigured the book so that Eleanor Arroway successfully makes it through the center of the galaxy via a wormhole.
NOVA: What do you think it would be like to travel through a wormhole?
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Sagan: Nobody really knows, but what Thorne has taught me is that say, for example, you were going through a wormhole from point A to point B. Suppose point B was in orbit around some bright star. The moment you were in the wormhole, near your point of origin A, you would see that star. And it would be very bright; it wouldn’t be a tiny point in the distance. On the other hand, if you look sideways, you would not see out of the wormhole, you would be in that fourth physical dimension. What the walls of the wormhole would be is deeply mysterious. And the possibility was also raised that if you looked backwards in the wormhole you would see the very place on world A that you had left. And that would be true even as you emerged out of the wormhole near the star B. You would see in space a kind of black sphere, in which would be an image of the place you had left on Earth, just floating in the blackness of space. Very Alice in Wonderland.
NOVA: Your inquiries about space travel for Contact sparked a whole new direction in research on time travel. How does that make you feel?
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Sagan: I find it marvellous, I mean literally marvellous, full of marvel, that this innocent inquiry in the context of writing a science-fiction novel has sparked a whole field of physics and dozens of scientific papers by some of the best physicists in the world. I’m so pleased to have played this catalytic role not just in fast spaceflight but in the idea of time travel.
NOVA: How do you feel being responsible for bringing time travel perhaps a step closer?
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Sagan: I don’t know that I’ve brought time travel a step closer. If anyone has it’s Kip Thorne. But maybe the joint effort of all those involved in this debate has at least increased the respectability of serious consideration of the possibility of time travel. As a youngster who was fascinated by the possibility of time travel in the science-fiction novels of H.G. Wells, Robert Heinlein, and others, to be in any way involved in the possible actualization of time travel—well, it just brings goose bumps. Of course we’re not really at that stage; we don’t know that time travel is even possible, and if it is, we certainly haven’t developed the time machine. But it’s a stunning fact that we have now reached a stage in our understanding of nature where this is even a bare possibility.
Sagan on Time Travel | Traveling Through Time
Timespeak | Think Like Einstein | Resources
Teacher’s Guide | Transcript | Site Map
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regarding electro-magnetic fields punching holes into the 4th dimension – here is the hyper link again
http://www.stargods.org/TimeTravel.htm
October 1, 2006 at 7:51 pm
Big Jake,
Why must one be baptized in order to receive Christ? My mother was nearly drowned by a travelling minister when she was nine. He held her under water at a pond on my grandparents’ property. I think the man was an evil bastard for keeping her under that water as her breath ran out. She never had my brothers or I baptized. I do not feel condemned.
October 1, 2006 at 11:33 pm
Americanwoman: I don’t want to get into any doctrinal battles here, but I will tell you what the Bible says concerning this, and it says that you DON’T have to be baptized or confirmed. When Christ was dieing on the cross the thief next to him asked him to remember him when he entered into His kingdom. Christ answered him by saying “TODAY thou shalt be with me in Paradise..” Luke 23:43 He didn’t say, after you get baptised and confirmed you will be with me. It isn’t Christ PLUS “anything” to be saved…it is Christ alone! He takes our sins upon himself and pays the price FOR us. We can either choose this FREE gift or reject it and pay our own sin debt ourselves. If we had to do ANYTHING, Christ wouldn’t have had to go to the cross and the gift wouldn’t be FREE. “For by GRACE are ye saved through FAITH; AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES: it is the GIFT of GOD.” Ephesians 2:8 KJV
October 2, 2006 at 12:40 am
Americanwoman:
I’ll try to answer your question. Even though you were not baptized by water ,I believe you were Baptized by “Desire”. Please read below for a complete explanation,
I’m sorry that your mother had such a traumatic experience at Baptism. Please be aware that this is not the norm in any Christian Church. I believe that the Baptists still use total immersion ,but in most Christian Churches The Baptism Rite is performed by pouring some Holy Water over the Infant’s head during the ceremony with the infant being held by the Godparents.
6.Why Is Baptism Necessary For The Salvation Of All Men?
Baptism is necessary for the salvation of all men because Christ said: “Unless a man is born through water and the spirit, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God.” (JOHN 3:5).
Baptism is absolutely necessary for salvation, and no one who has not been baptized can enter heaven. From the time of our Lord this has been the constant and unequivocal teaching of the Church. The reason lies in the fact that only Baptism can remit original sin, and no one with the taint of sin – original or mortal – can enter into heaven, God’s holy home.
This doctrine on the necessity of Baptism for salvation is complemented by the dogmatic teaching of the Church which is formulated as “Outside the Church there is no salvation.” Baptism is the ordinary means of belonging to the true Church.
Is Baptism Of Water The Only Kind Of Baptism?
“Baptism of water”- is the ordinary means of Baptism, but there are two extraordinary means by which the remission of sin and the attainment of eternal salvation are possible.
Those who through no fault of their own, have not received the sacrament of Baptism can be saved through what is called Baptism of Blood or Baptism of Desire.
Baptism of Desire:
An unbaptized person receives the Baptism of Desire when he loves God above all things and desires to do all that is necessary for his salvation.
If someone believes and loves God above all things, is sorry for his sins, and ardently longs for Baptism when it is impossible to receive it, he is said to have received the Baptism of Desire.
Jesus promised.that whoever loves him will be loved by the Father (JOHN 14:21). No one can be pleasing to the Father unless he be in the state of grace. Consequently, one who sincerely loves God and wishes to do everything pleasing to him, whether he be baptized by water or not, will receive pardon for his sins, and obtain entrance into heaven.
In the final analysis, Baptism of Desire is the way of charity or the love of God. And so, it is a way open only to those who have reached the use of reason, because only these are capable of making an act of charity. One of the most eloquent examples of this excellent form of charity which could be said to be a forerunner of the Baptism of Desire, is the case of St. Dismas, the good thief.
Parents, on the other hand, cannot make this Baptism of Desire on behalf of their infant children. Fr. Connolly gives the following explanation:
“No matter how much parents may desire Baptism for their children, they cannot obtain for them Baptism of Desire. That is, they cannot make an act of charity on the child’s behalf. If the parents’ desire is a real one they will obviously have the child baptized as soon as possible, doing it themselves in case of danger of death.
“By an act of love of God – and this act belongs to the supernatural order, and made under the influence of an actual grace – a person is necessarily sorry for past sins and has to wish to do all that God wants and commands should be done in order to be saved. And so, this person desires, implicitly or explicitly, to be baptized, since this is the ordinary way of salvation set down by God’s providence.”
The Second Vatican Council states this constant doctrine of the Church, which in no way contradicts the Church’s stand on true ecumenism:
“Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience-those too may achieve eternal salvation: Nor shall Divine Providence deny the assistance necessary for salvation to those who, without any fault of theirs, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God, and who, not without grace, strive to lead a good life.” (LG:16)
To summarize all that we have said so far, we can say that anyone who makes an act of love of God, and at the same time does not know, through no fault of his own (invincible ignorance), that Baptism is necessary for salvation, can be saved by Baptism of Desire.
Baptism of Blood:
An unbaptized person receives the Baptism of Blood when he suffers martyrdom for the faith.
Martyrdom means the patient acceptance of a violent death, or an assault, which, of its very nature is likely to lead to death, for the sake of Christ: defending some point of religion and teaching of Christ, giving witness to a particular Christian virtue, etc.
One who is unbaptized and loses his life for Christ or for some Christian virtue receives the Baptism of Blood. Our Lord promised: “He that shall lose his life for me, shall find it.” (MATTHEW 10:39).
The Holy Innocents of Bethlehem whom Herod slew out of his hatred for the Infant Jesus received the Baptism of Blood. The Church honors them with a feast on December 28. The case of the Holy Innocents is explained in the liturgy of the Mass of the feast with the following verse: that they died for Christ unknowingly, but still they gave testimony to the truth of our Faith, not by speaking but by dying (moriendo, non loquendo). From this we can also infer that the person who receives Baptism of Blood does not necessarily have to be an adult; not so with Baptism of Desire as we have seen earlier.
Obligation of Using the Ordinary Means of Baptism:
As the Baptism of Desire and Baptism of Blood are extraordinary means, they do not excuse from the obligation of making use of the ordinary means when available.
For this reason, one who has received that Baptism of Desire by an act of love or perfect contrition, is still bound to receive Baptism of Water if he is aware of it. In the same way, an unbaptized person being martyred for the Christian faith or some Christian virtue must be baptized by water if he survives.
October 2, 2006 at 12:50 am
Angel :
By the definition I just posted,Dismas ,the good thief, is a perfect example of “Baptism by Desire”.
But should he have survived , he should have been baptized by water as soon as possible.
October 2, 2006 at 1:29 am
ZEALOT :Bills 17-12 over Vikings BOOYAA!
Colts 31-28 over Jets BOOHOO!
October 2, 2006 at 9:08 am
Big Jake: Baptism is not to eliminate “original sin”. Original sin is a “church” teaching, not a “God” teaching. When Jesus was baptised, John didn’t pour a little bit of water over his head. He was IMMERSED. That immersion signified the Death, Burial and Resurrection he was about to go through and it wasn’t done because Jesus sinned, it was done as an example to His followers. Likewise, when we follow the example of Jesus Christ, and become baptised the same way HE did, we are identifying HIM as our Saviour and the ACT of Baptism signifies the Death of our old, sinful nature, (being laid in the water) the burying of our “OLD LIFE”, and the “raising up” to our NEW LIFE in Christ. Please read John Darby’s commentary, with which I personally agree: The Lord explains Himself. Two things were necessary-to be born of water, and of the Spirit. Water cleanses. And, spiritually, in his affections, heart, conscience, thoughts, actions, etc., man lives, and in practice is morally purified, through the application, by the power of the Spirit, of the word of God, which judges all things, and works in us livingly new thoughts and affections. This is the water; it is withal the death of the flesh. The true water which cleanses in a christian way came forth from the side of a dead Christ. He came by water and blood, in the power of cleansing and of expiation. He sanctifies the assembly by cleansing it through the washing of water by the word. “Ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.” It is therefore the mighty word of God which, since man must be born again in the principle and source of his moral being, judges, as being death, all that is of the flesh.
October 2, 2006 at 10:31 am
#448 Big Jake…my buddy and “older” bro… Yeahhhhhh! Go Bills!! Sorry about the Jets.
I still log on here but I haven’t been writing much. Miss you guys. I tried to get on the other forum, but couldn’t do it. Don’t know what’s wrong. But really, the truth is, I’ve been pretty busy in my spare time. Remember the girl I took to Niagra Falls? Well, I’ve been seeing her quite a bit. To say I’m attracted to her is an understatement. This girl is something else. She’s great looking, soft-spoken, kind. She’s a christian. We talk about everything. Sometimes for hours. I’ve never heard her swear and nothing seems to make her mad. She’s got really high values and she’s really smart. She’s nothing like anything I’ve come across before. She’s 29 and I’m 37. I could really fall for this girl and I hesitate because I can’t believe I could be this lucky twice. I look for things wrong with her and I can’t find anything. I don’t know what to think. I do know I think about her all the time and when I’m with her I don’t want to leave. I think she knows it too, but, she’s pretty cool about it. Just wondering, is your name really Jake? I probably shouldn’t do this, but I’m going to tell you my first name. It’s Zach. So, pray about me and this girl and say my name…just in case God doesn’t know who you’re taling about..HaHa..just kidding. Pray about Zach and Amy. She told me she doesn’t do anything before praying about it first. Hope this doesn’t sound like a corny blog. I’ve been pretty weird lately.
October 2, 2006 at 2:26 pm
Angel:
Please understand ,I am not a theologian.
My understanding of Christianity has been developed from my religious instruction,my independent reading,my life experiences, my meditation and my prayer life.
As a Roman Catholic my interpretation of the actual Baptism Rite may not be in congruance with that of other Christian denominations. There are basic Christian tenets common to all Christian denominations, the necessity of Baptism is one of them.
I believe that at the End TIMES there will be only one Christian Church encompassing ALL Christians. I believe that all Christians are my brothers and sisters in Christ.
As a Christian , I follow the tenets of the Christian Faith. It is more than a philosophy to me. If they tell me to eat Lima beans ,I will eat lima beans.
It pains me that there has been such inter-denominational bickering over the methodology
of worship. Our Lord was crucified and died for mankind and we Christians have crucified him again by our bickering throughout the ages.
Jesus said for us to “Love one another” . We haven’t done such a good job at it. We must do better.
I have posted here a definition of Original Sin. It is a Biblical concept. It’s interpretation is a Church teaching. Baptism signifies the rebirth through Christ Jesus
for us who were dead in sin and now live in Christ.
Original Sin, Imputation of Adam’s Sin
“Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned,” (Rom. 5:12).
Yet the fall is not simply a question of rational deduction. It is a point of divine revelation. It refers to what we call “original sin.” Original sin does not refer primarily to the first or original sin committed by Adam and Eve. Original sin refers to the results of the first sin – the corruption of the human race. Original sin refers to the fallen condition in which we are born.
“By this sin they fell from their original righteousness and communion with God, and so became dead in sin, and wholly defiled in all the parts and faculties of soul and body. They being the root of all mankind, the guilt of this sin was imputed, and the same death in sin, and corrupted nature, conveyed to all their posterity descending from them by ordinary generation. From this original corruption, whereby we are utterly indisposed, disabled, and made opposite to all good, and wholly inclined to all evil, do proceed all actual transgressions.”
The following message was delivered by John MacArthur Jr., of Grace Community Church in Panorama City, California. It was transcribed from the tape: GC 80-190, “Baptism: A Matter of Obedience.” A copy of the tape can be obtained by writing, Word of Grace, P.O. Box 4000, Panorama City, CA 91412 or by dialing toll free 1-800-55-GRACE.
I have also posted the following essay regarding Baptism by John MacArthur. Mr MacArthur, I believe gets a little extreme but does give an excellent explanation of Baptism in the different Christian denominations.
Baptism: A Matter of Obedience
by
John MacArthur
Copyright 1998
All Rights Reserved
I was flying across the country this week—a long flight—all the way to the east coast and the Lord always makes things serendipitous, always has a surprise or two; I was sitting next to a man who eventually took out a Bible and started reading it and as he was reading it, I said to him, “That’s a Bible you’ve got there.” He said, “It is,” and I said, “Do you understand what you’re reading?” I thought I’d just play Philip for a while. I said, “Do you understand what you’re reading?” and he said, “Well, some of it. I know one thing: that there are many ways to God.” I said, “Keep reading. You’re not done yet.” He said, “Well, It’s kind of hard to understand.” I said, “Well, would you like to be able to understand the Bible?” and he said, “I really want to be able to understand the Bible—I really do.” So, I took out my MacArthur Study Bible and I opened this thing and he said, “This has all the answers!” Anyway, I had the opportunity to expose him to the gospel and I’m going to send him one of those Bibles.
But, what a wonderful thing the Lord does in just kind of placing the right people in the right place at the right time and I’m always grateful for that. This is the right place and the right time for you, this morning, because I have a word from the Lord for you—it’s from the Scriptures and it’s on the subject of baptism. Now, as a faithful pastor, I am duty-bound to speak on this subject; if I don’t, I’d be unfaithful to the Lord who commands us to be baptized and if we are to be faithful under-shepherds, we have to bring the issue to the people. It’s been a number of years since I addressed the subject; it’s been—in fact—somewhere between 5 and 10 years since I’ve addressed this subject. I confess to a certain amount of unfaithfulness in that regard.
This is not something that we can overlook or pass by lightly. It is not a particularly popular subject today—it’s not of great interest in the evangelical community; it’s been years since I’ve seen any new book written on baptism or any book emphasizing baptism or any series of messages or any preacher or teacher emphasizing baptism. I never hear about it on the radio—I never hear about it on Christian radio, Christian television programs, I never see a baptism on Christian television programs, though you have a lot of services, you rarely, if ever, see a baptismal service. The interest in baptism has sort of gone away—sad to say, in many cases.
And, we have a largely unbaptized church which includes some of you. I don’t mean this church, I mean the church in general. It’s amazing how many people who proclaim Christ and confess Christ, have never been properly baptized. Now, probably the greatest number of people who call themselves Christians have never been baptized, according to New Testament baptism. It may well be that the majority of those who call themselves Christians have not been properly baptized. It’s not as if it’s not clear about what baptism is and how it is to be done—it is clear. It’s just that there has been a sort of an indifference to that very, very important matter. I would like to, if I can, put an end to that indifference this morning, if that, in fact, is the case.
There are, no doubt, many of you here this morning who have confessed Christ as Lord and Savior and believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead, but you’ve never been baptized. There are some of you, who maybe have never seen a baptismal service. We have one here every Sunday night, but you’re here in the morning and not at night and you may not have seen one or maybe only a few. May I be so bold as to suggest that a failure to be obedient in the matter of baptism, to take baptism seriously is at the root of some of the immense problems in people’s lives and in the church in general because it allows the church to fill up with people who are unfaithful to the simplest commands of the Lord and of His Word and that’s serious.
When Jesus said, “Go unto all the world and make disciples, baptizing them…,” He was giving a command to the apostles and to the church, saying: go out there, evangelize, make disciples, baptizing them, and teaching them to observe whatsoever things I have commanded you. The church then, is commissioned, in the great commission, to do the work of baptizing. It’s amazing to me, you see massive evangelistic crusades—these massive crowds of people, these huge crowds of people, and, supposedly, people coming to Christ—never do you see a baptism. Never is there a baptism at such events. And yet, on the day of Pentecost, three thousand people believed and three thousand people were baptized, when the church began. When the Holy Spirit spoke in Acts 2:38, speaking through Peter, “Repent and be baptized,” He gave a command there to the individual who repents and believes.
So, the church is commanded to baptize—the individual is commanded to be baptized. There is really no lack of clarity with regard to this. In fact, in each of the cases where the great commission is given, in Matthew, Mark, and Luke, there’s an emphasis on baptism. In spite of this, there is widespread noncompliance with what is a very simple command. In many ways, it’s sort of the easiest act of obedience as a Christian you can do because all the rest have to do with sorting out the stuff that’s in your mind and heart, for the most part. This simple act , when obediently done, demonstrates a heart that seeks to honor the Word of the Lord. When not done, it betrays several possible motivations.
A person who claims to be a Christian and has not been baptized, fits into the following categories.
1. One, ignorance—that is, they’ve never been taught about baptism and that’s very possible in many, many places. From time to time, we have people baptized here who were converted years ago but never were taught the significance of baptism. And, some have been taught wrong. They have been taught that if they were baptized or if they were immersed or christened as a baby, that’s sufficient. So, it’s possible that some people are unbaptized in the church because of ignorance.
2. Secondly, pride is an issue. People who have allowed a long period of time to go since their conversion—they’ve named the name of Christ for a long time, they are involved with the church, they are known as Christian people, they have never been baptized—it’s a little bit embarrassing to acknowledge that failure and that disobedience for such a long time and so they’re not willing to humble themselves, admit they’ve been disobedient, and be baptized. So, it could be ignorance, it could be pride.
3. It could be indifference. There are plenty of people who just can’t be bothered—they can’t find a spot in their daytimer for it, it doesn’t fit into their schedule, it’s not a priority. They know it’s commanded in the Bible, but obedience isn’t the main thing with them—they have other priorities. That’s a sad situation—to be apathetic toward a specific command, to be indifferent toward a very direct command from our Lord, Himself, which brings honor to Him and blessing to the one who is obedient. But, there are people who are just indifferent—they just can’t get around to it, “I’ve been planning to do it, I’ve thought about it; it just doesn’t fit on the priority list.”
4. And, then fourthly, could be the defiant people—those who basically aren’t baptized because they are just rebellious—they refuse to obey. Usually those kinds of people are sinning…they’re in a pattern of sin and it would just sort of elevate their hypocrisy if they were to have to come up and give a testimony of their faith in Jesus Christ and celebrate His wonderful redemption on their behalf. So, people who are defiant and rebellious and just won’t be baptized, generally are in a pattern of sinning.
5. Then, fifthly, it’s possible that you’re unregenerate—you’re just not a true Christian, you have no desire to make a public confession of faith in Jesus Christ because you don’t want to be identified with Him in a public way. You may come and you may like to kind of hang on the edges and on the fringes here, but you’re not about to take your public stand with Christ. Those are the only reasons I can think of. Either you’re ignorant, you’re too proud to humble yourself and be baptized, you’re apathetic and indifferent toward that matter of obedience, you’re defiant, or you’re not a believer. That puts the issue squarely where it belongs and it backs you, if you’ve never been baptized, sort of into a corner to sort that out. It could be a combination of several of those things in some cases, but you’re in there somewhere.
Now, I want to explain baptism to you and I want to see if I can’t motivate you to be obedient for the glory of the Lord and for your own blessing. I guess the best way to do this…somebody said this morning that I wasn’t in much of a preaching mode and that’s probably true…this is more of a teaching time, this is more of sort of sorting out the issues with regard to baptism in a way that is teaching you the principles and the truths, but I’ll try to yell occasionally just so you don’t feel cheated.
1. Question number one: What is baptism?
What are we talking about here when we talk about baptism? Simply, here’s a definition: it is a ceremony by which a person is immersed into water. That’s what it is. It’s a ceremony by which a person is immersed into water or “dunked,” they used to say, in fact, there were people who baptized this way were called “dunkers.” So, this is simply a ceremony by which people are immersed in water; that’s it. And, right behind me here and under the floor, there’s a pool of water where that is done every Sunday evening.
Now, we do this because it’s instructed in the New Testament—we’ve already commented on the fact that the Great Commission’s all tell us to baptize and Peter, in his sermon on the day of Pentecost, told those who heard and believed, to be baptized. Let me go to the Word so we give you an understanding of this. There are two Greek verbs that are used in the New Testament with regard to baptism—they are translated baptism”: bapto and baptizo—bapto is the less common, used only four times in the New Testament and it means “to dip into.” “To dip,” “to dip into,” in fact, it was used for “dyeing” when you immerse something in a dye. It’s the word “immerse’…bapto.
Baptizo is an intensified form of bapto—the Greeks had ways of sticking in a few extra letters and intensifying a word. Baptizo is used many, many times in the New Testament; many, many times. It means “to dip completely” and it’s the Greek word for “drowning’; that shows you how complete the dipping is, potentially. It’s the word “to submerse” or “immerse”—in fact, the Latin equivalent is immersio (sp.) or submersio (sp.). The noun “baptism”—baptismas—is used always in the book of Acts to refer to a Christian being immersed in water…it’s always used to refer to a Christian being immersed in water. So, that is what baptism is: it’s a ceremony by which a person believes the gospel and is then immersed into water.
In fact, the terms bapto and baptizo, the verb, and baptismas, the noun, could have been translated “immerse” and probably would have solved a lot of problems, but the translators chose to transliterate the Greek baptizo into “baptise.” They transliterated it rather than translate it because it had become such a technical term for “immersion.” So, they just transliterated it across, but that doesn’t change the meaning—it means “to immerse.”
In fact, the Greeks had a different word for “sprinkling” and that word rhantisanti is used of “sprinkling or splattering with water”—it’s a different word altogether. We’re not talking about “sprinkling”—there’s no such thing as a ceremony of sprinkling in the Bible, or pouring or any application of water to the individual. Whenever you find “baptism” in the Bible, it is the word “immerse” or “submerse” and it means “putting the person under the water.” Every New Testament use these terms, requires or permits the idea of immersion. This is so obvious that even John Calvin, who basically came down on the side of infant sprinkling or infant baptism, says this, he writes, “The word ‘baptize’ means ‘to immerse.’” No linguist can come up with anything else. Calvin says, “The word ‘baptize’ means ‘to immerse’; it is certain that immersion was the practice of the early church.” There really is no argument, there’s no debate at that point.
The verbs—bapto, baptizo—are never used in the passive. That is to say, water is never said to be baptized on someone such as sprinkling or pouring or touching with water which is done in a great, great portion of the church today. They sprinkle, they pour, or they dip and just touch the water to the forehead or to some other part of the head. Never are those verbs used in the passive sense of water being placed on someone. They’re always used in the sense of someone being placed in water. Whenever you read in the New Testament about a baptism—an actual occasion of baptism—immersion is the only possible meaning.
Matthew 3—look at it…or just listen to it—Matthew 3:6, John the Baptist, “They were being baptized by him in the Jordan River.” They were being baptized in the Jordan River. They came down into the river and they were baptized there. The river was not taken to them; they were taken to the river. Matthew 3:16, “After being baptized, Jesus,” having been baptized, “went up immediately,” literally, “out of the water.” Jesus went down into the water…came up out of the water. Again, that clearly indicates that He went down into the water in order that He might be placed into that water and that’s the use of the word baptism…means immersed in that water.
In John 3…when John the Baptist was doing this baptism, he picked a place at the Jordan River that was deep. It says in verse 23 of John 3, “John was baptizing in Anon, near Salem.” Of all the spots you could stop along the Jordan River, he picked that one because “there was much water there” which is simply another way of saying the water was deep. There was enough water there to get people under it—that was the whole point. In Mark, chapter 1, verse 5, same thing, “All the country of Judea was going out to him and all the people of Jerusalem, they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River”…”in the Jordan River.” You remember in Acts, chapter 8, when Philip came across the Ethiopian eunuch, you remember the statement in verse 36, “Look; water! What prevents me from being baptized,” verse 38, “he ordered the chariot to stop, they both went down into the water, and he immersed him.”
Now, that is what baptism is. That’s what baptizo means. Baptism is a ceremony by which a person is immersed into water. That is the only kind of baptism the New Testament knows anything about—it doesn’t know anything about sprinkling, pouring, touching with water, and particularly doesn’t know anything about baptizing infants. I’m going to address that issue because it is an important issue and some of you will remember I made a presentation of that at a past Ligoneer (sp.) conference—there is one here this week, by the way, and that was completely coincidental that, in my preaching schedule, that this issue came up at this time. Many of the people who will be at the conference, of course, would affirm the things that I am teaching. Next Sunday morning, I think, I may do it next Sunday—I may postpone it a week, I’m not sure yet—I want to address the issue of infant baptism from a biblical perspective. You’ll find a very, very fascinating discussion.
But, as far as the New Testament is concerned, there is no such thing as pouring, sprinkling, touching with water, or baptizing infants. It was an act by which an adult person was placed into water. It had great spiritual significance and the significance of baptism can only be depicted in immersion. The significance of baptism, the spiritual significance, can only be depicted in immersion—I’ll say more about that later.
Now, when you look at baptism in the New Testament, you’re going to come across some other baptisms that are not water baptisms—there are times when the word baptizo is dry. There are times when the word baptizo isn’t talking about water at all, but we use it that way. We talk about people going through a baptism of fire, right? We mean, by that, that he was immersed in a very difficult situation. John the Baptist talked about a baptism of fire in John, chapter 3. What he was talking about was the immersing of unbelievers in the full fury of God’s fiery wrath.
There is a baptism by Christ, with the Holy Spirit, into the body of Christ, I Corinthians 12, “We’ve all been baptized with the Holy Spirit into the body of Christ.” When you became a Christian, you were immersed into the communion of the redeemed. You were placed in the union with every other believer so that he who that is joined with the Lord is one spirit with every other believer. So, there is the immersing of the believer into the body of Christ. There is the immersing of the unbeliever into the full fury and wrath of God under which he is completely submerged.
In I Corinthians, chapter 10, verse 2, it says, “The children of Israel were immersed into Moses.” It’s talking about solidarity. They were joined unto Moses in his leadership. What he did, they did. What he said, they followed. They literally…he was their leader and they were immersed into Moses. Where he went, they went. Solidarity, union, communion—the word then can have that sort of metaphoric meaning where it means being immersed into something. You could say, “I was immersed in my work. I was immersed in thought.” Those kinds of expressions don’t necessarily refer to water, but they refer to using the idea of water as a metaphor for being engulfed in something. So, there are times in the New Testament, when you read about a baptism, that isn’t a baptism by water; there are other times when, of course, it is as we’ve seen—a baptism by water.
We’re going to focus on the issue of the baptisms that have to do with water. This water immersion, commanded of every believer, is basically not negotiable. We don’t have an option with this. This is a command; it is a reiterated and repeated and obeyed command in the New Testament. It is in itself, a simple act, and were it no more than just to put somebody in water and take them out, we could say it was nothing but a dunk. It was nothing but a cleansing, it was nothing but a refreshing…nothing more.
But, there is much more because it is an object lesson. It is a depiction—it is a picture—it is a symbol—it is a physical analogy of a great spiritual truth that is profound—and it is crucial, if you understand what baptism signifies, to stick with the New Testament mode. If you change the mode of immersion, you then confound it’s symbol. God has designed that this simple ordinance teach us most wonderful truth—the most wonderful truth of all, the truth of personal salvation. It’s all wrapped up in this act of baptism.
And, of course, any student of the Bible knows that God teaches with symbols. In the Old Testament…all kinds of symbols and analogies and types and pictures and ceremonies…depicting a spiritual truth in some physical way. Certainly, in the New Testament, Jesus did that with His parables and His analogies…The apostle Paul does it with his illustrations. So we have long seen God dispense truth to us in sort of abstract terms, but connected with very concrete, pragmatic, tangible things which can graphically illustrate the truth…and baptism is one of those. It is an external, physical, symbolic act which depicts a profound and deep and essential spiritual truth. Now, let’s go to the second question. We know what baptism is.
2. What has been the history of baptism? How are we to understand its history?
Well, let’s go back, before the New Testament and we’ll get at least a portion of the history of baptism. There were a number of washings in Israel, a number of cleansings and ceremonial washings of the hands that the priests went through and the people went through and the washing of pots and things like that…that were certain kinds of immersings were necessary that depict cleansing.
But, Christian baptism has at least one very important sort of a precursor and that is Judaistic proselyte baptism. Before the New Testament…let’s say a Gentile had come to the knowledge of the true God. Some Gentile had heard the prophets or he had heard the testimony of a faithful Israelite or he’d come to Israel and he moved into the land and he took up residence there. Or he lived on the border or whatever and he was exposed to the living and true God, God moved upon his heart…he came to believe in the true and living God, he repented of his sin, and he became a follower of the true God, and he was a saved individual—a saved Gentile—who wanted to identify with God’s people, he would be called a proselyte. He had been proselytized, if you will—he was now a proselyte to Judaism. He was a Gentile wanting to become identified with the Jews and worship their God—like Cornelius would be, in the New Testament. Now, he would have to go through a three-stage ceremony… the Jews had developed a ceremony by which a proselyte would enter into privilege in the covenant community.
First of all, the first phase is called mela (sp.) and that amounted to circumcision. Because circumcision was a God-ordained sign, any male who came in, even in an adult, would need to be circumcised. He would need, therefore, to identify himself with the people of God by this unique circumcision ceremony.
The second thing that would happen to him, would be tebula (sp.)—mela (sp.) was the first one, tebula (sp.) was the second one—and that was an immersion. He would be dunked in water, submerged in water, in order to demonstrate this—this is what they said—it was to demonstrate that they were dead as to their old life. They were dead as to their old customs, their old habits, their old traditions, most of all their old idolatry, and their old iniquity. That was now gone; they were burying it. That submersion into water depicted the death of that old life. They would come out of that water, having arisen to walk in a cleansed and new life with God’s community—God’s family.
The third part of that three-phase induction of a Gentile into the people of God, was called corban (sp.) and it had to do with the sacrificial animal. They were to bring an animal to be slaughtered and the reason for the slaughtering of the animal was to remind that Gentile that their forgiveness—the forgiveness of their sin…they were coming into the community of God’s people…they were repenting and confessing the true and living God—that forgiveness of sin which God would grant to them would only come to them through death. So, here was the death of a substitute animal to picture the fact that there would have to be a substitute to die for their sins. They literally passed on, as it were, the symbol of a substitutionary death to those Gentiles who came in, again depicting the ultimate lamb who would come and truly take away sin. So, any Gentile who wanted to come in, would be circumcised, would be immersed, and would have to offer a blood sacrifice which was an open confession that their sin was going to require the death of a substitute. That, of course, looked forward to the Messiah who was that substitute.
Now, into this Jewish community comes John the Baptist and John comes preaching, and he comes preaching repentance, and then, he comes baptizing. That’s not surprising. That’s not surprising that John would come baptizing; they were used to that; they had gone through the ceremony; they were used to seeing people baptized, but what was shocking—what was devastating, what was remarkable—was that John the Baptist was asking Jews to be baptized. Why was that remarkable? It was an amazing thing. He was in effect saying to them, you are as what? You’re as Gentiles. You’re outside the covenant, you’re without hope in the world, you’re without God, you need to be immersed as a symbol that you have died to the old life, been washed, and brought into the cleansed family of God.
Now, for a Jew to admit that he was equal to being a Gentile was a stretch. I mean, it was a huge stretch. For the most part, they hated the Gentiles. The Gentiles had been their oppressors; the Gentiles were non-covenantal people. They (the Jews) ridiculed [them] in ridiculing ways, called them the uncircumcised. When they would come from a Gentile country back into Israel, they would stop before they crossed the border and shake the dust off their cloak so they didn’t take any Gentile dirt into their land. They wouldn’t go into the home of a Gentile because they were unclean. They wouldn’t eat food with a Gentile because they were unclean. They had all of these social prohibitions that they had erected which really were not consistent with the law of God, they had fabricated them. You remember Jonah—when a whole Gentile city, Nineveh repented—went out and wept and said he’d rather be dead than see Gentiles being allowed to come into the family of the true and living God? They had deep-seated racial animosity.
But, here comes John the Baptist and he says to them, “You need to be immersed!” and he’s treating them as if they are in the same condition as Gentiles outside the covenant. But, you know what? He preached repentance and he must have been a powerful preacher because he was very convincing and people began to repent, didn’t they? They really began to repent; this is a powerful man. He may have been the most powerful of all preachers…in fact, wasn’t it Jesus who clearly told us that? He said, “Of all who’ve ever lived, John the Baptist is the greatest.” Up until Christ, the greatest prophet ever—I would love to have heard him preach; he must have been something fierce, they chopped his head off for it and served it up on a platter at a party just to silence him.
But, all Israel was coming out there and here were all these people who basically were being redefined as if they were Gentiles—outside the covenant, outside the promise, outside the hope, outside salvation, and needing to repent of their sin—died of the old life of legalism and self-righteousness and all the Judaistic trappings, and to come to the true understanding of their sin and cast themselves on the mercy of God, and go into this baptism as a symbol that they wanted a new life and they wanted to be ready for the Messiah. So, he preached repentance and righteousness and he called for people to turn from iniquity to holiness, from the old life to a new one. In order to symbolize it, he selected baptism and Matthew 3 shows him, in the first 8 verses, baptizing people. “They were confessing their sins,” it says, and they were confessing that they were worthy of death, they were worthy of burial, and they needed a new life, and that was depicted in their immersion. So, the baptism of John the Baptist really did mark a turning point in the heart of a sinful Jew who wanted to be ready to face the Messiah and knew he wasn’t.
On one particular day, however, an incredible thing occurred and I need to comment on it—Jesus showed up. He had showed up before and John had said, “Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.” So, John knew who he was and John had identified him as the Messiah, the One who would die for sin, the true Lamb who would be the final and full sacrifice.
But, Jesus showed up on another occasion in Matthew 3:13 and He comes to John to be baptized by John—this is quite remarkable. Well, he can’t handle this, verse 14, “John tried to prevent Him, saying, “I have need to be baptized by You and You come to me?” This doesn’t make sense! You don’t need to reject Your old life. You don’t need to repent of anything—You’re sinless, holy, and undefiled. You don’t need to say no to the past and yes to the future. You don’t need to have some death to the old symbolized, and some resurrection to the new dramatized—that doesn’t make sense. This doesn’t fit You.” But, Jesus answering said to him, “Permit it at this time, for this is just for now—it needs to be done, for in this way it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.” Then he permitted him.” Why did He do this? Well, He says it: “to fulfill all righteousness.” Listen; that’s so important. John understood baptism to be the confession of sin. John understood baptism to be repentance. John understood baptism to be the death of the old life, to rise and walk in new life. But, Jesus didn’t need to do that. He was sinless. Well, what’s the point? The whole idea of this baptism was to prepare sinners to receive the sinless King, so John tried to prevent Him, but Jesus said, “No. I have to do this for now because I need to fulfill all righteousness.”
Well, what does he mean by that? Some people say, “Well, He wanted to identify with the people who were getting ready for Him.” That’s possible. Others have said that, “He wanted to set the example for believers in the future.” I think that’s very possible—that’s getting close. But, let me just kind of cap it off. What He wanted to do was fulfill all righteousness and for us, all righteousness would include what? Baptism. If you’re going to fulfill all the righteousness that God asks of you, you’re going to be baptized. I think Jesus…you know His life was imputed to us, our sins were imputed to Him, His righteous life imputed to us…and He fulfilled all righteousness…all righteousness.
Yes, it was a symbol of His coming death. Yes, it was a symbol of His coming resurrection, of course. A sort of a prophesy of that, a sort of a type of that, a picture of that, a prefiguring of that, but I think what He says here is: I don’t have a choice about this because this is the standard of righteousness—to be baptized. It will continue to be the standard of righteousness—to be baptized, and since I am here, living as a man to fulfill all righteousness, I will be baptized. Of course, it doesn’t have the same exact meaning for Him, but He knows that this is a call from God. He knows that John the Baptist is preaching God’s message—it is God, through John, calling people to be baptized and it is God through the apostles and God through the preachers, calling you to be baptized. Jesus is simply saying, “In order to fulfill all righteousness, I will be obedient to what God desires. If I’m going to live as a man, I’m going to obey all the commands.”
So, in submitting to baptism, Jesus is showing us how critical obedience is. So critical that He did it, even though there was no need for Him to go through any kind of cleansing, any kind of repentance, any kind of confession of sin. Yes, I think Jesus, when He was going through that baptism by John and being immersed in water, anticipated that that’s what His death, burial, and resurrection was going to be like and that out of that would come a new symbol of baptism. But, He did it to fulfill all righteousness.
So, baptism is clearly a ceremony—very simple, somebody immersed in water and it has a spiritual significance of great importance. What is the history of it? It really is sort of a transition from proselyte baptism, which was also to identify some one as a sinner who is repentant, confessed his sin, and desired new life…and desired to be associated with the kingdom of the true and living God and His Son, the Messiah. Well, more to say…let me go to a third question.
3. What is the specific meaning of Christian baptism?
What is the specific meaning of Christian baptism? And, you already kind of known it, but let’s dig a little deeper into the text of the New Testament. All throughout the New Testament, Christian baptism is clearly identified for us. It’s really not hard at all. It’s—in fact—it’s crystal clear. Look at Romans, chapter 6 and I want to show you a couple of verses, so you can turn there and we’re not going to spend a lot of time there, but just a couple of thoughts and it will be very obvious to you.
When you come to Christ as a nonbeliever and you put your faith in Jesus Christ and you believe and you repent of your sin and you’re wonderfully saved, regenerated, born again; there is a spiritual miracle that takes place. I can’t explain all of it in its actual reality—I can only tell you what the words are in the text that describe it to us. When you come to faith in Christ, you are literally immersed into Christ. You’re literally immersed into Christ. His life becomes your life—it even reaches backwards so that He died bearing your sins so in that sense, you were there dying. He rose again for your justification, therefore you were there rising with Him. He was your substitute. He died and rose again for you, so in a real sense, He went to the cross carrying your sins and He comes out of the grave bearing your new life.
That’s what Paul in Romans 6:3 says: “Do you not know that all of us who have been immersed into Christ Jesus, have been immersed into His death.” This is a dry verse here, folks. We’re not talking about water baptism—he’s simply saying that when you have been immersed into Christ Jesus by faith, you have been immersed into His death. When you put your faith in Jesus Christ, “He that is joined to the Lord is one Spirit,” I Corinthians 6 says. Paul says in Galatians 2:20, “I am crucified with Christ; nevertheless I live, yet not I, but Christ lives in me.” So, here I am inseparable from Christ, as it were. Here is Christ living in me and I am in Christ. I am in Christ; Christ is in me. My body is the temple of the Spirit of God—if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His. Christ dwells within me. So, I am now in this inseparable, indivisible, unity with the Lord Jesus Christ. I am in an ongoing, constant, shared life—I possess the life of God, as it were. I am a partaker of the divine life. Christ dwells within me; the Holy Spirit has taken up residency in my life.
I have been literally immersed into Christ. That includes, verse 3, having been immersed into His death. I wouldn’t have this relationship to Him if I hadn’t died in Him in the sense that all my sins were there when He died—He was carrying my sins. It was as if I was there. God, in a supernatural and mysterious way literally puts the sinner and all his sin, in Christ. By the way, that would put all of us there because even our righteousness is filthy rags and before you were regenerate, you were all sin and nothing else so you were there in “toto” (sp.) when Christ died. So, anybody immersed into Christ, was immersed into His death, and, verse 4 says, “You were buried with Him through that immersion into His death, and then you were raised from the dead to walk in newness of life.” Verse 5 sums it up, “You were united with Him in the likeness of His death; you are united with Him in the likeness of His resurrection.” Your old self was crucified with Him and you now, verse 9, have been raised from the dead along with Christ, never to die again and death is no longer master over Him or you.
So, that’s the symbolism. The symbolism is of dying, being buried, and rising again. That symbolism can only be depicted in water baptism. That is the meaning of Christian baptism. It is a physical illustration—it is a physical symbol, a physical ceremony, intended to depict this reality. Whenever a person goes into the water, it symbolizes the death of the old life—they come out of the water…it symbolizes that they are now new creations.
In Colossians…well, Galatians…let’s look there and then we’ll go to Colossians, since they’re in that order…Galatians 3:27 says, “For all of you who were immersed into Christ have clothed yourself with Christ.” There’s a good parallel. What he is saying…he’s trying to figure ways to illustrate this union. He’s saying, “You been literally submerged into Christ. You’ve been literally immersed into Christ.” Another way to say it is: you have been clothed with Christ. In other words, you are wrapped in Christ; Christ covers you. You are underneath Him; you are contained, as it were, in Christ. He envelops you. And, there is neither Jew nor Greek…you sort of lose your identity here. There’s neither slave nor free man, neither male nor female…you’re all one in Christ Jesus and you belong to Christ, verse 29 says. That’s the idea.
In Colossians, chapter 2, similarly, verses 12 and 13, “Having been buried with Him in baptism,” that’s right—same idea. You were there dying in Him—you were immersed into Him in His death. “You were also raised up with Him, all of this through faith in the working of God who raised him from the dead.” You put your faith in God, you believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (Romans 10, “If you believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you’ll be saved.”), you believed that God raised Him from the dead and by faith, in God, raising Jesus from the dead, which affirms all about the cross and all about His bearing sin—all the way through to the resurrection…you affirm that, therefore you were buried with Him, immersed into Him, in that death and in that resurrection. You were placed into union with Christ, participating in His death, His resurrection…spiritually.
This is the baptism that saves. Peter talks about a baptism that saves—that’s the baptism that saves…the spiritual immersing into Christ, not the water. This is the true washing of regeneration of Titus 3:5, not the H2O. This is the real washing away of sins, Acts 22:16. Water is simply the symbol. It’s simply the parable. It’s simply the analogy. It’s simply the illustration. Jesus, you remember back in Mark’s Gospel, said, “If you’re not willing to confess Me before man, I’m not willing to confess you before My Father who’s in heaven.” This depicts that miracle. When a child asks, “Why do you do that? What is the meaning of baptism?” It’s a very graphic illustration…it makes it very clear in helping to explain to a child. When an unbeliever comes and sees a baptismal service, they’re literally seeing an object lesson of the spiritual dynamics of new birth. That leads to a fourth question.
4. What is the relation of immersion to salvation?
That’s what I just said, basically. It is a symbol of salvation already received. Acts 2:38 says, “Repent, and be baptized for the remission of sins.” Some people think, “Well, that means you can’t have your sins forgiven or remitted unless you’re baptized.” Is that what it’s saying? It could be translated, “Repent, and be baptized because of the remission of sins.” That’s a construction that is used, for example, in Matthew 12:41—the same construction translated that way. But, even it says, “Repent, and be baptized for the remission of sins,” the baptism doesn’t save you. The baptism is evidence of genuine repentance and an obedient heart—it’s just a way to demonstrate the genuineness.
Because, you see, when a Jew was…if you were listening to Peter preach on the day of Pentecost and you were going to go and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, you were going to be baptized in the name of the one who was probably hated more than anybody else by the Jewish leadership. You were going to wind up losing you family, your social status, your job, your right to attend the synagogue…everything. You would become immediately indigent and homeless. The price was very high…you would become a pariah, a social outcast. But, true faith will pay the price, count the cost.
So, when Peter says, “Repent and be baptized,” he’s saying, let’s see, if the repentance is real, you’ll take the stand. If the repentance is real, you’ll respond in obedience no matter what the price. Baptism was the immediate and inseparable indicator of salvation. True believers were obedient and they were baptized. Day of Pentecost: three thousand were saved and three thousand were baptized. The apostles insisted on it. That’s why we at Grace Church ask that anyone who joins our church, be baptized. We aren’t adding something; we’re just trying to be faithful to what the New Testament says. If a convert was not willing to be baptized—in the early church, there was little confidence in his repentance. There was no such thing as an unbaptized church. There was no such thing as all kinds of unbaptized believers. Baptism was obedience and obedience was the fruit of repentance.
This became then, an inseparable sign of salvation—so much so that when Paul was discussing salvation in Ephesians 4, he discusses it this way, “One Lord, one faith, one baptism.” And, he means by that, “one salvation,” but baptism and salvation had become synonymous. There are still places in the world where you don’t ask someone is they were saved, you ask them if they’ve been baptized because it was an inseparable and immediate indicator of salvation. As the church developed through the middle ages, baptism got pushed further and further and further away from the point of salvation—tragically. It’s still held at great distance by some people even in our society. As I say, you look at these crusades and these things that you see on television and there’s never any baptism—it doesn’t seem to be a part.
Yet, Jesus said, “Go out into all the world and make disciples, baptizing them.” When He was saying that…that was synonymous with salvation because the next thing He says is, “…teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you.” Baptism became synonymous with leading them to the knowledge of the gospel and if they were willing to receive the gospel, believe, repent…they would be baptized as an immediate response. So, when Peter says, “Repent and be baptized for the remission of sin,” he’s simply saying, “Repent and believe unto salvation…demonstrate the genuineness of that by the first act of obedience which is baptism.
We’re not saved by the water—that’s not going to save you. “By grace are you saved, through what?” “Faith, that not of yourself, not of works…not of works.” Paul says in I Corinthians 1:14, “I’m glad that I baptized none of you.” Now, if that was a saving act, how could he say that? It doesn’t save you—you can go through all the water you want and not be saved. And, I have to confess that you can be saved and not be baptized, but you’re in a condition of disobedience. Baptism produces nothing but blessing. Nothing but the joy and the reward of obedience. Nothing but the affirmation of God to an obedient child. It doesn’t save you, it doesn’t make you holier than somebody else…it just brings you the blessing of obedience—that’s what it does.
You could sum it up like this: as a believer stands in the water, ready to be immersed, he could declare these words, “I hereby confess in my willing submission to this divinely appointed ordinance, my glad obedience to the command of my Lord and Savior. In this symbolic manner, I show forth my identification with the one who bore my sins, took my place, died in my stead, was buried, and rose again for my justification. As Christ went through the dreadful reality of suffering and death to secure my salvation, so, by my immersion in water and emergence there from, I thus publicly declare my identification with my Lord in His death, burial, and resurrection on my behalf, with the intention hence forth to walk with Him in newness of life.” That’s the sum of it.
That leads me to another issue, that leads me to the next message, why is there so much confusion on this? Well, I think Satan wants to break the pattern of obedience at the very start, so there’s a lot of attacks on baptism. You know, there are churches that teach that it’s not for us—that it’s a Jewish ordinance that doesn’t belong to the church, Quakers, Friends Churches, Salvation Army, other hyper-dispensational groups—for those of you that know what that means—the Bullenger (sp) rights. Others say: you’re saved by water—the Christian Church, the Churches of Christ, Disciples of Christ—have taught baptismal regeneration through the years: that you can’t get to heaven without going through the water. And then there are those, who, like the Mormons who have baptisms for the dead—in one year over 2.5 million Mormons are baptized—proxy-baptisms for dead people.
And then you come to the Roman Catholic Church which the only baptism they have is the sprinkling and it’s infants that are sprinkled—the Roman Catholic Church has an infant baptismal regeneration belief that water cleanses the baby from original sin and results in regeneration. By the way, until the Middle Ages, the Roman Catholic’s immersed babies—sprinkling didn’t come until the Middle Ages. The Roman Catholic church teaches that if a baby dies without being christened or baptized, it goes to the “Limbo of the Innocence.” It never goes to heaven; it doesn’t go to hell—just goes to the “Limbo of the Innocence.” That’s the place where the soul enjoys natural bliss, but is forever deprived of the vision of God. So, these unbaptized infants just go hang out in some limbo place that’s some kind of natural bliss, but there’s no presence of God there. That’s not in the Bible, by the way. That’s how they intimidated people to get their babies baptized which brought them into the system, which brought them under control of the Roman Empire.
The Lutherans never got too far away from that, unfortunately—Luther never really shook the grave clothes of infant baptism. He even wrote a small book entitled The Small Baptismal Book, aptly named. He wrote it in 1526, and at an infant baptism, this is the prayer that he designed to be prayed…You bring your baby to be baptized and this is the prayer:
Oh Lord Almighty,
I invoke Thee concerning this child,
thy servant who asks for the gift of thy baptism
and desires thy grace through the spiritual new birth—
All of a sudden, this child is a servant of God who desires grace and new birth, even though this is a totally unconscious infant in the sense of knowing anything at all about anything.
Receive him, O Lord,
and thus extend, now, the good to him who knocks,
that he may obtain the eternal blessing of this heavenly bath,
and receive the promise kingdom of thy gift,
through Jesus Christ, our Lord. Amen.
And then, in Luther’s ceremony, the infant is asked, “Doest thou renounce the devil and all his works and nature?” The parents answer, “Yes.” “Doest thou believe in God the Father, in Jesus Christ, His Son, in the Holy Spirit, and the one Christian Church?” These were asked of the infant—the parents say, “Yes.” The child is then baptized, and then the concluding prayer:
The Almighty God hath begotten thee anew,
through water and the Holy Spirit,
and has forgiven thee all thy sins. Amen.
Why, that’s salvation. Infant salvation, through water.
The Reformed Church has moved some beyond that. They believe that when adults turn to Christ, they are to be sprinkled because they now are…so they do have adult sprinkling…they now have come into a covenant relationship to God. And then, when they have children, their children are automatically included in the covenant of grace and they are to be baptized when they’re born, as little members of the covenant. Later, they are confirmed as actual members, after satisfactorily answering the questions in the catechism—that’s usually called confirmation.
No such thing is taught in Scripture. Children born into this world are not somehow introduced, by virtue of their birth, into the covenant of salvation. And, there’s nothing about baptism with children at all. All of this stuff clouds the issue and so, so many people say, “Oh well…there’s many views of baptism…I don’t want to make an issue out of it…” and the devil gains the day, doesn’t he? This is not complex, this isn’t brain surgery—even I understand this. This is very straight-forward stuff. I’ll tell you, in next message, you’re going to find it fascinating when I talk to you about where infant baptism came from and you see why it even was developed—it had nothing to do with the Bible.
You know, during the time of the Reformation too, they thought that…they were so into infant baptism that anybody who got rebaptized after they’d been baptized as an infant was in some trouble. They were called Anabaptists because they got rebaptized. They came to the conviction that infant baptism was wrong and you needed to be baptized as an adult believer…they were rebaptized and in so doing, they were sort of slapping the face of the religious hierarchy—the national church—and the Reformation produced national churches, governmental churches, that, in many cases, weren’t much better than the Roman Catholic nations. They had literally Protestant countries where the church exercised great political pressure and power. Many times the Anabaptists were persecuted and sometimes executed by Reformers—hard to imagine.
So, that they thought rebaptism was unacceptable. Well, that’s another confusing thing. People ask me about that all the time: “I as baptized once as a baby; do I need to be rebaptized?” Answer: if you weren’t baptized the biblical way, you’d better be baptized the biblical way. John the Baptist’s disciples showed up in Acts 19; the apostles said to them, “Have you heard of the Messiah?” etc….they said, “We don’t know anything about that. We were baptized with John’s baptism.” They didn’t say, “Oh well, that’s sufficient.” They said, “Then you need to hear the truth about Messiah…” They heard the truth and they were baptized the right way. Well, more later…
Baptism is a command. It is the purpose of God. It is the command of Christ. And, if you say, “No!” it can’t be ignorance; we’ve eliminated that category, if you were listening. Pride, indifference, defiance, or you’re not a Christian. Jesus said, “How can you say, “Lord, Lord!” and do not the things I say?” Jesus said, “If you love me,” you’ll what? “Keep my commandments.” Don’t bring yourself under God’s chastening because of disobedience in this most simple act of obedience, which will bring upon you God’s favor and your own joy.
Now, make it practical. In the pew is a little green card…if you want to be baptized, we’re going to be prepared to do that. You just need to take that green card and put your name on it and check off baptism, or write “baptism’, and give us a phone number and address—most helpful would be a phone number—and we’ll get a hold of you and include you in a baptismal service very quickly. We’re going to do some special things in order to respond to you. The green cards are there—if you can’t find a green card, use a beige one. Just write your name and write “baptism” and make sure your phone number is there so we can reach you and we’ll arrange…our pastoral team is standing by and ready to arrange that.
All I can do is lay this on your conscious from the Lord Himself and trust that you’ll do what is right. For those of you who have been baptized—you know those who haven’t—you can become a little added conscience for them, to stimulate them to do what is right before God. When you go out the door, the ushers will be there and they will collect those green cards, O.K.? I’ll give you a minute to do that—don’t…if you’re too shy to take the green card out and see somebody watching, gonna have kind of a hard time getting into the baptismal—we have to get you past that barrier if we could, my goodness. Just take one of those cards and you should be stampeding to get one because of the joy of obedience.
Let’s pray—let’s stand first and we’ll pray.
Transcribed by:
Tony Capoccia
Bible Bulletin Board
Box 119
Columbus, New Jersey, USA, 08022
Websites: http://www.biblebb.com and http://www.gospelgems.com
Email: tony@biblebb.com
Online
October 2, 2006 at 2:50 pm
Zealot:
Zach, you cornball you! I knew that you and Amy would get together. Life is a journey better traveled with a soulmate. I think you have found one. I will pray for you both.
Bills made you proud Sunday. About time.
By the way , you can call me Lou.
Take care little brother.
ps Field of Dreams,Frequency,Always?
October 2, 2006 at 4:16 pm
Big Jake..My dear Friend in Christ..I didn’t mean to belittle or bicker. If I came across that way, please forgive me. You posted quite a lot and I agree with much of what you wrote. I, too, believe that the fall of man by his first sin has carried on generation after generation. I was raised in a church that gave me a lot of foundational teaching , but as I got older I had a quest to know God on a more personal level and began my quest by going to God directly, and asking Him to lead me and give me wisdom. I began reading the scriptures myself, not letting a church tell me what they said, but letting the Holy Spirit open my eyes. I have read several commentaries and several books. The one common thread throughout the entire Bible, is that Jesus IS God, and HE is the Word (John 1:1)and that He is the ONLY way to the Father. I also believe that there is nothing mankind can do on its own to merit heaven. It was Christ’s sacrifice alone, HIS shed blood that saves us. If we could do ANYTHING on our own, why would Christ have to die such a horrible death? I assumed you were Catholic when I read your post. I have nothing against catholics and I know many that I believe are truly saved. (I believe YOU are) I also know many that believe the church, just by being a member, will save them. They know a lot about their church, but very little about God. They go through all the motions, but they are basically worshipping their church. I truly hope that you understand that my response to baptism was in no way putting your belief down. I feel the real meaning of baptism has been robbed because so few people know what Christ actually was doing. When you think about it, isn’t it beautiful that a totally innocent man/God wanted to have relationship with us so much, that He stepped out of Glory and did for us what we couldn’t do for ourselves. We’re not worthy, but we’re not worthless. What a great God we serve.
You are my brother in Christ and I really don’t care what church or doctrine you align yourself with as long as it never denies Christ.
I look forward to your posts.
October 2, 2006 at 4:55 pm
My dear Angel:
I didn’t take your commentary as bickering or belittling. I simply state that I do not know
if it is enough for someone to profess to Christianity and be a follower of Jesus without Baptism .
To quote from Mr. MacArthur’s article
“Baptism is a command. It is the purpose of God. It is the command of Christ. And, if you say, “No!” it can’t be ignorance; we’ve eliminated that category, if you were listening. Pride, indifference, defiance, or you’re not a Christian. Jesus said, “How can you say, “Lord, Lord!” and do not the things I say?” Jesus said, “If you love me,” you’ll what? “Keep my commandments.” Don’t bring yourself under God’s chastening because of disobedience in this most simple act of obedience, which will bring upon you God’s favor and your own joy.”
I admit he is extreme. But this is from a “Protestant” not a “Roman Catholic” view point. The message is the same.
Simply put, if you make bread and leave out some ingredient ,lets say yeast , and your bread doesn’t turn out you will say “If only I ADDED THE YEAST I would be enjoying Bread now.
I don’t want to take that chance.
Neither would I want to tell someone that Baptism is not necessary when I see over and over that theologians are saying that it is.
I love my Lord with my whole heart and my whole soul. I am not worthy of the great gift He has given me by dying on the cross for my sins, for giving me His Mother as my own and making me His brother. I never want to be separated from Him now or in Eternity.
Your Brother in Christ Jesus
Big Jake
October 2, 2006 at 7:04 pm
Thank you for being so sweet. I agree a person should be baptised once they accept Christ as their savior. And it is an act of obedience. Where I differ, is that I don’t think it’s necessary for salvation. Think of all the things you (& I) do on a daily basis that are NOT obedient. Intentional and not intentional. How many of the 10 commandments do you break on a daily basis? God knows we can’t live a perfect life. What is so awesome about Him, is that he knows our heart, and most sincere believers really do try to do their very best. I work in an office with a lot of woman, and I am constantly subject to gossip. and swearing, and who’s sleeping with whom, etc. Sometime some of this stuff gets pretty juicy and the nosey side wants to hear all about it, but I know in my heart that it’s wrong. Fortunately, when we stumble He is always there to help us get back on track again. I, too, am looking forward to the day when I can spend eternity with God and be with all the loved ones who have gone on before me. I really don’t know how people that don’t know Christ can find hope in this crazy world. I believe we are living in the end times, too……what do you think?
October 2, 2006 at 8:15 pm
Big Jake: Lou, huh? Somehow that dosen’t seem to fit you. You’re more like a Big Jake to me.
Anyway, yeah, the Bills made me proud Sunday. And what do you mean, it’s about time? What is that, a little jab?? Hahaha. I hear it all the time. Everyone I know has pretty much jumped off the bandwagon. Did you notice Bill Clinton was there?? I saw him and I knew he must be there campaigning for his darling Hillary. It couldn’t be because he’s a Bill’s fan, the wuss. I always think he’s got some other agenda going.
I was reading all this stuff you and the Angel were writing about baptising. I was sprinkled when I was a kid. I supposed I should do it again from what you say. I’m going to see what Amy says about that. She’s pretty knowledgable on the Bible so I’ll pick her brain later. She likes talking about this stuff.
Are you on that other forum? I can’t get into it. The page won’t come up on my computer. I don’t care anyway. If that other clown gets on here and wants to mouth off, I don’t really care anymore anyway. Like you said, we’re all anonymous.
Big Jake…I don’t want to lose contact with you. So stay on here, okay?
I haven’t seen those movies yet, but I’ll watch them Amy sooner or later.
October 3, 2006 at 8:25 pm
Big Jake, Angel – thanks for your insight. I’ve always figured I’ll be one of those left behind for the test of faith. I will consider what you’ve said.
Z – awesome news!!! I am so happy for you! I bet Amy is as excited about this relationship as you are, she’s probably just afraid of appearing to look like she wants a big committment. I knew my husband was the guy for me on our first date. I’ve never asked him when he knew.
The skins won, too!!!!
What do you all think about this thing with Foley? First Barney Frank, then Clinton, and now Foley … our kids aren’t even safe up on the Hill. How many more abuses have gone unreported?
October 4, 2006 at 12:49 am
Americanwoman: Thanks. I started seeing her a little bit in May and we seemed to hit it off right away so it picked up quick. She’s really something special. She’s so pretty and feminine. I really like her. Don’t want to blow it, but don’t want to rush in, either. Her husband died a little over a year ago and she’s pretty vulnerable right now so I don’t want to take advantage. But I don’t want anyone else to scoop her up, either. She’s not leading me on. She doesn’t chase me at all. And I like that. She’s got me stumped. I really don’t know what to think. You women are funny. Hard to figure. Her birthday was a couple of weeks ago, so I bought her a teddy bear. I got her a gold necklace and I put it around the bear’s neck and then I took it to the florist and had them throw some flowers in and wrap it up for me. I gave it to her after I took her out to dinner and when she saw it she cried. Not boo hooing stuff, but she just got all teary. I told her she could take the necklace back and get something she liked if she didn’t like it, and then she started laughing and told me how sweet I was and that she loved it. Am I stupid or what? Another time I was at her house and the music was on and this nice song came on so I just kind of grabbed her and started to slow dance with her. The next thing I know she’s crying on my shoulder. I just kept right on dancing cause, man, I didn’t know what was going on. I figure the least said is the best said. Anyway, keep your fingers crossed for me cause I do think this girl is would be quite the prize.
And Big Jake…where you been? I want you to address my baptising. If you think I should do it again, advise me. I figure if I should do it, I don’t want the desire thing, I want to just do the right thing. Let me know, buddy.
Need to help my son with some math…boy,is he in for a surprise…I suck at math. Talk to you later.
October 4, 2006 at 1:11 am
Z, Lovesamerica is probably severely depressed and as a woman, I can empathize with her. You are such a great guy and the teary eyed thing from Amy … well, I think a decent woman really tries to hide her tears in front of a guy until she feels 100 percent comfortable. And even then … to this day, I can’t watch “Out of Africa” in front of my husband because I feel like a blubbering idiot and I feel even worse because he doesn’t know how to make me feel better. Like I say, there are differences between the genders and I think we’d all be better off if we learned to appreciate and embrace them. I don’t want to be married to a girlfriend … I want a strong guy who I know will take care of me, but I need my girlfriends to talk girl stuff. Trust me, Z, Amy is probably head over heals for you. Lovesamerica … where do you live? Follow Red Dawn’s instructions to get on the safe site since “you know who” is probably reading in. I have serveral good young men I know … and they’re fire department and military guys who are good guys. Nothing perverted about it. My husband always cringes when I try to match-make, but it’s hard not to do when you know good single women and good single men who just don’t connect.
October 4, 2006 at 4:37 am
Zealot: you asked:
“And Big Jake…where you been? I want you to address my baptising. If you think I should do it again, advise me. I figure if I should do it, I don’t want the desire thing, I want to just do the right thing. Let me know, buddy.”
Ok To start with if you were baptized as an infant and the baptism was valid. There is no need to be re-baptized. If you were baptized as an adult or at the age of reason and your baptism was valid, there is no need to rebaptize. Valid baptism is a once in a lifetime event. no need for a second baptism.
Hope this helps.
Angel : End Times? Sure seems like it. We will know when the weirdness starts. Micro chips under the skin ,etc.
October 4, 2006 at 12:03 pm
Americanwoman, you are right. You know me too well and I am TOTALLY bummed. I live in Atlanta and you want to know what really bugs me? My name is AMY!! I have NO LUCK at all.
Zealot or Zach, where did you meet this girl? How did she get sooooooooooooooo lucky??
October 4, 2006 at 2:03 pm
lovesamerica: I need to destroy this image you seem to have of me. I appreciate that you think I’m such a great catch, but I’m not all that great. I met Amy after I was involved in a minor explosion that sent me to the emergency room. I broke my hand, and was sent up to X-ray. When I got up there, Amy was the x-ray tech, and she told me the nurses called her and told her they were sending up a cute fireman to have his hand x-rayed. She asked me where my partner was with the injured hand. I laughed. Then I told her they had told me to be prepared for x-ray because it was quite a freak show. We both just laughed. She had a cute sense of humor and I thought she was gorgeous. I starting bumping in to her around town. At the grocery store, Burker King, Uni-Marts. We’d stop and talk. When I finally asked her out, she turned me down. The Firemen’s picnic was coming up and I called her and asked her to go. She said no. I was pissed. I asked her what her problem was and she said she wasn’t ready for anything yet. I told her it was a frickin picnic, that wasn’t asking her to marry me. I told her to consider it a mercy date and just go. So she did. The truth is, I wanted to take her because she is such a knockout I wanted to show her off to the other guys. Do I sound like a jerk now. Anyway, we started to hit it off and had a good time. She was VERY cool with me in the beginning. Very. Another truth, if she would’ve been willing to sleep with me on the first date, do you think I would’ve said no? Come on. That’s the first thing I thought of when I first laid eyes on her. So don’t think I’m so perfect man because I’m not. I treat her like a lady because she is worth it. I will wait for her to come to me and she will when she’s ready. I can talk like this on her because none of you know me. I can’t talk like this to anybody else. My friends would have me committed. They’d think I was a sap. That’s why I like getting on here so I can say pretty much what I think and feel and it doesn’t matter. I actually feel close to Big Jake for some reason. And the truth be known, I’d like to meet him, but I know that will never happen. Trust me, you’ll find the guy that’s just right for you. Don’t chase him. Guys really do like to be the one in control. I know I do. Act like something special, and you’ll be treated special. Every guy wants a woman other guys respect. Call it ego, but it’s nice to have a woman you’re proud of. And as far as the Teddy bear thing, my sister gave me that suggestion. And it worked. Amy loved it. I never would’be thought of that on my own. Take care.
October 5, 2006 at 4:19 am
“lovesamerica Says:
October 4th, 2006 at 12:03 pm
Americanwoman, you are right. You know me too well and I am TOTALLY bummed. I live in Atlanta and you want to know what really bugs me? My name is AMY!! I have NO LUCK at all.
Zealot or Zach, where did you meet this girl? How did she get sooooooooooooooo lucky??”
lovesamerica/Amy -stop feeling sorry for yourself ,let your personality shine out and you will have to beat the guys off with a stick! What is the matter with you? You are only 23 years old!!! This is your time to shine!
What do you do for fun? What clubs /church groups do you belong to? What hobbies do you enjoy?
Don’t tell me that you sit home alone feeling sorry for yourself when you should be out enjoying life.
There are plenty of decent guys who probably see you feeling sorry for yourself and interpret that for disinterest.
They are probably thinking that you wouldn’t give them the time of day,so why bother asking you out?
Give yourself a little credit.
That’s the advice I would give to my own daughter ,who by the way is your age!
October 5, 2006 at 10:36 am
Big Jake, thank you for your advice. I wish you were MY father. My Dad (although he doesn’t really act like one) left my mother for a woman about 20 years younger than him when I was still in elementary school. My sister and I grew up with a bitter woman. I love her and she’s never neglected us, but she has always warned us about men. Zealot or Zach or whatever he wants to be called still sounds okay to me. He just sounds like a normal guy that gets turned on by a pretty face. I like the way he treats a girl. He seems sweet and sensitive. So he took her to a picnic to show her off. I don’t think that’s jerky. Do you? She’d probably be flattered if she knew. But he doesn’t force himself on her. And I think it’s romantic that he’s waiting for her. I’d love to be in her shoes. (Truthfully, if we’re talking truth, I probably would’ve given in already by now!) I’m not ugly, but I’m not drop dead gorgeous, either. I should probably lose about 20 pounds. No, I don’t sit home and feel sorry for myself. I’m confident in myself and I would be darn good to the right man. I’m not a cheat or a liar and I would love to be there for someone who would appreciate me. I work in a large office in an office complex and I meet lots of guys. The ones that hit on me the most are usually married or cheating on their girlfriends. I don’t belong to a church and there are dozens down here. I believe in God and I pray. I have gone to churches before, but most of the guys there are hooked up with someone. The ones that arn’t I wouldn’t be interested in. Americanwoman knows what I want. She just seems to know. When you were younger, what did you look for? I know you’re a nice guy. And I do wish you were my father. You have this quality that makes it easy to confide in you. Zealot picked up on it right away. Personally, I would like to meet both of you. I’d be a little afraid to meet Zealot because I don’t think I’d be pretty enough for him. I’m very ordinary and get lost in the crowd. Never caused a traffic jam. I’ve met a few nice guys but they’re not interested in a commitment right now. I don’t want an affair with anybody that isn’t serious. I would gladly give up my career to take care of a man and children. I’d love to have a nice home. I would love to have a man value me and love to come home to me and just be satisfied with me alone. You seem to have found that. Zealot had that once and I think he would be faithful and treasure someone again. It’s a lonely world. I hate bars. I would like to be in love and married and things don’t look too promising. (And Zealot, I know you’re probably going to read this, and you’re STILL my hero.)
October 5, 2006 at 2:01 pm
lovesamerica, I am not that superficial that looks are a priority. I like pretty woman and I’m sure in this image you have of me I’m what you’d be physically attracted to, too. Looks are always what you notice first but if there arn’t other qualities there it fades quick. My wife was a beautiful italian girl from a large family. She was a great cook and you couldn’t get two feet in her family’s front door without having food put in front of you. When she died I was 30 pounds over weight and my cholestrol was off the charts. I’m a big guy, too, over 6′. To keep myself busy and my mind off being without her, I started running and working out at the gym. I got my cholestrol under control, too. Amy is a health nut. We run together and work out together. She’s very careful what she eats. We go for a lot of walks. You’re right, I was first attracted to her because of her looks and her body and I still am. But after getting to know her, she’s the whole package. She beautiful inside and out. Just like my wife was. You sound like a sweetheart of a girl and the right guy, if he’s smart enough, will see it. Don’t sell yourself short that you get lost in a crowd. We all feel that way sometimes. I was so lonely after my wife died I thought about blowing my head off a couple of times. I’d wake up at night and could hardly breathe from the anxiety. You know what woke me up? 9-11. And that’s the God’s honest truth. I was so happy to be alive after that and for the first time I realized I needed to focus on what I HAD, not what I didn’t have. My son. Great friends. Great family. People who really cared about me and how I was. Big Jake’s right. You’re only 23 and you may not find the right guy for a while, but get out there and start living. Stop looking for something. It will happen on it’s own at the right time. You are definitely somebody’s prize.
October 5, 2006 at 4:40 pm
Hey, Kids! Been on the road for the past three days getting home from NC, then took the fourth day to “settle back in.” Wow! A lot of insightful info from Big Jake, as usual. Thanks, big guy.
Zealot, glad to hear “Amy” is a keeper. Don’t want to say “I told you so,” but I told you so! God will send you what you need when you’re ready for it. So, stay the course, keep your feet on the ground, but enjoy the time with your head in the clouds. Y’all are gonna do just fine.
Yes, having “the right person” around in the times we live in makes it easier for me. I don’t know what I’d do if Paula was an empty-headed bimbo. I agree with Zach/Zealot’s analysis of women. I don’t go for the pretty faces also because they are usually so shallow. A wise gent once told me “there are no perfect tens.” Z/Z is right; it’s a composite score. You need a certain amount of brains, beauty, and, yes, brawn, for a gal to be attractive to me. An odd thing my Mom said to me years ago is “being a woman is knowing when not to be a lady.” She had no qualms about bait worms, minnows, getting mudding wading in streams where Dad wanted to go fishing, etc. When I got a little older (dating/marriage age) she said a good wife is a gourmet cook in the kitchen, a perfect hostess in the living room, pious in church, a skilled handyman helping fix things around the house, and a slut in the bedroom. I guess the chap that penned the phrase, “I want a gal just like dear old Mom” had a mother like mine! ; ) Yes, my Paula is all of the above and I thank God for Him sending her to me.
Re: Looks department. I have fun with that one, too. If in a phone conversation and asked what I look like, I’d say, “You Brad Pitt? Well, I don’t look anything like him!” Paula thinks I’m good looking, but I accuse her of “not getting out much.” But it’s really the composite score thing, plus she knows that I love her and would do just about anything for her. I help around the house and she says five of the sexiest words I can say to her is, “Honey, I scrubbed the bathtub.”
Ya just gotta treat ‘em right and you don’t have to worry about waking up “a few inches shorter” like a fellow we know about from some years back. Yes, indeed, Hell has no fury as a woman… scorned or otherwise!
Well, I’m off (but I’m sure you’ve deduced that already) to check the main page of the site. Then it’s time to rustle up some grub. ‘Bye for now…
October 5, 2006 at 9:28 pm
DJ, nice to have you back. Your Paula sounds like something pretty special,too. I look up to you and Jake and value your input. Something you said is stuck in my brain, though. A woman is supposed to be a slut in the bedroom??…not a nice thought to plant in my head when I’m trying to stay a gentlemen. Thanks. It doesn’t help when she wants to cuddle all the time…Amy and I are going to have to stop spending so much time together cause I can’t take much more of this…women…what they can do to us.
October 6, 2006 at 1:55 am
Z: Sorry if I have offended you quoting one of my Mom’s colorful anecdotes. As soon as I hit “submit comment” I wondered if I should have used another term for “pleases husband in private environs.” I know what you mean about trying to be a gentleman around someone nice. However, sex is human nature and a woman might think “What’s wrong with him?” or “Why doesn’t he find me attractive?” if a guy is too reserved when the time is right for the relationship to go to the next level. When is that time and how will you know? Believe me, the guy that figures that out will be either very rich from writing the book on the subject or very tired. ; )
Cuddles are great! Sounds like she feels safe with you and trusts you; be honored. But trade off holding and being held. A guy that claims he doesn’t like to be coddled a little ocasionally needs to just relax and go with it. And the ladies, in my humble opinion, they miss being “Daddy’s girl” and a strong, loving guy makes them feel safe and loved. Ladies: please chime in here and let me know if I’m onto something or just on something.
And once again I apologize if my quote on my Mom’s criteria of a good wife was a little too crude for some.
October 6, 2006 at 4:15 am
lovesamerica/Amy :
You wrote “I’m not ugly, but I’m not drop dead gorgeous, either. I should probably lose about 20 pounds.” Congratulations :
1)You are honest.
2)You are not stuck up/
3)You are intelligent and can hold someones interest in meaningful engaging conversation
4)You have opinions and are not bashful about expressing them
5)you have a vibrant personality, your personal magnetism draws people to you.
6) you are passionate about everything
7)you care about other people
8)I venture to say that if by your own account ,you are not drop dead ,traffic stopping gorgeous you are most definitely (it is mandatory that you choose one of the following descriptions:
1) “cute”
2)”attractive”
3)pretty
4)a fine lookin’ woman
5)hubba hubba!
You also wrote:
“When you were younger, what did you look for? I know you’re a nice guy. And I do wish you were my father. You have this quality that makes it easy to confide in you. Zealot picked up on it right away. Personally, I would like to meet both of you”
In my post #334 I wrote:
Big Jake Says:
September 8th, 2006 at 12:30 pm
lovesamerica : you are alot like my wife. You’ve got it all together just like she did at 23. That’s when we got married .That was 27 years ago. Make sure you wait for the right guy . You deserve the best.
I was looking for someone with your qualities
and I found her when I met my wife.
You are special, zealot wrote: “You are definitely somebody’s prize”
We all see how special you really are ,We have to get you to see it too! Hang in there.
October 6, 2006 at 12:09 pm
Page 46 – Waiting On God
ISAIAH 60:22b — WHEN GOD IS READY, HE MOVES STRONGLY & SWIFTLY
WE NEED TO LEARN TO WAIT ON GOD, AND LEARN THAT:
- GOD IS NOT IN A HURRY !!! (HE WANTS IT DONE RIGHT, NOT QUICKLY)
- GOD’S TIMING AND HIS WAYS ARE NOT THE SAME AS OURS
(ISAIAH 55:8-9)(ACTS 1:7)(II PETER 3:8)(PSALM 75:2)
- GOD WANTS TO STRENGTHEN OUR FAITH
- INSTANT ANSWERS DO NOT MATURE US
- GOD WANTS TO MAKE US COMPLETE & WHOLE (JAMES 1:2-4; GAL. 5:22-23)
- WAITING DURING TRIALS IS GOOD TRAINING : (HEBREWS 12) (MAL. 3:3)
(IT BUILDS CHARACTER & BUILDS OUR HOPE) (ROM. 5:3) (ISAIAH 49:23)
- GOD WANTS TO TRANSFORM US TO BE LIKE JESUS (ROM. 8:29; 2 COR.3:18)
- WE NEED TO LEARN SUBMISSION (JAMES 4:6-8,10) (ISAIAH 1:19,20)
God’s Spiritual Goals For You & God’s Training
God’s Gift of Brokeness
- GOD WANTS US TO BE ONE WITH HIM AND INTIMATE WITH HIM
– “SPIRITUAL CONFUSION” – OSWALD CHAMBERS
– “GETTING INTO GOD’S STRIDE” – OSWALD CHAMBERS
http://www.intimacywithgod.com/page46.html
WAITING ON GOD MEANS:
– TRUSTING IN HIM
– RESTING IN HIM (MATTHEW 11:28-30)
– HOPING IN HIM (ISAIAH 49:23)
– WAITING WITH HIM (HEBREWS 13:5,6)
– SEEKING HIM AND HIS WILL (HEBREWS 11:6)
– GETTING RIGHT WITH HIM
– SUBMITTING TO HIM (PSALM 16:8-11) (ISAIAH 66:2-4)
October 6, 2006 at 1:24 pm
Big Jake, thanks for the insight into God’s word. I feel very humbled right now and ashamed because I know that sex is supposed to be saved for marriage, and I’m a failure at that one. I’m not ready to live like a monk. I care a lot about Amy. I know she’s waiting for me to tell her I love her and I know things would heat up if I did. I’m not going to use that to get what I want. If I ever tell her that I will mean it and I’ll be ready to make a commitment to her. Selfish as it may sound, I do want everything else. And I have been very patient and I’ve walked away a few times when I know she would’ve. I’ve kicked myself in that ass for it, too, because I’d probably be having some great sex right now. I’m sure I sound like a jerk. I don’t like casual sex, it’s always better when you care about the person and I really do care about her. I didn’t see her last night. I took my son on a motorcycle ride with me and we ended up at Caroline’s grave. He asked me if I like Amy better than his Mom. I grabbed that kid right there and hugged him as hard as I could and I told him no one would ever take the place of his mother. That she was in part of my heart that was just hers. I get messed up in my thinking sometimes so I need you and DJ to set me straight. And DJ, tht slut thing, you didn’t say anything wrong. It’s just been on my mind a lot and I don’t want to end up hurting her.
October 6, 2006 at 4:10 pm
Big Jake, you are such a nice man. In response to your post 469, I have to say I’m probably #1. Just cute. I even feel funny saying that because I work with so many girls and I think most of them are prettier than me. I let alot of my friends here read some of the posts and I told you once before that we’re all in love with Zach and we’d all like to beat up Amy. But, we’ve been talking and we have a question. You and that DJ are pretty neat guys, too. It’s just that you’re older than we are. But do guys really talk to each other and to women like you do on here? You guys are so open and we’d all like the guys we know to be like you three, but they’re not. It makes us wonder if Zealot talks to Amy the way he does on here. He sounds like a Lifetime movie. We’re all waiting to see what’s going to happen next with him. And some of us thought we’d like help him out in the sex department….JUST KIDDING!! (well, sort of kidding) Seriously, if I could find someone that talked with me like you guys I’d think I got the prize. I love all three you. I know Zealot thinks of you as a brother so I don’t want to think of you as my father because that would make me his sister and that’s just plain gross, so I’m naming you as my Guardian. DJ…you can be my Uncle. Cause you’re a really smart guy. Zealot, well, he’s still my dream man but you two would be in the running if you were younger and didn’t have wives. I haven’t shared this website with my friends because I don’t want them getting on here and seeing me bare my soul. I’m alot like Zealot that way because it’s a part of you you can reveal and yet keep secret at the same time. Some guy that works in one of the other offices asked me out for dinner tonight and I think I’ll go. He’s not really my type but he’s nice. He’s small, and that kind of turns me off. I think I could probably beat him up but he’s so mannerly and always opens doors for us girls and never swears in front of us, so I think he’s probably an okay guy. I just wish he was HOT. I wish he was Zach is what I wish. I better get off of that because I sound like a nut. But thank you, Big Jake, and dthank you DJ. You guys are awesome men, and I would really miss you if you quit writing.
October 6, 2006 at 4:21 pm
Big Jake, I screwed up. If you were my father and Zealot was your brother he’d be my Uncle. That’s still gross. Wish me luck on this date tonight because I’m really not all that enthused about it.
October 6, 2006 at 7:15 pm
Big Jake, DJ, Zealot, me again, we’ve been talking. Please humor us. We have a bet and I want to win it. We want an idea what you all look like.
Zealot. 1. We know you’re over 6′, so,dark hair, dark eyes, and I’m positive you smell great. Nice personality. 2. Blonde hair, blue eyes, great teeth. Awesome kisser, and I bet you look great in jeans and leather. 3. Dark hair, blue eyes, nice body, good tan. 4. Blonde/brown hair, brown eyes, smell good, nice tan, great ass. Who the hell cares about his personality?
DJ: 1.Tall, dark, thin, looks like a college professor. Probably pretty cute. 2.Short, pot gut,maybe one hair on his head. (Trust me, that’s not mine!) 3. Very sophisticated looking. (Whatever that means) Probably treats you like gold. Good sense of humor. Could advise the others on how to treat a woman. 4. Gray hair, tall, total gentlemen, probably smokes a pipe and doesn’t own jeans, too classy for them.
Big Jake: 1. Tall, dark, sweet and cuddly. 2. Tall, distinguished looking, square jaw, a little chubby, no hair 3. Short, gray hair, nice soft eyes, sweet smile. 4. Tall, a little fat, never wears jeans, nice eyes. Would make you feel like a million bucks no matter what you were like.
C’mon, have a little fun. Let us know.
Thanks
October 6, 2006 at 11:29 pm
lovesamerica:
OK I’ll give it a shot
Black hair starting to grey, hazel eyes
5′9″
I go to the Gym 2-3 times /wk
Need to drop 25-30 lbs
Shy but friendly,nice smile and disposition
I’ve been told I look most like Fernando Valenzuela pitcher for the L.A. Dodgers in the late 1980’s to 1990’s,and Victor Mature, Actor(The Robe,Demetrius and the Gladiators)
October 7, 2006 at 12:53 pm
lovesamerica: I wasn’t going to do this but I saw that Big Jake did, so I’ll join in. I’m 6′3″ 205lbs. Everyone tells me I look like Keanu Reeves. Not really. We got together with my sister and her husband a couple of weeks ago and watched some movie about a glass house and Reeves was in it and Amy and my sister got all drooly over him. Personally, I think he looks kind of dainty, but he sure trips their triggers. I don’t know what they see and it was a sleeper of a movie to boot. They loved in got a teary. I got teary because it wasn’t ending quick enough. Anyway, if you saw me you’d probably think I was italian but I’m not. My Dad is polish and my Mom is native american. So I do have dark hair and my eyes are blue and I always look like I have a tan because it’s my natural skin color. The eyes are the only thing I got from Dad. I had to laugh when you mentioned teeth because my Dad is a dentist so my sister and I have good teeth. My dad and I have always had a strained relationship. My career choice has always been a major diappointment for him. He wanted me to go into dentistry and he always reminds me that I could’ve made a lot more money and I had a better life than I do. He’s gotten better over the years but we’re nothing alike. He’s calm and dignified and I was a rebel and I’ve always had a quick temper. I’ve gotten better as I’ve gotten older. He likes to golf, I always wanted to hunt and fish and he would never take me. It must be the indian blood in me. I always wanted to be outdoors. I like being in the woods. My first name is really Kevin and my middle is Zachary, but somehow when I was little everyone called me Zach and it just stuck. You girls make me laugh. You must sit around your office and share your fantasy’s. If you knew me, you’d probably change your minds in a quick hurry. And Jake, I hope some of the last things I’ve posted haven’t made you think less of me as a man. I don’t have any brothers and like I said, I can’t talk to my dad about anything so what you say I take to heart.
October 7, 2006 at 3:39 pm
lovesamerica,Big Jake & Zealot. I have been reading you posts with interest. Zealot, you do sound very handsome, almost like a heartthrob. However, Big Jake, I am very happily married but if you look anything like Victor Mature my heart is yours. I have The Robe on tape and I usually watch it every Easter. You, Big Jake, are smart, sensitive, and sound like a wonderful husband and father. Zealot, don’t let something special get away from you because you’re young, passionate and eager. Good women, as well as good men, are rare these days.